Riots in Red Fort is similar to US Capitol riots - Liberals were vocal then but quiet now?

[Khota]

49 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

 

You choose the worst for your debate. Choose, MH, Kar or even Gujarat where private buyers compete with APMC like structures and people choose between the two. APMCs/MSP was not implemented as a state policy, in Bihar, as APMC is not a nation-wide federal law, it is administered by regions, crops, land values of the region, hence a state-mandated committee decides the MSP. The min price of some crops in Punjab is half of that in Haryana. This system is totally rigged by states' politics and individuals. Bihar's case is of Law and Order and feudalism, so Yadavism and aarajyakata has been ruling the farming sector. Same with Industrial sector too, read about the sugar mills problem in Bihar. It is a sorry state.

 

 

 

So in Bihar it has not worked. In Maharashtra sugar cane is heavily subsidized. I have lived in Gujrat and that state is by no means an agricultural state. It is a hevily industrialized state and Vadodra is full of petro chemical industry. Punjab is dependent on agriculture and industry is a small fraction. That is not sustainable growth model and hence their income is shrinking. They feel these laws will accelerate their demise.

 

Modi should have shown an alternate path along with these reforms. Trust in our numbers is not an economic policy.

 

58 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

 

 

 

 

These laws will give an opportunity to increase their income, if implemented well. First the Bogeyman politics with rumor and fear mongering has to stop, it is all politically motivated.

 

 

es, the government could have done a better job at communication, but that doesn't give a right to everybody to ask for repealing of laws.  Next Budget will be presented. We can't have people revolting because some changes were not done consulting them. Always, I repeat, always understand the politics behind all protests and riots.

 

 

 

These laws were neither properly debated or vetted. They were forced and that builds no trust ever. Once again there is nothing stopping these private companies to buy products there but they are not doing it. They will move in for a kill.

 

1 hour ago, coffee_rules said:

 

 

 

Sharad Pawar is listed as a farmer in the election affidavit. He was for these farming reforms and wanted reliance to invest in MH. Now, for politics he is against it. These people (Modi, Shah) have experience in governance. If you are not a farmer, you consult experts, form committees, there are panel discussions with farmers before manifestos are formed,, they don't do it blindly, as you are imagining them to do.

 

 

It depends on the next government if they have the numbers. In the present condition and the mood of the nation (as run by Rajdeep Sardesai's India Today poll), people in the nation still trust in BJP. We have to do it as no other choice is better for us, good or bad. 

Modi is a very smart man and a smarter politician. He has played his religious card very well. The attempt from day one was to discredit these people and these farmers were cluless and never understood how smart Modi is. They fell for the trap.

 

They should never have allowed Sidhu there with his anti national antics but I am glad he will be hopefully spend some time in jail to understand what he did was wrong.

 

But getting back to the main issue the economic disparity is stil there. Government has to find a way to help the poor people and find a way for more equtable wealth distribution.

 

Why dont they put it in words what farmers want and that is a gauranteed MSP. If they do that they will go back.

 

But if BJP keeps on playing the bogeyman game of blaming the sikhs only they are doing a disservice to the nation, Lot of farmers are alineated and it is just not sikhs.

 

I would not be surprised if BJP uses this as an excuse to beat the 99% of the farmers who were peaceful.

 

This is a problem that will not go away and will require compromise from everyone. Agriculture minister is just a puppet only.

[rkt.india]

23 minutes ago, Khota said:

So in Bihar it has not worked. In Maharashtra sugar cane is heavily subsidized. I have lived in Gujrat and that state is by no means an agricultural state. It is a hevily industrialized state and Vadodra is full of petro chemical industry. Punjab is dependent on agriculture and industry is a small fraction. That is not sustainable growth model and hence their income is shrinking. They feel these laws will accelerate their demise.

 

Modi should have shown an alternate path along with these reforms. Trust in our numbers is not an economic policy.

 

These laws were neither properly debated or vetted. They were forced and that builds no trust ever. Once again there is nothing stopping these private companies to buy products there but they are not doing it. They will move in for a kill.

 

Modi is a very smart man and a smarter politician. He has played his religious card very well. The attempt from day one was to discredit these people and these farmers were cluless and never understood how smart Modi is. They fell for the trap.

