Is Yuvraj the most polarising cricketer in Indian cricket ?

[kubrickian]

He was a good LOI player but failed in tests. He was technically never good against swing and good quality spin and didnt have the right temperament for tests and hence failed in longer format but was a good batsman in ODIs and match winner on his day because of his hitting ability.

 

He was the major contributor to India's 2011 World Cup along with Zaheer even though you hear Dhoni and Sachin's name lot more and major contributor to 2007 World T20 win even though Dhoni again stole the limelight. He was also responsible for losing World T20 2014 final by playing one of the worst T20 innings I've seen. Most honest fans would say he doesnt deserve a place in the ODI side anymore. He is in the X1 only because of past achievements and connections and because of his desire to lift the World cup again in 2019. 

 

He would still probably rank among top 5 in terms of popularity among general Indian fans behind Sachin, Dhoni, Kohli and Sehwag though some others dont think too highly of him.

[Ankit_sharma03]

4 hours ago, kubrickian said:

He was a good LOI player but failed in tests. He was technically never good against swing and good quality spin and didnt have the right temperament for tests and hence failed in longer format but was a good batsman in ODIs and match winner on his day because of his hitting ability.

 

He was the major contributor to India's 2011 World Cup along with Zaheer even though you hear Dhoni and Sachin's name lot more and major contributor to 2007 World T20 win even though Dhoni again stole the limelight. He was also responsible for losing World T20 2014 final by playing one of the worst T20 innings I've seen. Most honest fans would say he doesnt deserve a place in the ODI side anymore. He is in the X1 only because of past achievements and connections and because of his desire to lift the World cup again in 2019. 

 

He would still probably rank among top 5 in terms of popularity among general Indian fans behind Sachin, Dhoni, Kohli and Sehwag though some others dont think too highly of him.

Yuvraj singh has gotten his due credit and that has made his career last till date 

I dnt blame yuvraj singh for loosing 2014Wc, our mentality of not diff between past n present got us that fate which has also happened in past 

 

At his peek for me he was more essential to our Odi team then anyone , unfortunately his top yrs werent to many . His dip started even before the tragedy of cancer

 

Not having a good test career as compare to his contemporary like sehwag, bhajji , zaheer or even gambhir n dhoni will always affect his credentials  

 

Dhoni again stole the limelight- What ****.....His captaincy was top notch and he got the deserving credit 

Infact if anyone limelight was stolen it was our bowlers in 2007 t20Wc.....RP n Irfan 

 

because of his desire to lift the World cup again in 2019. - thats everyones desire 

3 hours ago, Under_Score said:

He was good in the past, but off late his ego and nervousness are a big problem, that fearless attitude is gone...just bats to keep his place in the team, too damn cautious approach & doesn't look like a fighter anymore...Kohli/Shastri combo might give him more chances, not sure how it's going to end.

I disagree on his fearless attitude n cautious approach thing , i think he lost on his technique front and aging didnt help that either. 

If ull see his clips from start to his peek where he started playing a lot straighter at start, his backlift , bat angle, stable base everything has changed post 2012 . It was at its worst during next 3 yrs.....it got better last year but that wasnt enough 

Edited July 23, 2017 by Ankit_sharma03

[BeautifulGame]

No.Not even close

[Shamim.Miah]

One of my favourite Indian player. Amazing fighter, given so much to India. 

[Khota]

No. There are plenty. Thank god he is not the captain.

[Pollack]

Currently Rohit Sharma is a polarising figure. One can see people defending him to lunacy regarding him as some sort of great talent. On the other hand others just troll him.

 

Dhoni is also polarising on ICF(undoubtedly) as well as outside ICF(to an extent)

[Pollack]

4 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Yuvraj singh has gotten his due credit and that has made his career last till date 

I dnt blame yuvraj singh for loosing 2014Wc, our mentality of not diff between past n present got us that fate which has also happened in past 

 

At his peek for me he was more essential to our Odi team then anyone , unfortunately his top yrs werent to many . His dip started even before the tragedy of cancer

 

Not having a good test career as compare to his contemporary like sehwag, bhajji , zaheer or even gambhir n dhoni will always affect his credentials  

 

Dhoni again stole the limelight- What ****.....His captaincy was top notch and he got the deserving credit 

Infact if anyone limelight was stolen it was our bowlers in 2007 t20Wc.....RP n Irfan 

 

because of his desire to lift the World cup again in 2019. - thats everyones desire 

I disagree on his fearless attitude n cautious approach thing , i think he lost on his technique front and aging didnt help that either. 

