Facts versus fiction, stats don't lie, doodh ka doodh

[Ultimate_Game]

On 2017-5-14 at 7:17 AM, Khota said:

I am a Dhoni fan too but the reality is he is done.

There are 3 wicketkeepes who are better than him in current form.

Dhoni will fail this CT.

He will cause India not to advance to the next stage.

I agree with you Dhoni's on his last legs and if CT had been a T20 tourney he shouldn't have been in the team. But in odis there are no better options. Pant is good for T20s where he can score a quick 30 but in odis he isn't tested, especially when he has to keep wkts and play as a batsman as well. IMO selectors messed up by not having Pant in the squad and giving him games against England at home. That would've been the best way to see if he can handle the dual role as a keeper-batsman in odis. The other wkt keepers (Pappu Patel, Uthappa etc.) are not real wkt keepers and drop catches and miss stumpings every other game so can't be played as wkt keepers. Pant is the only feasible choice and he should take over in T20s immediately and should be part of the Indian team so he's the wkt keeper by the time WC rolls in 2019.

[Ultimate_Game]

3 minutes ago, iam_rahul said:

Yes. Even a fat raina is still a better fielder than many. He is the ultimate team man. Never complains. Never plays for his own score. We are wasting him. 

Couldn't agree more. If he had been just a wee bit selfish his average would be touching 40. There are so many times you see him go after the bowling right from the first ball and fall doing so. He's one guy who doesn't care about stats, records or anything else and does everything the team needs. Such players are very hard to find and he should've been given a longer rope... definitely longer than what Yuvraj and Rahane are getting in shorter formats.

 

Even now if the team needs to score 10 runs an over at the death and a new batsman comes to the increase, as an Indian fan I would like Raina to come in coz I know he's one of the very few batsmen we have who can go from ball one. Very harshly treated IMO.

[mishra]

And who is responsible for dropping Raina?

[CG]

And who is responsible for dropping Raina?

Raina's Form?

[Ultimate_Game]

1 hour ago, mishra said:

And who is responsible for dropping Raina?

Selectors who think likes of Rahane are more valuable than Raina in shorter formats  

[mishra]

1 hour ago, CG said:

Raina's Form?

Really. Did you chkd the form of Yuvi and Co? Or seperate benchmarks?

[mishra]

13 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

Selectors who think likes of Rahane are more valuable than Raina in shorter formats  

So Captain has no input.

[Ultimate_Game]

6 minutes ago, mishra said:

So Captain has no input.

I heard Kohli wanted the "vice kaptaan" too but IMO in this case the selectors should've put the foot down and shown Kohli Rahane's stats over the years.

[Texan]

2 hours ago, CG said:

Raina's Form?

Raina's form was pretty good in the IPL and as many have stated, he is an ultimate team man. Most of our batsmen that we have picked for CT are in wretched form. Rahane, Dhoni, Rohit have all struggled for form. Yuvraj isn't exactly in top form either and is a bit old right now and has had fitness issues. Jadeja can't use the long handle. 

 

Overall, we should have gone for newer players who are striking well. Keeping Grandfathers XI who are not even playing well doesn't augur well. 

[jusarrived]

4 hours ago, iam_rahul said:

Fiction - bhuvi is a great odi bowler

Fact he sucks- avgs 39 Lmao. IPL hero. 

 

Fiction - raina is not a good player. 

Fact- anyone who avrgs 35 with strike rate of 90+ is invaluable to the team. 

you dont have to look at stats to say that Raina is one of the best ODI players we have produced and its a joke that he cannot make this team which is struggling to find one decent finisher . 

[Khota]

19 hours ago, jusarrived said:

you dont have to look at stats to say that Raina is one of the best ODI players we have produced and its a joke that he cannot make this team which is struggling to find one decent finisher . 

Fully agree. I will fire any selector for having Yuvraj and Rahane over Raina. I dont know which game they are watching.

[sandeep]

20 hours ago, Texan said:

Raina's form was pretty good in the IPL and as many have stated, he is an ultimate team man. Most of our batsmen that we have picked for CT are in wretched form. Rahane, Dhoni, Rohit have all struggled for form. Yuvraj isn't exactly in top form either and is a bit old right now and has had fitness issues. Jadeja can't use the long handle. 

 

Overall, we should have gone for newer players who are striking well. Keeping Grandfathers XI who are not even playing well doesn't augur well. 

Jadhav is supposed to be the Raina replacement.  Only problem?  Raina is a wily part-timer who can be trusted to bowl a few overs in crunchtime, while Jadhav just started bowling last year.  Tummy jokes aside, Raina's fielding still is >>> Jadhav's.   And on the batting front, the most you can say in Jadhav's favor is that its too close to call.   

 

Problem for Raina is that the selectors needed to limit how many old-timers they picked in the team - and MS and Yuvi are the bigger 'names' and harder to drop.   

[Shunya]

27 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Jadhav is supposed to be the Raina replacement.  Only problem?  Raina is a wily part-timer who can be trusted to bowl a few overs in crunchtime, while Jadhav just started bowling last year.  Tummy jokes aside, Raina's fielding still is >>> Jadhav's.   And on the batting front, the most you can say in Jadhav's favor is that its too close to call.   

