U19 World Cup Discussion

[Vijy]

1 hour ago, nsareen said:

england will be a different challenge , they have some good batsmen


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what about their bowling? from what I saw/read, Oz bowling attack is more potent than Eng to some extent

[nsareen]

what about their bowling? from what I saw/read, Oz bowling attack is more potent than Eng to some extent

they have better spinners in betthel , prest & rehab khan the leggie.. at the start the opening bowlers don’t give away much.. it’s a balanced attack ..


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[rkt.india]

India playing too many bits and pieces player. Need one more specialist seamer in Garv Sangwan somewhere. Bawa is below Average bowler.

[nsareen]

India playing too many bits and pieces player. Need one more specialist seamer in Garv Sangwan somewhere. Bawa is below Average bowler.

they would not make the change at this stage, if they have to make a forced change , i can see harnoor making way for somebody like aneeshwar or aaradhya, else nothing much to change, bawa will keep his place due to batting..


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[rkt.india]

15 minutes ago, nsareen said:

they would not make the change at this stage, if they have to make a forced change , i can see harnoor making way for somebody like aneeshwar or aaradhya, else nothing much to change, bawa will keep his place due to batting..


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Can replace Tambe for Sangwan.

[ShoonyaSifar]

A number of posters kept abusing this team right from the Asia Cup. Nepotistic, quota players, deserving players not picked, not having a very good quality and all that ****. Here they are in the finals in a grand fashion showing an incredible depth.

 

I hope those posters (you folks know who you are) have the humility to accept they were/are wrong.

 

Well done kids. Enjoy the finals and give your best

[Vijy]

1 hour ago, nsareen said:

they have better spinners in betthel , prest & rehab khan the leggie.. at the start the opening bowlers don’t give away much.. it’s a balanced attack ..


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I guess we'll see how the final will play out. Eng does produce some good U19 talent, especially with their expert-level poaching

[nsareen]

Can replace Tambe for Sangwan.

tambe has played match winning knocks lower down, don’t think they will tinker with him, his bowling might be under par but he adds a lot of balance to the lower middle order..


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[prudent_kreeda]

42 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

A number of posters kept abusing this team right from the Asia Cup. Nepotistic, quota players, deserving players not picked, not having a very good quality and all that ****. Here they are in the finals in a grand fashion showing an incredible depth.

 

I hope those posters (you folks know who you are) have the humility to accept they were/are wrong.

 

Well done kids. Enjoy the finals and give your best

 

One of the reason is - hardly anyone knew much about these kids as last 2 years we had little cricket activity. We had only some info in this forum from nsareen & Rkt . I think most abused was Dhul as he failed badly before WC.  But they have really punched above their weight in this tourney. 

There is no shame even if they do not lift the trophy. Bowling is poor bar couple of them esp. 3rd seamer and on a patta and if part timers are attacked , it would be tough in finals.

Among prospects- 

1. Hangare- Will play for india in short format in couple of years though raw .  Its more due rarity - a pace bowler with power hitting ability at  lower order and very agile fielder. He is a140+ bowler. His speed may look little less in reading as he bowls a lot of back of length stuff.

2.Among batters - Dhull -very agile and quick hands & good wrist use.  Krish - compared to Dhul & others , this kid has another 2 seasons of improvement as he is  only 16 . Has something pleasant about his timing & shots , With Abhishek as mentor this kid can come really good . Both these may come good in short format than longer format . 

3. Rasheed - More correct than other 2 , could be a candidate for longer format. 

Success apart at U19 level, need to keep lower expectation from them as at international level even small weakness is exposed & exploited brutally. Gill & Shaw who looked so good at U19 have still not made it at international level even after  3 years.  Also they will not chances easily as so many above them are in Queue.

[Jay]

No one cares about youth cricket. It's what these youth can do vs big boys that counts. Even average young players can turn out to be stars in the future ad they mature and learn more skills or develop their physique etc. 

 

It's hard to predict. I wouldn't rely too much on who excels in these tournaments. I have so many so called tailunts come and go. So many have failed to hack it in international cricket. 

 

For bowlers; just look for ones with good bounce, pace. Ability to move the ball can be trained for later. Pace and especially bounce off good lengths plus a good bouncer/yorker is what we should be looking at. 

 

As for batting, it's really hard to discern and under 19 players ability given they aren't exposed to express pace bounce etc. I would just focus on their technique and how late they play balls. How well they do vs short balls and yorkers. Playing swing can be trained for later. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

58 minutes ago, prudent_kreeda said:

 

One of the reason is - hardly anyone knew much about these kids as last 2 years we had little cricket activity. We had only some info in this forum from nsareen & Rkt . I think most abused was Dhul as he failed badly before WC.  But they have really punched above their weight in this tourney. 