 

They should never have allowed Sidhu there with his anti national antics but I am glad he will be hopefully spend some time in jail to understand what he did was wrong.

 

But getting back to the main issue the economic disparity is stil there. Government has to find a way to help the poor people and find a way for more equtable wealth distribution.

 

Why dont they put it in words what farmers want and that is a gauranteed MSP. If they do that they will go back.

 

But if BJP keeps on playing the bogeyman game of blaming the sikhs only they are doing a disservice to the nation, Lot of farmers are alineated and it is just not sikhs.

 

I would not be surprised if BJP uses this as an excuse to beat the 99% of the farmers who were peaceful.

 

This is a problem that will not go away and will require compromise from everyone. Agriculture minister is just a puppet only.

Two years back, these same kisaan unions were asking for these laws. You can check the Twitter feed of BKU. Even six months back, this same tikait was welcoming the bills. Then the u- turn. So it becomes hard to take these people seriously, not take it as a political protest.

[Khota]

5 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Two years back, these same kisaan unions were asking for these laws. You can check the Twitter feed of BKU. Even six months back, this same tikait was welcoming the bills. Then the u- turn. So it becomes hard to take these people seriously, not take it as a political protest.

And few years back Jaitley and Sushma Swaraj were pleading against the same laws in parliament. So it becomes hard to take BJP seriously.

[rkt.india]

10 minutes ago, Khota said:

And few years back Jaitley and Sushma Swaraj were pleading against the same laws in parliament. So it becomes hard to take BJP seriously.

Jaitley and Sushma both are no more. Congress brought these laws and now they are against. So it's not about messenger but the message. 

Edited January 29, 2021 by rkt.india

[Khota]

2 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Jaitley and Sushma both are no more.

But few years back they were alive and kicking.

Sushma was a great lady jailtley I felt was all political but a likable individual.

[coffee_rules]

2 hours ago, Khota said:

So in Bihar it has not worked. In Maharashtra sugar cane is heavily subsidized. I have lived in Gujrat and that state is by no means an agricultural state. It is a hevily industrialized state and Vadodra is full of petro chemical industry.

 

It has not been tried in Bihar fully with the feudal system present there. . MH produces more than Punjab. The Agro produce of Punjab has gone down despite having MSP over the years compared to the rest of the country. Don’t bring your living experience, it means nothing, just look at data, Gujrat is doing better with Reliance and Amul in Agriculture sector than Punjab.

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

 

Punjab is dependent on agriculture and industry is a small fraction. That is not sustainable growth model and hence their income is shrinking. They feel these laws will accelerate their demise.

 

On the contrary, data shows the income is likely to increase, if the reforms are embraced in Punjab. They can diversify into food processing industry fed by the agro produce. What is stopping Amrinder to grow Punjab in food sector? Saale baithke tamasha dekh rahe hain.

 

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

 

Modi should have shown an alternate path along with these reforms. Trust in our numbers is not an economic policy.

 

Already covered. Modi/BJP and politics, look beyond them and on the policy. Wohi ghissa pita Modi Modi in every post.

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

These laws were neither properly debated or vetted. They were forced and that builds no trust ever.

 

They were in all manifests of all parties with inputs from farmers. The farmers unions were for these reforms. Ab ki hogya? 
 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

Once again there is nothing stopping these private companies to buy products there but they are not doing it. They will move in for a kill.

 

Again with movie plots. Nobody is waiting for the lands to open up to move for the kill.  The point is about Paddy and Rice that P and H is growing is not for private companies’ quality. If they let private companies to buy what PH is growing, they would need better quality product. Mai baap government will buy anything and they APMCs and middlemen want this to continue.

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

 

Modi is a very smart man and a smarter politician. He has played his religious card very well. The attempt from day one was to discredit these people and these farmers were cluless and never understood how smart Modi is. They fell for the trap.

Again with conspiracy theories in your head, will ignore your fantasies.

 

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

 

They should never have allowed Sidhu there with his anti national antics but I am glad he will be hopefully spend some time in jail to understand what he did was wrong.

 

He is a small player, nowhere near the importance given to him.

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

 

But getting back to the main issue the economic disparity is stil there. Government has to find a way to help the poor people and find a way for more equtable wealth distribution.

 

Why dont they put it in words what farmers want and that is a gauranteed MSP. If they do that they will go back.

