Pakistan announced Squad for Asia Cup & Afg series

[Lone Wolf]

15 hours ago, Axl100mph said:

Love how everyone is sleeping on Naseem who right now is the most complete bowler going around, and for me the best in odi's given his effectiveness is all phases of an odi bowling innings. 

 

He may not have the enthusiasm and peak potency of Shaheen but on a basic, sustained level, he is a more skillful bowler. 

 

Those recalling the nz series we lost need to understand that it was under a 'qudrat ka nizam management' and the team was extremely unsettled/low on confidence with several debutantes and players absent or returning from injury; Shaheen didnt play any games, Naseem didnt play the last odi, rauf just returned from an injury and was out of rhythm. Salman/usama were on debuts, shadab wasnt there, Haris sohail's return was being experimented with.

 

The full strength team played in march and got a 4-1 result. I firmly believe the scorelines would not have changed, even if nz sent their first team because the gap was quite vast. 

Naseem is high on confidence & bowling well but barring his new ball burst I expect Indian batters to handle a right arm pacer decently well.  He is a short skiddy bowler which our guys are used to handle. 

I will be more vary of Shadab & That Usama Mir guy...  As our players are mentally shot against decent spin. 

[Austin 3:!6]

On 8/14/2023 at 3:11 PM, Lone Wolf said:

When has Bumrah actually done something of note vs Pak or against SENAP in a multi nation tournament?  ODIs is his weakest format too...  With a terrible new ball record. 

Old man Shami is unreliable. 

 

Bumrah bowled brilliantly against Pakistan in both the games during 2018 Asia cup. Bowled fast and pin point yorkers. 

 

He also got Fakhar Zaman out in CT Finals but unfortunately it turned out to be a no ball. That was the game right there.

 

In 2019 WC, Bumrah and Bhuvi were almost unplayable in their opening spell on that rainy day in Manchester. But he was not required to do much later in that game as Pakistan was crumbling in its own against the likes of Pandya and Vijay Shankar. 

 

He was also good against them in 2016 WT20 getting Sharjeel khan out early but again a game where spin dominated and he was not required to do anything.

 

The only game he flopped was that 2021 T20 WC game but based on that 1 game I would not say Bumrah never performed against Pakistan.

 

Hope we unleash the beast this time. Mind you he got very good record in Pallekelle where we would face poyzz on 2nd sept.

Edited August 16, 2023 by Austin 3:!6

[Nikhil_cric]

9 hours ago, Norman said:

My golly I'll say this again...

 

This whole thread is just a carbon copy repeat of that post champions trophy 2017-2018 period when suddenly Pakistan were a "better side than India" , "have a mental edge over India" , "has a galaxy beating phasst bowling attack" , supremely tailunted players with zero weaknesses etc etc etc etc. 

 

And fake teenager Naseem Shah has taken the Hassan Ali role of getting hyped to the moon by uber delusional Pak fanboys with even lesser performances. 

 

 

Just love to see it...

We are definitely the inferior side. Too many folks get caught up in the hype of this Indian team which has been average for nearly a decade. And it's getting worse.  Just an example 

 

 

[Gollum]

Man to man, Pak is definitely better. We will rely on individual brilliance from Kohli, Kuldeep, Siraj etc. 

[the don]

12 hours ago, Norman said:

My golly I'll say this again...

 

This whole thread is just a carbon copy repeat of that post champions trophy 2017-2018 period when suddenly Pakistan were a "better side than India" , "have a mental edge over India" , "has a galaxy beating phasst bowling attack" , supremely tailunted players with zero weaknesses etc etc etc etc. 

 

And fake teenager Naseem Shah has taken the Hassan Ali role of getting hyped to the moon by uber delusional Pak fanboys with even lesser performances. 

 

 

Just love to see it...

Told you before the emerging final that Arshad Iqbal is a better bowler than Rana and he showed that by bullying Sudarshan with bouncers and a 5 fer in the semi while Rana was smashed around by Saim Ayyub. I also rate Naseem very highly if he remains fit. He averages 15 in Odi’s and on current form is the best.

[Lone Wolf]

2 hours ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

Bumrah bowled brilliantly against Pakistan in both the games during 2018 Asia cup. Bowled fast and pin point yorkers. 

