Lack of sweep against spin allowed inexperienced Nz bowlers to get away - Ashwin

[vvvslaxman]

 

[BacktoCricaddict]

This problem is as old as Indian cricket itself. We can be swept, but cannot sweep.

[Chaos]

6 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

lmao ask shubmani and fisherman and iyeriii  to sweep 

[vvvslaxman]

5 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

This problem is as old as Indian cricket itself. We can be swept, but cannot sweep.

 

He gave the stat.  India attempt to sweep was 1% where NZ attempt to sweep was 15%. We blame Kuldeep. But we forget to appreciate how they use their feet to disturb his length. Reverse sweep 4. Then down the ground 6. But when this noob spinner who hardly turned bowled we were crease bound tuk tuking. Any team in the world would take Kuldeep over that debutant spinner. But he had better numbers. We immediately say XXX outbowled our spinners. In reality it is their batsmen outbatted us. Kuldeep is a pedigree spinner. When they are prepared to take him on you should take on noob spinners.

[rkt.india]

4 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

He gave the stat.  India attempt to sweep was 1% where NZ attempt to sweep was 15%. We blame Kuldeep. But we forget to appreciate how they use their feet to disturb his length. Reverse sweep 4. Then down the ground 6. But when this noob spinner who hardly turned bowled we were crease bound tuk tuking. Any team in the world would take Kuldeep over that debutant spinner. But he had better numbers. We immediately say XXX outbowled our spinners. In reality it is their batsmen outbatted us. Kuldeep is a pedigree spinner. When they are prepared to take him on you should take on noob spinners.

Kuldeep isn't accurate, slow that's the problem. Can't sweep accurate bowlers who target the stumps that easily. 

[vvvslaxman]

32 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Kuldeep isn't accurate, slow that's the problem. Can't sweep accurate bowlers who target the stumps that easily. 

No. He was forced to bowl inaccurately. HE is world no.3 ranked bowler. He is world class bowler. But Indian batsmen could not disturb the length of the rookie spinner. Mitchell coming down the wicket against kuldeep is part of it.

[Gollum]

Jaiswal has a good sweep shot, one more reason to back him. 

[Lone Wolf]

Indians are extremely poor players of spin.. time to accept this fact rather than blaming our own spinners.

[deepdynamo]

Rohit Sweeps ( but doesn't last long)
Gill doesn't

Kohli doesn't
Iyer doesn't ( only play slog sweep)
KL doesn't
Pandya doesn't

 

Thats our top 6. But luckily the next world cup in SA where spinners imapct would be minimal.

[Gollum]

Made this thread 5+ years ago

 

 

[rkt.india]

6 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

No. He was forced to bowl inaccurately. HE is world no.3 ranked bowler. He is world class bowler. But Indian batsmen could not disturb the length of the rookie spinner. Mitchell coming down the wicket against kuldeep is part of it.

Never rated kuldeep very highly 

[putrevus]

Historically Indian batsman don't play sweep shot, Sunil, Sachin, VVS you name them, no one had sweep shot.

 

Gooch swept his way to finals in 1987 world cup.But Indians were unable to repeat against their spinners and lost wickets to their spinners and match.

 

So it is not a new thing.That did not stop India from being very good in whiteball cricket.You need to find other ways to attack their spinners. 

 

 

 

Indian women do play sweep shot, Harmanpreet plays sweep very well.

 

Edited January 16 by putrevus

[putrevus]

7 hours ago, rkt.india said:

Kuldeep isn't accurate, slow that's the problem. Can't sweep accurate bowlers who target the stumps that easily. 

I completely agree Kuldeep problems being slow and inaccurate.Jadeja is accurate , he also gets swept a lot.

 

Indian spinners also have to come up with solutions against sweep shot. Mitchell has scored runs at will using swwep shot.

Edited January 16 by putrevus

[vvvslaxman]

1 hour ago, rkt.india said:

Never rated kuldeep very highly 

 He has one of the best ER/SR/Avge combo post two new ball era.  Indian batsmen forgot the art of coming down the wicket.  Indians traditionally lack sweep shot. Heck even Sidhu, Azharuddin were not swepers. But they used to come down the wicket all of them. This  unit doesn't do either of that.

[Gollum]

1 hour ago, putrevus said:

Historically Indian batsman don't play sweep shot, Sunil, Sachin, VVS you name them, no one had sweep shot.

 

Gooch swept his way to finals in 1987 world cup.But Indians were unable to repeat against their spinners and lost wickets to their spinners and match.

 

So it is not a new thing.That did not stop India from being very good in whiteball cricket.You need to find other ways to attack their spinners. 

 

 

 

Indian women do play sweep shot, Harmanpreet plays sweep very well.

 

Sachin played 2-3 different types of sweep. His fine sweeps against Warne in 2001 series were beautiful. This after his slog sweep assault in 1998 BGT.

 

Haven't seen a better executor of this kind of sweep where his bat would come almost vertically and hit the ball upar se instead of horizontally, 

 

 

Edited January 16 by Gollum

[putrevus]

18 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Sachin played 2-3 different types of sweep. His fine sweeps against Warne in 2001 series were beautiful. This after his slog sweep assault in 1998 BGT.

 

Haven't seen a better executor of this kind of sweep where his bat would come almost vertically and hit the ball upar se instead of horizontally, 

 

 

Slog sweep lot of Indian players play that shot. Sachin had paddle sweep . Sachin also was getting stuck against offspinners and left arm spinner due to lack of sweep shot square of the wicket.

 

Guys like Giles and Harris were tucking him even bowling over the wicket.No Sachin did not have sweep shot square of the wicket.Nor did he have reverse sweep.

 

 

His famous stumped in 1996 against Jayasurya would have been perfect ball for sweep square of the wicket.

 

Edited January 16 by putrevus

[G_B_]

7 hours ago, Lone Wolf said:

Indians are extremely poor players of spin.. time to accept this fact rather than blaming our own spinners.

This.

 

Seem to have lost the art.

[vvvslaxman]

7 hours ago, Lone Wolf said:

Indians are extremely poor players of spin.. time to accept this fact rather than blaming our own spinners.

There is no concept of nimble footing anymore. Kambli, Tendulkar though bein shorter in stature had amazing use of feet. As recently as Mayank Agarwal was ecellent against spin with use of feet

[putrevus]

Sweep is not the only shot needed to play against spinners.Some wickets which are low and slow like Rajkot, you get stuck and wickets falling at wrong time.

 

I would not lose sleep over not having sweep shot , they did more than alright against the same NZ spinners in first odi.

 

I would worry more about lack of wickets by Indian spinners and bowlers in general.

 

Sweep shot is not natural for Indian batsmen growing up on these wickets with uneven bounce, they are asked more to use  the depth of crease and using their feet. I don't know if this has changed recent years.

 

Even newer guys like Gill don't play sweep shot. 

Edited January 16 by putrevus

[Lone Wolf]

12 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

There is no concept of nimble footing anymore. Kambli, Tendulkar though bein shorter in stature had amazing use of feet. As recently as Mayank Agarwal was ecellent against spin with use of feet

Folks like Misbah used to sweep easily.  Misbah even in his 40's used to employ paddle sweep.

Current lot is simply too limited in their skill set.

Apart from Rohit none of these guys used sweep forget about slog sweep.

Abhishek doesn't sweep but his slog sweep is effective.

Jaiswal also is in Rohit category