They were given assurances with writing. The nincompoops want repeal and we’re waiting for Jan 26th Tractor rally. Income disparity is not there in which sector? It’s always a clash of haves and havenots. I will not raise religious flags in Red fort to fight that issue. That’s what is called as anarchy 

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

 

 

 

But if BJP keeps on playing the bogeyman game of blaming the sikhs only they are doing a disservice to the nation, Lot of farmers are alineated and it is just not sikhs.

Bogeyman of Sikhs? Nobody is blaming Sikhs, but vested interests of Capt Amrinder, Congress, AAP, Red unions and Khalistan in this mela.

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

 

I would not be surprised if BJP uses this as an excuse to beat the 99% of the farmers who were peaceful.

This is NDTV speak and theWire. Who were beaten when Khalustanis hid behind farmers and encroached Red fort.?

 

2 hours ago, Khota said:

 

This is a problem that will not go away and will require compromise from everyone. Agriculture minister is just a puppet only.

Everybody is a puppet for you unless they are against farm laws

[mishra]

Once again. Anarchist partys Delhi CM has decided to give rioters free space, water electricity and other facilities. More and more such riots will happen in Delhi as long as this evil man is incharge.

Edited January 29, 2021 by mishra

[Austin 3:!6]

Agar hum kare to kare kya....
Bole to bole kya

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[Khota]

5 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

 

It has not been tried in Bihar fully with the feudal system present there. . MH produces more than Punjab. The Agro produce of Punjab has gone down despite having MSP over the years compared to the rest of the country. Don’t bring your living experience, it means nothing, just look at data, Gujrat is doing better with Reliance and Amul in Agriculture sector than Punjab.

 

 

On the contrary, data shows the income is likely to increase, if the reforms are embraced in Punjab. They can diversify into food processing industry fed by the agro produce. What is stopping Amrinder to grow Punjab in food sector? Saale baithke tamasha dekh rahe hain.

 

 

Already covered. Modi/BJP and politics, look beyond them and on the policy. Wohi ghissa pita Modi Modi in every post.

 

 

They were in all manifests of all parties with inputs from farmers. The farmers unions were for these reforms. Ab ki hogya? 
 

 

Again with movie plots. Nobody is waiting for the lands to open up to move for the kill.  The point is about Paddy and Rice that P and H is growing is not for private companies’ quality. If they let private companies to buy what PH is growing, they would need better quality product. Mai baap government will buy anything and they APMCs and middlemen want this to continue.

 

Again with conspiracy theories in your head, will ignore your fantasies.

 

 

He is a small player, nowhere near the importance given to him.

 

They were given assurances with writing. The nincompoops want repeal and we’re waiting for Jan 26th Tractor rally. Income disparity is not there in which sector? It’s always a clash of haves and havenots. I will not raise religious flags in Red fort to fight that issue. That’s what is called as anarchy 

 

Bogeyman of Sikhs? Nobody is blaming Sikhs, but vested interests of Capt Amrinder, Congress, AAP, Red unions and Khalistan in this mela.

 

This is NDTV speak and theWire. Who were beaten when Khalustanis hid behind farmers and encroached Red fort.?

 

Everybody is a puppet for you unless they are against farm laws

We can go on and on but there is not one point you raise that is valid. Bottom line is that BJP is who you voted for and BJP is who you will support. And that goes for opposition too.

[coffee_rules]

29 minutes ago, Khota said:

We can go on and on but there is not one point you raise that is valid. Bottom line is that BJP is who you voted for and BJP is who you will support. And that goes for opposition too.

 

[Khota]

16 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

 

The fault lines are aligned with party lines. This is all meaningless. BJP has the votes and they will make the rules. it is that simple. I do agree farmers need to go home because they will get nothing. They are wasting time.

[coffee_rules]

35 minutes ago, Khota said:

The fault lines are aligned with party lines. This is all meaningless. BJP has the votes and they will make the rules. it is that simple. I do agree farmers need to go home because they will get nothing. They are wasting time.