 

He also got Fakhar Zaman out in CT Finals but unfortunately it turned out to be a no ball. That was the game right there.

 

In 2019 WC, Bumrah and Bhuvi were almost unplayable in their opening spell on that rainy day in Manchester. But he was not required to do much later in that game as Pakistan was crumbling in its own against the likes of Pandya and Vijay Shankar. 

 

He was also good against them in 2016 WT20 getting Sharjeel khan out early but again a game where spin dominated and he was not required to do anything.

 

The only game he flopped was that 2021 T20 WC game but based on that 1 game I would not say Bumrah never performed against Pakistan.

 

Hope we unleash the beast this time. Mind you he got very good record in Pallekelle where we would face poyzz on 2nd sept.

You can beat the bat million times but it's the wickets that matter...  On a damp morning in Manchester both Bumrah & Bhuvi failed to open the game in PP for India.  Shami's exclusion cost India there & then. 

 

Kiwis expertly did that though aided by poor batting. 

Pak got off to a solid start in WC19 until Shankar delivered the initial breakthrough highlighting his PP woes 

 

I am not even counting Liton Das assault on him in Asia Cup final 2018.  Gun barrel straight stuff got dispatched. 

 

I hope he does well but man to man I expect Shaheen to have a bigger impact unless Bumrah comes back to his best. 

Lots of ifs & buts in there. 

Bumrah last played ODIs in SL in 2017...  I his absolute gun years.   

I am skeptical about him.  Let's first see how he bowls in Ireland. 

As of now Siraj is the leader of the attack & one in form. 

[Norman]

10 hours ago, Bigg Brother said:

Man to man this Pakistan side is better than India at this moment

 

No they are not. They have an even more undercooked middle order than us with their best MO bat being Rizwan who averages 34 in odis. With Rahul, Samson/Iyer, Pandya and Jadeja , we have a much more reliable unit to tackle the middle overs. 

 

Their top 3 might be slightly better

on current form but it's nothing close to earth shattering to make a big difference.

 

Bowling wise as I said, if Bumrah is anywhere close to his pre-injury self, we will boast a better unit with Siraj, Kuldeep and Shami. Heck even the likes of Axar or chahal will enjoy their non dynamic middle order filled with right handed bats.

 

 

[Norman]

3 hours ago, Nikhil_cric said:

We are definitely the inferior side. Too many folks get caught up in the hype of this Indian team which has been average for nearly a decade. 

 

We are definitely an average side when compared to Aus/Eng or a full strength South Africa these days. Nobody is denying it. But Pakistan are not that good a team in 50 over cricket to warrant such doomsday scenarios that we're seeing on this thread.

 

I know people are generally paranoid about losing to an arch rival but that doesn't mean we should completely throw objectivity out of the window. 

Edited August 16, 2023 by Norman

[Austin 3:!6]

@Norman @Lone Wolf you guys agree with this man to man comparison between 2 teams?

 

Rohit < Fakhar

Gill > Imam

Kohli < Babar

KL < Rizwan

Pandya > Shafique

SKY > Agha

Jadeja > Iftikhar

Kuldeep < Shadab

Shami < Naseem

Siraj < Rauf

Bumrah > Shaheen

[Norman]

1 hour ago, the don said:

Told you before the emerging final that Arshad Iqbal is a better bowler than Rana and he showed that by bullying Sudarshan with bouncers and a 5 fer in the semi while Rana was smashed around by Saim Ayyub. 

 

What on earth has all this got to do with what we're discussing here? Or are you just going to bring up that useless irrelevant win every couple of days to feel good?

 

1 hour ago, the don said:

I also rate Naseem very highly if he remains fit. He averages 15 in Odi’s and on current form is the best.

 

Lmao

 

I mean...Can't expect much sense from someone who calls a guy best in the world after a grand total of two series' and that too against mighty Netherlands and a second string NZ.

 

If Axar Patel was Pakistani, you lot would have called him best since Warne after his first two test series where he averaged 12 or something. 

[Norman]

10 minutes ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

@Norman @Lone Wolf you guys agree with this man to man comparison between 2 teams?

 

Rohit < Fakhar

Gill > Imam

Kohli < Babar

KL < Rizwan

Pandya > Shafique

SKY > Agha

Jadeja > Iftikhar

Kuldeep < Shadab

Shami < Naseem

Siraj < Rauf

Bumrah > Shaheen

 

KL is definitely a better ODI middle order batsman than Rizwan.

