Seam bowling all rounders

[express bowling]

3 minutes ago, Vijy said:

yes, seam all-rounders should keep in mind what the Mighty Curly Ambrose told Bawa; same advice applies to others too.

 

"Ambrose, a man of few words, congratulated the youngster and said, “Don’t lose your pace. You are quick. You can trouble the best in the business with the kind of steep bounce you generate from the good length. Don’t become a line-length bowler. Enjoy the evening.”

 

 

Wonderful words from the great man.

 

Please post it in the Speeds and Performances thread.

[express bowling]

Bawa was playing white ball cricket. Why isn't he playing Ranji ?   Injured ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Sooda]

11 hours ago, express bowling said:

While searching for true all-rounders, we are picking too many weak bowlers with a bit of batting ability ... like Shardul, Chahar, Unadkat, Harshal.

 

Not good. 

 

Batting is not getting strengthened but bowling is getting weak. 

 

While looking for bowling all-rounders who will bat at 8 or later, first find bowlers who will find a place in the team as a pure bowler even if he could not bat. Then pick the one with best batting ability for No.8.  Ashwin in tests is a perfect example.

 

While looking for batting all-rounders who will bat in the top 7, first find batsmen who will find a place in the team as batsman even if they could not bowl. Then include the one with best bowling ability at 6 or 7.  The current day Jadeja in tests or Hardik in LOIs are good examples. 

 

Chahar is a good LOI bowler though, not a weak one, think he should be in our first 11 in both LOI formats if fit. He fits the criteria you've laid out 

 

I'm not the biggest fan of Thakur but he has a role to play as a test fourth seamer overseas who can chip in with useful runs and wickets. He has that gift of "making things happen"

 

Should not be anywhere near LOI squads though 

[Sooda]

What about Venkatesh Iyer? Did okay in SMAT

[Vijy]

1 hour ago, express bowling said:

 

 

Wonderful words from the great man.

 

Please post it in the Speeds and Performances thread.

will do it now; thanks for the suggestion

[Vijy]

1 hour ago, express bowling said:

Bawa was playing white ball cricket. Why isn't he playing Ranji ?   Injured ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

it is baffling to me. perhaps @rkt.india has an update?

[express bowling]

28 minutes ago, Sooda said:

 

Chahar is a good LOI bowler though, not a weak one, think he should be in our first 11 in both LOI formats if fit. He fits the criteria you've laid out 

 

Chahar is good only if the new ball swings.  And we already have Arshdeep and Bhuvi for that.

 

Chahar looks a liability at the death, the middle and if the new ball does not swing then he is ordinary too. Add to this the fact that he keeps getting injured.

 

 

28 minutes ago, Sooda said:

 

I'm not the biggest fan of Thakur but he has a role to play as a test fourth seamer overseas who can chip in with useful runs and wickets. He has that gift of "making things happen"

 

He was ok for this role but recently his batting form has dipped and he has become more unfit.

 

28 minutes ago, Sooda said:

Should not be anywhere near LOI squads though 

 

Our problem is that, once a players comes in the pool, he maybe tried in formats where he sucks. 

 

And we have too many medium paced swing bowlers for LOIs .. Bhuvi, Chahar, Arshdeep and Shardul. And Harshal, though not a  swing bowler is similarly medium paced. Now Unadkat has come in. We are not heading in the right direction. 

[Vijy]

1 minute ago, express bowling said:

 

Chahar is good only if the new ball swings.  And we already have Arshdeep and Bhuvi for that.

 

Chahar looks a liability at the death, the middle and if the new ball does not swing then he is ordinary too. Add to this the fact that he keeps getting injured.

 

 

 

He was ok for this role but recently his batting form has dipped and he has become more unfit.

 

 

Our problem is that, once a players comes in the pool, he maybe tried in formats where he sucks. 

 

And we have too many medium paced swing bowlers for LOIs .. Bhuvi, Chahar, Arshdeep and Shardul. And Harshal, though not a  swing bowler is similarly medium paced. Now Unadkat has come in. We are not heading in the right direction. 

he looks visibly unfit nowadays. saw some clip of him training, and he was huffing and puffing after a short spell

[Sooda]

1 minute ago, express bowling said:

 

Chahar is good only if the new ball swings.  And we already have Arshdeep and Bhuvi for that.

 

Chahar looks a liability at the death, the middle and if the new ball does not swing then he is ordinary too. Add to this the fact that he keeps getting injured.

 

 

 

He was ok for this role but recently his batting form has dipped and he has become more unfit.

 

 

Our problem is that, once a players comes in the pool, he maybe tried in formats where he sucks. 

 

And we have too many medium paced swing bowlers for LOIs .. Bhuvi, Chahar, Arshdeep and Shardul. And Harshal, though not a  swing bowler is similarly medium paced. Now Unadkat has come in. We are not heading in the right direction. 

 

Do agree unfortunately he is new ball specialist...