If ull see his clips from start to his peek where he started playing a lot straighter at start, his backlift , bat angle, stable base everything has changed post 2012 . It was at its worst during next 3 yrs.....it got better last year but that wasnt enough 

What was so great about Dhoni's captaincy in WC2007.

 

Like bowling Joginder Sharma last over.  Dhoni just got lucky with it.

 

Or CT2013 final against England wherein Ishant bowled  18th over inspite of being crap throughout that match. And guess what even that over was technically poor. Don't believe me? Watch it again. Ishant got lucky wickets which turned the match. It was a classic England choke. Yet again Dhoni got lucky with a bad choice of bowler at crucial stage.

 

 

Edited July 23, 2017 by Pollack

[Ankit_sharma03]

2 minutes ago, Pollack said:

What was so great about Dhoni's captaincy in WC2007.

 

Like bowling Joginder Sharma last over.  Dhoni just got lucky with it.

 

Or CT2013 final against England wherein Ishant bowled second last over inspite of being crap throughout that match. And guess what even that over was technically poor. Don't believe me? Watch it again. Ishant got lucky wickets which turned the match. Yet again Dhoni got lucky with a bad choice of bowler at crucial stage.

 

 

Making right choice at right time, that were most go wrong. It all falls in back seat what u have done in whole game if u turn the game in one over

Fortune favours the brave, i wish kohli was this brave or in ur language lucky 

 

Its very demeaning to put someone achievement down by calling it luck, u cnt do well for so many years on basis of luck. This CT we had better bowling then last why didnt kohli get lucky. 

 

Just becoz u dnt like someone doesnt mean ull put down someone achievement . He saw bhajji's nerves were taking teh better of him and misbah was playing him well so he went with an option of someone who was holding his nerves better. Final, World tournament are all about pressure and holding ur nerves 

[Pollack]

9 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Making right choice at right time, that were most go wrong. It all falls in back seat what u have done in whole game if u turn the game in one over

Fortune favours the brave, i wish kohli was this brave or in ur language lucky 

 

Its very demeaning to put someone achievement down by calling it luck, u cnt do well for so many years on basis of luck. This CT we had better bowling then last why didnt kohli get lucky. 

 

Just becoz u dnt like someone doesnt mean ull put down someone achievement . He saw bhajji's nerves were taking teh better of him and misbah was playing him well so he went with an option of someone who was holding his nerves better. Final, World tournament are all about pressure and holding ur nerves 

When did I put his achievements down? He had made wrong choices at crucial junctures but got away with it. There is definitely luck factor involved at those moments.   

Regarding bhajji. Who says he should have given it to bhajji. Why didn't he managed bowlers so that you are not left with bowler like Joginder Sharma who will lose you matches 9/10 times and yet we won it thanks to Misbah's atrocious shot.Isn't that part of a great 'captaincy'.? 

Nobody is saying he is not a good captain. But there is an attempt to attach some mysterious greatness about his captaincy skills especially strategic skills as if he has some sort of Chanakya nitis on his minds  is not true. He is just a very good captain who is street smart but also relies on instincts. Success of such instincts without much logic or strategy is dependent on luck which is what is emphasised by me.

[jf1gp_1]

56 minutes ago, Pollack said:

What was so great about Dhoni's captaincy in WC2007.

 

Like bowling Joginder Sharma last over.  Dhoni just got lucky with it.

 

Or CT2013 final against England wherein Ishant bowled  18th over inspite of being crap throughout that match. And guess what even that over was technically poor. Don't believe me? Watch it again. Ishant got lucky wickets which turned the match. It was a classic England choke. Yet again Dhoni got lucky with a bad choice of bowler at crucial stage.