There is no shame even if they do not lift the trophy. Bowling is poor bar couple of them esp. 3rd seamer and on a patta and if part timers are attacked , it would be tough in finals.

Among prospects- 

1. Hangare- Will play for india in short format in couple of years though raw .  Its more due rarity - a pace bowler with power hitting ability at  lower order and very agile fielder. He is a140+ bowler. His speed may look little less in reading as he bowls a lot of back of length stuff.

2.Among batters - Dhull -very agile and quick hands & good wrist use.  Krish - compared to Dhul & others , this kid has another 2 seasons of improvement as he is  only 16 . Has something pleasant about his timing & shots , With Abhishek as mentor this kid can come really good . Both these may come good in short format than longer format . 

3. Rasheed - More correct than other 2 , could be a candidate for longer format. 

Success apart at U19 level, need to keep lower expectation from them as at international level even small weakness is exposed & exploited brutally. Gill & Shaw who looked so good at U19 have still not made it at international level even after  3 years.  Also they will not chances easily as so many above them are in Queue.

Nothing to do with their talent. Primarily because the TMs have been impatient with them while they keep backing the failing seniors. Covid and lack of FC cricket hasn't helped much in their continued development either 

 

Also, other than Sachin, can you name one Indian player in last 20-25 years who was well established in international cricket by the age of 21-22?

[Suhaan]

7 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Also, other than Sachin, can you name one Indian player in last 20-25 years who was well established in international cricket by the age of 21-22?

This is most important para of your post ,fans and cricket admins should take some cue from it

Most will say,stat padding is an art

[express bowling]

The main purpose of these tournaments is to find players for the Senior side, a few years down the line. India have been winning and reaching the finals in U19 WC the last few times, but that has not translated to many of these players being regulars for Team India, although some are in their mid 20s. Pant is the only exception.

 

How many of these players will meet the needs of our Senior team ?

 

Hangargekar for sure. Maybe Dhull and Bawa. Bawa and Hangargekar needed to be given more opportunity with the bat.

 

Not many others catch the eye.

 

There is lack of good pacers or wrist spinners.

 

Don't see good power hitters or really high SR batters in the top 4 slots either. And this is a big need for modern LOIs.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2022 by express bowling

[Jay]

1 hour ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Nothing to do with their talent. Primarily because the TMs have been impatient with them while they keep backing the failing seniors. Covid and lack of FC cricket hasn't helped much in their continued development either 

 

Also, other than Sachin, can you name one Indian player in last 20-25 years who was well established in international cricket by the age of 21-22?

It's not how it works. Marketability. It's about who puts butts on seats. It's about big names. Experienced guys have big names and supposedly attracts more crowd even in the twilight of their careers. Thanks in large to Indian fans who are generally dumb as they have this inclination to worship celebrities, seniors and big names. Grovelling and sir culture has allowed this backward culture to fester. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

24 minutes ago, express bowling said:

The main purpose of these tournaments is to find players for the Senior side, a few years down the line. India have been winning and reaching the finals in U19 WC the last few times, but that has not translated to many of these players being regulars for Team India, although some are in their mid 20s. Pant is the only exception.

 

How many of these players will meet the needs of our Senior team ?

 

Hangargekar for sure. Maybe Dhull.

 

Not many others catch the eye.

 

There is lack of good pacers or wrist spinners.

 

Don't see good power hitters or really high SR batters in the top 4 slots either. And this is a big need for modern LOIs.

 

 

 

 

If those are your criteria, then the future of cricket must be very bleak. There are no standout players in any side based on the parameters you have listed.

 

Obviously the reality is something else. On these slow sluggish pitches, how would you expect 'high SR players' and why would you not appreciate the kind of knocks that Dhull and Rasheed played yesterday? Why would you expect pacers to be bowling 140+ when there the pitches do not have much pace? These are 18-19 year olds and not fully developed players FFS. Like in the other u-19 WCs, this group has enough talented players for the system to work with. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

It's not how it works. Marketability. It's about who puts butts on seats. It's about big names. Experienced guys have big names and supposedly attracts more crowd even in the twilight of their careers. Thanks in large to Indian fans who are generally dumb as they have this inclination to worship celebrities, seniors and big names. Grovelling and sir culture has allowed this backward culture to fester. 

That is what these senior player PRs (including the brands, the print and TV media which is on their payroll) would want us to believe. We had all senior players barring Rohit playing in the SA ODIs, the viewership was worse than an average IPL match.

 

I am hopeful that, soon as these seniors continue to suck, the brands will reconsider their position.

Edited February 3, 2022 by ShoonyaSifar

[rkt.india]

1 hour ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

If those are your criteria, then the future of cricket must be very bleak. There are no standout players in any side based on the parameters you have listed.

