Cheteswar Pujara/Rohit Sharma/Dhawan - who is best tailender outside Asia

[Lannister]

He will be our weak link in the batting and we don't have a suitable back-up option for him. Just great. 

[chewy]

His last county stint was excellent 

so probably a bad patch

but also playing for Nottinghamshire who play at Trent bridge, an excellent pitch for quicks

[Texan]

2 minutes ago, Lannister said:

He will be our weak link in the batting and we don't have a suitable back-up option for him. Just great. 

Why? Who have we tried in recent times that has failed to say that we don't have options?

[Texan]

Just now, chewy said:

His last county stint was excellent 

so probably a bad patch

but also playing for Nottinghamshire who play at Trent bridge, an excellent pitch for quicks

Not exactly right. He played only a few matches, got 1unbeaten hundred and failed in other innings. 

[Texan]

Adding on to what I mentioned on separating home vs away teams, we already change bowling combinations based on conditions. Playing Bhuv only in seaming conditions, spinner/pace bowler mix based on pitch, etc. 

 

So the concept is used, but is applied only to bowlers so far. It needs to be extended to batsmen too. 

[vvvslaxman]

He is trying. But something is not working out for him. Any idea about what kind of balls he frequently gets out to? OVerseas i mean. it cannot be a coincidence.

[sarcastic]

20 minutes ago, Texan said:

Not exactly right. He played only a few matches, got 1unbeaten hundred and failed in other innings. 

If we remove that one unbeaten innings, his average is < 30 (IIRC). That unbeaten 100+ is also scored in a low pressure situation, i.e. when the team is already doing very well and is in good lead over the opposition. 

[wanted_desi]

57 minutes ago, Texan said:

Adding on to what I mentioned on separating home vs away teams, we already change bowling combinations based on conditions. Playing Bhuv only in seaming conditions, spinner/pace bowler mix based on pitch, etc. 

 

So the concept is used, but is applied only to bowlers so far. It needs to be extended to batsmen too. 

If Pujara isn't able to get going after few test matches, it is something that should be looked into. We have long overseas tours. 

[Lannister]

2 hours ago, Texan said:

Why? Who have we tried in recent times that has failed to say that we don't have options?

Its tough to expect anything from them if their debut match is in overseas conditions. 

[Vijy]

It's very doubtful if he can do well in Eng, NZ and SA. Oz may be easier but he doesn't play Lyon well abroad.

[Texan]

10 hours ago, Lannister said:

Its tough to expect anything from them if their debut match is in overseas conditions. 

Rahane practically made his debut in successive away tours and did spectacularly well after a nightmarish first Test in India. We have players in the wings who have gone on A tours to different countries also. 

[Lannister]

1 hour ago, Texan said:

Rahane practically made his debut in successive away tours and did spectacularly well after a nightmarish first Test in India. We have players in the wings who have gone on A tours to different countries also. 

Rahane is a different case in Test Cricket as he's a champion bat. Do we even have someone matching his skillsets? I'd be more than happy if we get one more player like him in our batting unit. 

[wanted_desi]

There should be a back up #3 batsman if he fails.

[speedster]

16 hours ago, Vijy said:

It's very doubtful if he can do well in Eng, NZ and SA. Oz may be easier but he doesn't play Lyon well abroad.

Why is SA doubtful,  he did well there last time and SA team was better then.  Agree about England and maybe NZ.  I believe he will be fine in Australia because even if he has some weakness against Lyon (not sure if what you are alluding to is technical or some other aspect that you may have noticed)  he is capable of getting through a bad spell and then capitalise. 

[mishra]

Lol at thos doubting Pujara and his credential.

On 9/29/2017 at 4:16 PM, Tibarn said:

He has a poor average overseas, but he does play a lot of balls when he bats. 

 

Career summary

Grouping	Span	Mat	Inns	NO	Runs	HS	Ave	BF	SR	100	50	0	4s	6s
in Australia	2014-2014	3	6	0	201	73	33.50	471	42.67	0	1	0	26	0
in England	2014-2014	5	10	0	222	55	22.20	510	43.52	0	1	1	32	0
in India	2010-2017	30	50	6	2797	206*	63.56	5537	50.51	9	12	1	334	7
in New Zealand	2014-2014	2	4	0	60	23	15.00	183	32.78	0	0	0	6	1
in South Africa	2010-2013	4	7	0	311	153	44.42	715	43.49	1	1	0	40	0
in Sri Lanka	2015-2017	4	6	1	454	153	90.80	856	53.03	3	0	1	40	1
in West Indies	2016-2016	3	2	0	62	46	31.00	226	27.43	0	0	0	4	0

 

Average balls faced in each country:

Aus: 79

Eng: 51

NZ: 46 

SA:  102

 

By contrast Kohli averages only 29 balls faced in England...