 

So, you gave up, IOW. If BJP is wrong, janta sabak sikhayegi. But, you can think objectively , no? Now they are all in Ghazipur border, with that blacked out farmer leader, Tikait doing rona dhona and turning the farmer protest into a caste war , jhats ko ikkattha kar raha hein. Sikhon ki baari hogayi, ab jhats utar aaye maidaan par. 2nd Innings. Now, MSM is calling him a threat to Yogi and the next leader to take on Amit Shah and Modi. Silsila jaari hain, don't worry, the farmer protest will go in. UPA parties have boycotted the President's address before the budget, have turned AAPish anarchic. Never a dull day. 

[Khota]

13 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

 

So, you gave up, IOW. If BJP is wrong, janta sabak sikhayegi. But, you can think objectively , no? Now they are all in Ghazipur border, with that blacked out farmer leader, Tikait doing rona dhona and turning the farmer protest into a caste war , jhats ko ikkattha kar raha hein. Sikhon ki baari hogayi, ab jhats utar aaye maidaan par. 2nd Innings. Now, MSM is calling him a threat to Yogi and the next leader to take on Amit Shah and Modi. Silsila jaari hain, don't worry, the farmer protest will go in. UPA parties have boycotted the President's address before the budget, have turned AAPish anarchic. Never a dull day. 

 from day one I knew Modi is not going to back down. But the bottom line is the farmers income is declining and the gap will keep on growing. Their best alternative is instead to wait for next election and vote. next party will be more sympathetic.

 

You can read all my posts before. I alwyas maintained farmers were going to lose. No surprise here.

[raki05]

12 minutes ago, Khota said:

 from day one I knew Modi is not going to back down. But the bottom line is the farmers income is declining and the gap will keep on growing. Their best alternative is instead to wait for next election and vote. next party will be more sympathetic.

 

You can read all my posts before. I alwyas maintained farmers were going to lose. No surprise here.

As far as i know punjab and hariyana farmers are richest in the country many of them have earning more than software engineer, they have develop their own ecosystem from fariming, farming equipment's , market etc etc.  The richest are the one the one who actually do exploitation of the poorer migrant labor and farmers are the one instigating and running this protest from start as evident the 3laks spa chair , briyani  and pizza availabl. Had they been really poor farmer they would have worrier about their roji roti after 2 days of protest. You keep bringing governement sector is useless but even when their employee go on strike they loose salary for that day you will not see any hartaal lasting for more than 2 days. Besides they don't get subsidy like these farmers. People crying about farmers who still get their roji roti as they have lands.  There are much poorer people in india then these illiterate and anti nationalist farmers how much subsidy they get and do you see anyone doing protest like that.

[sandeep]

10 hours ago, Khota said:

Why dont they put it in words what farmers want and that is a gauranteed MSP. If they do that they will go back.

Sure, keep buying millions of tons of grain to rot, so that farmers can keep buying their luxury cars.  Rrrright.  

 

There are other ways to assist farmers, MSP disproportionally benefits a small slice of elites who game the system, and they are in alliance with political opposition because money is at stake.  Even Punjab state government rakes in 'taxes' from MSP sales to the central government.  There are other ways to help genuine farmers.  Most of these protesting "farmers" anyway hire biharis to do the actual work.  They are modern day Zamindars role-playing as "Kissaaan" so that their gravy train doesn't stop.

[mishra]

@Khota   Subsidised farming ( oil electricity seeds fertilizer water) and giving direct benefit to farmers ( say some money into accoun) is perfect thing to do. 
 

But MSP guarantee is different thing. Poor farmers don’t sell a lot of their produce. ( Most poor ones sell few quintals each season) While its Rich farmers who are the ones who loose out with MSP gone as they are only real beneficiaries.

 

PS: Hope now you get the government angle. And why most people think government is right.

Edited January 29, 2021 by mishra

[wanted_desi]

What is all of you Pro-Govt  folks take on this:

 

 

[coffee_rules]

As if it cares, another side show for media is averted

 

 

[Number]

12 minutes ago, wanted_desi said:

What is all of you Pro-Govt  folks take on this:

 

 

Hundreds of factories, restaurants and shops in this area are on the verge of shutdown. Many livelihoods are lost. No wonder locals are angry with these so called protesters.

[randomGuy]

19 minutes ago, wanted_desi said:

What is all of you Pro-Govt  folks take on this:

 

 

In this also, 'farmer' protestors attacked 2 SHOs and injured them with swords.... the video is all over the news.