 

 

A 27 yr old was ask to debut in CT, scored 114 in final and won it for Pak. Isnt that luck ? Carlos brathwaite in t20 final was luck. 

[Pollack]

46 minutes ago, jf1gp_1 said:

A 27 yr old was ask to debut in CT, scored 114 in final and won it for Pak. Isnt that luck ? Carlos brathwaite in t20 final was luck. 

Captaincy which is mainly a abstract (to audience) parameter is different from batting or bowling. But to answer your question: Carlos Brathwaite's was some clean hitting. He was standing deep inside the crease and Stokes missed yorker every single time. Those hits were no way lucky. 

Pakistan's opener indeed played a lucky innings. But other players played excellen cricket. 

You are missing the point anyway. Intention is not to discredit Dhoni's achivement but to show he is not that great strategically as his fans or bhakts portray him. This is specially in the context of 'great captaincy' being made as an excuse for his failure to contribute as a batsman in big ICC tournament save one inning of WC2011 which I didn't criticise because it was a great innings.

You can see I talked about WC2007 and CT2013. Although as a batsman he wasn't great in CT2013 also. Neither Wc2015. Neither CT2017. Neither numerous t20s world cup. As a batsman he has failed to contribute significantly in big tournaments. And whenever you point this out we are sold stories of Great Strategic genius dhoni's captaincy as his contribution which is already over rated to hide this factor.

[Pollack]

1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

Fortune favours the brave, i wish kohli was this brave or in ur language lucky 

 

 

Well Kohli tried to be brave against Pakistan giving Ashwin over in Asia cup. But he lost. So what you are implying is not true. Not about brave moves. The moves I discussed came off luckily. There are many instances where Kohli didn't get the benefit of fancy phrase:  Fortune favours the brave.

 

[maniac]

2 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Making right choice at right time, that were most go wrong. It all falls in back seat what u have done in whole game if u turn the game in one over

Fortune favours the brave, i wish kohli was this brave or in ur language lucky 

 

Its very demeaning to put someone achievement down by calling it luck, u cnt do well for so many years on basis of luck. This CT we had better bowling then last why didnt kohli get lucky. 

 

Just becoz u dnt like someone doesnt mean ull put down someone achievement . He saw bhajji's nerves were taking teh better of him and misbah was playing him well so he went with an option of someone who was holding his nerves better. Final, World tournament are all about pressure and holding ur nerves 

Lol wut....atleast rest of the fanboys are open about it.

 

in 2007 wt20 Bhajji didn't "want" to bowl the final over.....Sree,RP and Pathan had already bowled out so he had no choice but to give Jogi the ball and pray and trust me god definitely answered his prayers and Misbah clearly screwed it up.

 

In 2011 WC- he flopped in QF and Semis....captaincy was just business as usual.

 

I will never forgive him for the 2011 England tour and his captaincy there.

 

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 hour ago, Pollack said:

Well Kohli tried to be brave against Pakistan giving Ashwin over in Asia cup. But he lost. So what you are implying is not true. Not about brave moves. The moves I discussed came off luckily. There are many instances where Kohli didn't get the benefit of fancy phrase:  Fortune favours the brave.

 

There is diff btw brave n foolishness

Giving afridi a spinner in final over in a small ground.....n its not about 1 call.....i have made a post on kohli being a conservative captain 

1 hour ago, maniac said:

Lol wut....atleast rest of the fanboys are open about it.

 

in 2007 wt20 Bhajji didn't "want" to bowl the final over.....Sree,RP and Pathan had already bowled out so he had no choice but to give Jogi the ball and pray and trust me god definitely answered his prayers and Misbah clearly screwed it up.

 

In 2011 WC- he flopped in QF and Semis....captaincy was just business as usual.

 

I will never forgive him for the 2011 England tour and his captaincy there.

 

 

Easier said then done......those moves which u have described so easily

 

N no one seeked ur forgiveness n in case u want to still go that  way of not forgiving well add whole squad.....