I think this implies that although he doesn't score, he isn't being blown away by the bowling. It seems to me that he just doesn't have the scoring shots to rotate strike, so he gets bogged down at one end and the bowlers eventually work him out because of that. 

 

I think people have short memory. The series which probably is responsible for Pujara as a weaklink, People need to check scorecard too. Allmost everytime he walked in there was a carnage in progression. Every game our openers had failed to see off new ball.

 

Quote

Match 1

=============

India batted well

41.1 excitement! There is indeed an invisible leopard on the field now! No one saw it but Pujara probably. He cuts this innocuous short and wide one straight to Stokes at point, who fumbles it the first time before diving to his left to catch the ricochet off his chest. Pujara can't believe what he has done. Lead is 101 140/3

Pujara 38

31.2 whoa!! That is an awesome catch and an awesome trap! Ian Bell you beauty, he takes a screamer at silly mid-on, diving full length to his right to pluck a one-hander! It held on to the wicket a bit and Pujara pushed it in the air tentatively. Super strike just after lunch. 106/2

Pujara 55

==============

Match 2 India batted decent

==========

41.5 a beauty! This one nips back again and there's no pad in the way this time. On a full length, Pujara getting forward again, the ball jags off the seam and zips between the inside edge into middle stump. Delight for Stokes. 113/4

43.3 Plunkett has got the big one, he bowls one back of a length and outside off, Pujara reaches out to a ball he perhaps could have left alone, slight movement away, nicks through to the keeper, like in the first innings Pujara spends plenty of time in the middle without going on to make a big score, very unlike him 118/2

(Rest bats fall like pins)

 

==========

Match 3 India Crumbled

==========

23.2 dug in, Pujara tries to sway back... but can't get his hands out of the way! He's tickled it through to Buttler! Another neither-nor score for Che Pujara, the revolution will not happen today... The ball came back at him off the pitch as he took evasive action, brushed the gloves and straight into Buttler's for the first time in Test cricket 56/2
12.2 Mooeeeeeen! he is all over India in this Test. Terrific catch at first slip by Jordan, that came at him quite quickly and he had to snap a low catch to his right. Drew Pujara forward but there wasn't as much turn as he expected. Genuine outside edge and England offer a tutorial for India's slip fielders. Stay low, stay mobile and pull off blinders 29/2

==========

Match 4 India Crumbled

==========

5.1 drawn into playing, superb take by Jordan diving to his right - India are four down and still in single figures! Broad has his second, thanks to a blinder from Jordan, Pujara might have though he managed to keep the edge down but he's ruefully heading off, joining the procession 8/4

21.1 given him. full length, bit of offspin, big stride from Pujara, who's disappointed as he walks off. It looked pretty straight, but he did get a big stride in. Had to be some doubt, but could well be clipping. Ball definitely turned. If only India could have got a decent first-innings score. As I thought, with such a big stride, ball turning, replays show the ball missing the leg stump and going over 53/3

==========

Match 5 India Crumbled

==========

5.6 his misery ends and it was quite tough to watch really. The stumps are rattled, but they are checking on the no-ball. Almost half his boot is behind the mark. Pujara is absolutely shocked. The bat was slow in coming down, there was enough gap between it and the pad to sneak through. Clips the top flap, then his arm and timber! 10/2

12.5 and another! One closer to Botham. That. Was. A. Ripper. He's nervous about the one coming in, this one holds its line outside off, Pujara trying to get forward but can only get a thin edge to the keeper. 30/3

 

So I am going t

[MCcricket]

I think he is a class bat and can perform anywhere, he has temperament and technique, this exposure will help him , one thing he needs to avoid is getting into a shell, and inward movement he needs to cover better.

[mishra]

23 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

He is trying. But something is not working out for him. Any idea about what kind of balls he frequently gets out to? OVerseas i mean. it cannot be a coincidence.

Against England, He was unsure about his off stump i.e. how much the ball will swing/moove in.

[mancalledsting]

He has now had at least two spells in the County Game, how many other current Indian batsmen can say that? He is also a world beater in Home Conditions. Therefore on the balance of probability, he should be backed for another round of overseas tours. 

[mishra]

4 minutes ago, mancalledsting said:

He has now had at least two spells in the County Game, how many other current Indian batsmen can say that? He is also a world beater in Home Conditions. Therefore on the balance of probability, he should be backed for another round of overseas tours. 

He is our wall in testing condition. He fails, everyone fails. the day our openers start surviving first 20 overs, Pujara will become beast in English conditions too

[Vijy]

On 10/2/2017 at 5:54 AM, speedster said:

Why is SA doubtful,  he did well there last time and SA team was better then.  Agree about England and maybe NZ.  I believe he will be fine in Australia because even if he has some weakness against Lyon (not sure if what you are alluding to is technical or some other aspect that you may have noticed)  he is capable of getting through a bad spell and then capitalise. 

I'm doubtful about SA because I expect tracks to be spicier this time (revenge for them after previous series on spin tracks).