 

Bhuvaneshwar should be phased out now and Chahar should play when fit, your right can't play both and also Harshal. Arshdeep is at least left armer.

[Vijy]

 A symptom of our malaise even in media reporting is in the following article on current seam-bowling ARs. This article is actually quite "good" in the sense that it is thorough and provides details. And yet, it is "bad" because it over-emphasizes trundlers.

https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/cricket/ranji-trophy-in-quest-of-all-rounders-8320395/

Of the people listed therein, only Bawa has the potential to be quick and a genuine 4th/5th bowling option. the rest are 6th bowler material (at best) IMO. and there is no mention of hangargekar, tendu jr, shegde, etc.

[rkt.india]

2 hours ago, Sooda said:

 

Chahar is a good LOI bowler though, not a weak one, think he should be in our first 11 in both LOI formats if fit. He fits the criteria you've laid out 

 

I'm not the biggest fan of Thakur but he has a role to play as a test fourth seamer overseas who can chip in with useful runs and wickets. He has that gift of "making things happen"

 

Should not be anywhere near LOI squads though 

Chahar is a four over bowler max. Not an odi bowler. Looks clueless without swing.

[rkt.india]

1 hour ago, Vijy said:

 A symptom of our malaise even in media reporting is in the following article on current seam-bowling ARs. This article is actually quite "good" in the sense that it is thorough and provides details. And yet, it is "bad" because it over-emphasizes trundlers.

https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/cricket/ranji-trophy-in-quest-of-all-rounders-8320395/

Of the people listed therein, only Bawa has the potential to be quick and a genuine 4th/5th bowling option. the rest are 6th bowler material (at best) IMO. and there is no mention of hangargekar, tendu jr, shegde, etc.

There is Divyansh Joshi from UP as well. Bowls 135+ and bats at 6.

[vvvslaxman]

2 hours ago, Vijy said:

 A symptom of our malaise even in media reporting is in the following article on current seam-bowling ARs. This article is actually quite "good" in the sense that it is thorough and provides details. And yet, it is "bad" because it over-emphasizes trundlers.

https://indianexpress.com/article/sports/cricket/ranji-trophy-in-quest-of-all-rounders-8320395/

Of the people listed therein, only Bawa has the potential to be quick and a genuine 4th/5th bowling option. the rest are 6th bowler material (at best) IMO. and there is no mention of hangargekar, tendu jr, shegde, etc.

 

Thanks for Sharing. Good article.

[Vijy]

57 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

There is Divyansh Joshi from UP as well. Bowls 135+ and bats at 6.

haven't seen him myself. I know he played a few t20s

[sandeep]

9 hours ago, Vijy said:

there were three bits-and-pieces players that I think should have gotten a longer run in ODIs in 2000s, when we had less of a pace bowling culture. one was reetinder singh sodhi, and the other was JP yadav and one more was LR shukla. not saying either was great (they clearly were not), but they were not terrible options IMO

LR Shukla was worse than Abhishek Nayar who never got a run either - also was unlucky with injuries.  Nayar has had a renaissance post playing career as a mentor/personal life coach for players like Dinesh Karthik, Robin Utthappa - helping them re-invent their batting methods and bring in consistency. 

[Vijy]

31 minutes ago, sandeep said:

LR Shukla was worse than Abhishek Nayar who never got a run either - also was unlucky with injuries.  Nayar has had a renaissance post playing career as a mentor/personal life coach for players like Dinesh Karthik, Robin Utthappa - helping them re-invent their batting methods and bring in consistency. 

not sure that I concur with you on this. shukla played when he was very raw. at his peak, he was a better option than nayar for LOIs (which is the format I was discussing if you see my earlier posts). the reason is that he was a more explosive batter (albeit not as consistent), a more potent wicket-taking bowler by far, and a much better fielder.

[Need4Speed]

If we cant get good seam bowling AR then lets get good spin bowling AR..but we need some genuine AR..then we can accomodate extra pace bowler

[Vijy]

32 minutes ago, Need4Speed said:

If we cant get good seam bowling AR then lets get good spin bowling AR..but we need some genuine AR..then we can accomodate extra pace bowler

spin-AR reserves are in good shape.

 

1. Jaddu

2. Ashwin

3. Sundar

4. Axar (to an extent)

5. Shahbaz

6. Saurabh Kumar (to an extent)

7. Shams Mulani

 

Even Kuldeep has FC batting average of around 26-27 (when tests are excluded). we need seam bowling AR for overseas.

[Pollack]

Arjun tendulkar bowling lots of overs for GOA. Good for him. Hope he also gets a game in IPL since Mumbai Indians uncapped local talent is not bright.

[singhvivek141]

On 12/27/2022 at 8:59 AM, Majestic said:

Hangargekar can clock 140+ though which Thakur, Woakes can't. He is 19 year old so maybe by 22-23, he can become a bit more faster and clock 145 mark.

I was talking skill wise, they're bowling allrounders.