Edited July 23, 2017 by Ankit_sharma03

[maniac]

3 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

There is diff btw brave n foolishness

Giving afridi a spinner in final over in a small ground.....n its not about 1 call.....i have made a post on kohli being a conservative captain 

Easier said then done......those moves which u have described so easily

 

N no one seeked ur forgiveness n in case u want to still go that  way of not forgiving well add whole squad.....

Glad you are out of the closet now and no longer in the guise of being a "neutral" supporter...will add you to the fanboy list

[Ankit_sharma03]

4 minutes ago, maniac said:

Glad you are out of the closet now and no longer in the guise of being a "neutral" supporter...will add you to the fanboy list

Jo karna hai kar......koi farq nhin padta 

I have said whatever i have felt is right...criticized both kohli n dhoni when i felt that way right or wrong . 

All this poking of coming out closet n fan boy doesnt work with me

 

M a fanboy of dhoni, kohli, yuvraj, sachin n to add many but Indian cricket is most important for me when i say something .....

 

Bolna hai bolo 

[Ankit_sharma03]

3 hours ago, Pollack said:

When did I put his achievements down? He had made wrong choices at crucial junctures but got away with it. There is definitely luck factor involved at those moments.   

Regarding bhajji. Who says he should have given it to bhajji. Why didn't he managed bowlers so that you are not left with bowler like Joginder Sharma who will lose you matches 9/10 times and yet we won it thanks to Misbah's atrocious shot.Isn't that part of a great 'captaincy'.? 

Nobody is saying he is not a good captain. But there is an attempt to attach some mysterious greatness about his captaincy skills especially strategic skills as if he has some sort of Chanakya nitis on his minds  is not true. He is just a very good captain who is street smart but also relies on instincts. Success of such instincts without much logic or strategy is dependent on luck which is what is emphasised by me.

India hai......things will be said in hyped way or else how wud it be a headlines

All this chanakya neeti is to much

Yes luck is involved.......no one is denying and thats were his captaincy worked in LOI and didnt work in test cricket

And kohli captaincy works better in Test then LOI till now , since he is a lil old school kind of captain 

 

 

Dhoni was a bloody good odi captain , who was blessed with top players but managing ur resources to its finest deserves credit. 

HE wasnt to much about logic, he went more on the players mental state .......that was also evident in his players selections at times for eg someone like Mishra never enjoyed his confidence and he was never good under pressure to. Acc to me he had a liking for player who holded their nerves better and contributes in many ways to the team. Kohli likes players with flair who may even not add much in other areas. 

At the end of the day its all about what works for a particular person. 

[jf1gp_1]

10 hours ago, Pollack said:

Captaincy which is mainly a abstract (to audience) parameter is different from batting or bowling. But to answer your question: Carlos Brathwaite's was some clean hitting. He was standing deep inside the crease and Stokes missed yorker every single time. Those hits were no way lucky. 

Pakistan's opener indeed played a lucky innings. But other players played excellen cricket. 

You are missing the point anyway. Intention is not to discredit Dhoni's achivement but to show he is not that great strategically as his fans or bhakts portray him. This is specially in the context of 'great captaincy' being made as an excuse for his failure to contribute as a batsman in big ICC tournament save one inning of WC2011 which I didn't criticise because it was a great innings.

You can see I talked about WC2007 and CT2013. Although as a batsman he wasn't great in CT2013 also. Neither Wc2015. Neither CT2017. Neither numerous t20s world cup. As a batsman he has failed to contribute significantly in big tournaments. And whenever you point this out we are sold stories of Great Strategic genius dhoni's captaincy as his contribution which is already over rated to hide this factor.

Using these yardstick I can't think of any Indian captain who was good.

[SK_IH]

no yuvi is certainly not polarising ,opinion regrading him is universal whether it being a great odi cricketer or him being failed test cricketer or him being finished now

[Pollack]

5 hours ago, jf1gp_1 said:

Using these yardstick I can't think of any Indian captain who was good.

Not setting any standards to begin with. Just stating facts. Ganguly, dhoni, kapil were all good captains. Dhoni is best ODI captain for India. But he is no strategic genius (which he is wrongly assumed) nor a visionary.