 

Obviously the reality is something else. On these slow sluggish pitches, how would you expect 'high SR players' and why would you not appreciate the kind of knocks that Dhull and Rasheed played yesterday? Why would you expect pacers to be bowling 140+ when there the pitches do not have much pace? These are 18-19 year olds and not fully developed players FFS. Like in the other u-19 WCs, this group has enough talented players for the system to work with. 

People have too much expectations from 19 year olds. Not many bowls 140 at 19. Even if we have just one, good enough. Potential 140 bowlers Likes of Ayush Thakur and Zaid Patankar not picked.

[express bowling]

8 hours ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

If those are your criteria, then the future of cricket must be very bleak. There are no standout players in any side based on the parameters you have listed.

 

Obviously the reality is something else. On these slow sluggish pitches, how would you expect 'high SR players' and why would you not appreciate the kind of knocks that Dhull and Rasheed played yesterday? Why would you expect pacers to be bowling 140+ when there the pitches do not have much pace? These are 18-19 year olds and not fully developed players FFS. Like in the other u-19 WCs, this group has enough talented players for the system to work with. 

 

 

There are many talented players in India at U19 level.

 

Question is ... are the right ones being picked and are the ones being picked being guided correctly or utilized correctly.

 

1)  It is not necessary to bowl 140 k+ at U19 level. But floaty medium pacers like Ravi Kumar won't do. And Bawa is just a part timer. This means we have played only 1 proper pacer for the most part.

 

2)  Do you spot any top 4 batsmen in the mould of Shaw, Pant or Kishan ?  It means we are looking for consolidators at the top again.

 

3)  In a post innings interview, Kanitkar said that Dhull is a stroke player but is being guided to bat through the innings. One such batter is ok, maybe 2 ... but looks like all the top 4 are being guided to be sheet anchors till the 42nd over and accelerate after that. And batters like Bana are not encouraged at the top.

 

4)  I think you will agree that Wrist spinners are more impact-ful in white ball cricket these days, compared to finger spinners. But have you seen any specialist wrist spinner in our squad ?

 

5)  We need a couple of tall bounce bowlers but we have not promoted any in this tournament.

 

6)  Did big hitters like Bawa and Hangargekar get sufficient chances to bat in this tournament ?

 

You are one of the posters here who are disgusted about the state of affairs in the Senior team. And often rightly so. But don't you spot a similar trend being promoted in our U19 team this time ?  One reaps what one sows. Think about it.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2022 by express bowling

[Lone Wolf]

11 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

 

There are many talented players in India at U19 level.

 

Question is ... are the right ones being picked and are the ones being picked being guided corrected or utilized correctly.

 

1)  It is not necessary to bowl 140 k+ at U19 level. But floaty medium pacers like Ravi Kumar won't do. And Bawa is just a part timer. This means we have played only 1 proper pacer for the most part.

 

2)  Do you spot any top 4 batsmen in the mould of Shaw, Pant or Kishan ?  It means we are looking for consolidators at the top again.

 

3)  In a post innings interview, Kanitkar said that Dhull is s stroke player but is being guided to bat through the innings. One such batter is ok ... but looks like all the top 4 are being guided to be sheet anchors till the 42nd over and accelerate after that. And batters like Bana are not encouraged at the top.

 

4)  I think you will agree that Wrist spinners are more impact-ful in white ball cricket these days, compared to finger spinners. But have you seen any specialist wrist spinner in our squad ?

 

5)  We need a couple of tall bounce bowlers but we have not promoted any in this tournament.

 

6)  Did big hitters like Bawa and Hangargekar get sufficient chances to bat in this tournament ?

 

You are one of the posters here who are disgusted about the state of affairs in the Senior team. And often rightly so. But don't you spot a similar trend being promoted in our U19 team this time ?  One reaps what one sows. Think about it.

 

 

 

 

I think pitches are not conducive to stroke play so players like Dhull & Rasheed are not able to express them fully.  Furthermore the ability to soak in pressure at such a young age as a middle order bat is remarkable. 

Dhull/Rasheed if picked in IPl would be worth following.   Priyam Garg looked awful in U19 WC & almost same in IPl.  These guys look a lot better & on better pitches like in IPl we may see more of their ability. 

[express bowling]

23 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said:

I think pitches are not conducive to stroke play so players like Dhull & Rasheed are not able to express them fully.  Furthermore the ability to soak in pressure at such a young age as a middle order bat is remarkable. 

Dhull/Rasheed if picked in IPl would be worth following.   Priyam Garg looked awful in U19 WC & almost same in IPl.  These guys look a lot better & on better pitches like in IPl we may see more of their ability. 

 

 

Dhull and Rasheed are good.

 

But Rasheed will probably be a classical player.