 

Problem for Raina is that the selectors needed to limit how many old-timers they picked in the team - and MS and Yuvi are the bigger 'names' and harder to drop.   

Jadhav is actually older than Raina.

[Pollack]

Rahane has been selected because there is not a single player in the squad who plays good in swing conditions. Rohit, Dhawan, Kohli, Yuvraj all have problems when there is movement. Now Not saying Rahane's selection is correct but he is not selected because they feel he is a better ODI player or better than Raina etc. There is a news report which clerly hints towards this.ODIs all over the world are played on flat pitches. True. But is it a guarantee.If you don't get such pitches in CT, What will you do? Just have a look at that squad. Do you feel confident of this batting lineup under swing friendly conditions? You need to select squad keeping everything in mind while touring. In my opinion Rahane should have been thrown out much earlier and test some other players who have a much tighter technique and can also be decent in stroke making. Rahul will surely be missed.

 

[sandeep]

9 minutes ago, Shunya said:

Jadhav is actually older than Raina.

But Raina is stale bhel.   Fans want new names, new faces.   What has stale bhel done for us lately?  Those crucial 30s and 40s that Raina chips in with selflessly may be invaluable to the team, but they aren't memorable enough.    Plus the fat jokes are so easy to make.  Plus he looks funny jumping around on the short ball.   Plus, he's lazy now because some no-name coach said so in a quest for his 5 minutes of fame.   So what if Raina just racked up another effective IPL season with the bat.   Doesn't count.  Nitish Rana should play champions trophy instead.   We want the youngsta beauties.  the new names, the tattoos and the cool kids.   And if they don't click right away, chuck them for the next fashionable name that is cresting the hype machine.  

[Ankit_sharma03]

On 5/17/2017 at 6:34 PM, Pollack said:

Rahane has been selected because there is not a single player in the squad who plays good in swing conditions. Rohit, Dhawan, Kohli, Yuvraj all have problems when there is movement. Now Not saying Rahane's selection is correct but he is not selected because they feel he is a better ODI player or better than Raina etc. There is a news report which clerly hints towards this.ODIs all over the world are played on flat pitches. True. But is it a guarantee.If you don't get such pitches in CT, What will you do? Just have a look at that squad. Do you feel confident of this batting lineup under swing friendly conditions? You need to select squad keeping everything in mind while touring. In my opinion Rahane should have been thrown out much earlier and test some other players who have a much tighter technique and can also be decent in stroke making. Rahul will surely be missed.

 

Rahane has struggled agaisnt swing himself in loi

Aamir over in t20 asia cup

His last odi against eng

Series in zimb

Nz series

How many times left hander have swung the ball back to him n got him out

 

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

Mytha acc to me

 

1. Rahane is the best batsman against moving ball in loi......

2. Bhuvi is the best loi bowler and a must as he is so accurate. 

3. Bhuvi n pathan lost swing coz they increased their pace

4. Rohit is a gr8 opener. Reality a good opener helped by flat decks all round

5. In fans, gambhir is hard done and dhawan always get selected undeservingly. In reality Dhawan has a better record.

 

[Pollack]

9 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

Rahane has struggled agaisnt swing himself in loi

Aamir over in t20 asia cup

His last odi against eng

Series in zimb

Nz series

How many times left hander have swung the ball back to him n got him out

 

 

It may or may not be true. But according to selectors he is a better player of swing and honestly that is the perception among most fans as well. Also its comparative to other players in the Indian team. Rahane is definitely better than Rohit, Dhawan, Yuvi, dhoni in facing swing conditions. You should understand that I am not selector. All those things said are from selectors point of view. Also posted one article which talked about it. 

Only putting forward the reasons selectors selected Rahane and also quashed any foolish argument that it is due to Mumbai lobby. Now Karthik got selected and not Pant. South lobby? You would say karthik has been performing very good and yet I would keep ignoring it and say no South lobby. This is what was happening here. Even when you show valid reasons people already have made up their mind. Now most of posts in reply to mine are as if I am defending Rahane's inclusion but if only they could think logically and with cool mind what I am saying. I don't care if Rahane is selected or not.

Edited May 20, 2017 by Pollack

[Ankit_sharma03]

2 minutes ago, Pollack said:

It may or may not be true. But according to selectors he is a better player of swing and honestly that is the perception among most fans as well. Also its comparative to other players in the Indian team. Rahane is definitely better than Rohit, Dhawan, Yuvi, dhoni in facing swing conditions. KohliYou should understand that I am not selector. All those things said are from selectors point of view. Also posted one article which talked about it.

Dhoni played that innings where he got his team out from 29/5 to 200+ total and that was damp surface , m yet to see an innings like that from rahane in LOI

Rahane is just better in people mind he has no perfomance to show in LOI 

 

Fair enough i understand that it comes from selectors , not only that but from our captains n coaches to but in reality he has done nothing in LOI in tough conditions 

[Khota]

These selectors are morons. They have no clue. Mr. Goenka is better than these so called selectors as he picked Smith over Dhoni. It just takes common sense. This is a bad team. Bowling is fine.