 

Rohit and Fakhar are 50-50 , both are inconsistent but can win the game on their own on their day.. nothing much to choose their.

 

Kuldeep is definitely better than Shadab. The latter gets needlessly overhyped here because of his T20 exploits but he's average in odis.

 

Except Shaheen, none of the pak bowlers are lethal when the batters aren't attacking them. 

 

Btw , Shaheen> Post injury Bumrah 

[Lone Wolf]

41 minutes ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

@Norman @Lone Wolf you guys agree with this man to man comparison between 2 teams?

 

Rohit < Fakhar

Gill > Imam

Kohli < Babar

KL < Rizwan

Pandya > Shafique

SKY > Agha

Jadeja > Iftikhar

Kuldeep < Shadab

Shami < Naseem

Siraj < Rauf

Bumrah > Shaheen

Kela in general is better than Rizwan in ODIs at no 5..  But we don't know how ready he is. 

 

Also Chachu Ifti>>Jadeja.  I don't remember the last time Jadeja won us a game in LOIs...  Maybe that T20 with the bat in Australia. 

Ifti did well against us in Asia Cup & WT20 & bowled very well too in tourney. 

Jadeja is biggest fraud happening to Indian cricket since 2009.  A classic case of a Test player made into a LOI legend. 

Shaheen > Bumrah in ODIs. 

Siraj >>>>>Rauf in ODIs.  Look at Siraj's record..  He is only Indian in Top 10 rankings with S/R & average matching likes of Boult Hazelwood & Shaheen.  Best ODI trio in 2-3 years. 

 

[Mesky99]

2 hours ago, the don said:

Told you before the emerging final that Arshad Iqbal is a better bowler than Rana and he showed that by bullying Sudarshan with bouncers and a 5 fer in the semi while Rana was smashed around by Saim Ayyub. I also rate Naseem very highly if he remains fit. He averages 15 in Odi’s and on current form is the best.

Rana is raw and has hardly played much cricket, his numbers so far in first class cricket are great but definitely not yet a India A bowler, Arshad should be compared to sen, tyagi, prasidh, all India u19 bowlers have outbowled Pakistan pacers since 2016, Arshad on top is a massive age fraud.

 

 

 

[Bigg Brother]

2 hours ago, Norman said:

 

We are definitely an average side when compared to Aus/Eng or a full strength South Africa these days. Nobody is denying it. But Pakistan are not that good a team in 50 over cricket to warrant such doomsday scenarios that we're seeing on this thread.

 

I know people are generally paranoid about losing to an arch rival but that doesn't mean we should completely throw objectivity out of the window. 

Maybe You're right, I dont know much about their ODIs side perhaps. This is the first time we are playing ODIs against them after span of 4 years and 3 months. I have seen enough of their T20 side and this might be affecting my views but still we need to pick right players. Gulf between two teams isn't that massive which it used to be in past. Also we are going through captaincy crisis. With Dhoni, atleast we used to thrash them in ICC tournaments regularly, Kohli-Rohit have absolutely made me hopeless about this team surviving in pressure situation over opposition specifically Pakistan.

[Bigg Brother]

1 hour ago, Lone Wolf said:

Kela in general is better than Rizwan in ODIs at no 5..  But we don't know how ready he is. 

 

Also Chachu Ifti>>Jadeja.  I don't remember the last time Jadeja won us a game in LOIs...  Maybe that T20 with the bat in Australia. 

Ifti did well against us in Asia Cup & WT20 & bowled very well too in tourney. 

Jadeja is biggest fraud happening to Indian cricket since 2009.  A classic case of a Test player made into a LOI legend. 

Shaheen > Bumrah in ODIs. 

Siraj >>>>>Rauf in ODIs.  Look at Siraj's record..  He is only Indian in Top 10 rankings with S/R & average matching likes of Boult Hazelwood & Shaheen.  Best ODI trio in 2-3 years. 

 

Absolutely right about Jadeja. Not only that, we are grooming another clone of Jaddu- Akshar who is as hopeless as Jaddu in LOIs.

[the don]

2 hours ago, Mesky99 said:

Rana is raw and has hardly played much cricket, his numbers so far in first class cricket are great but definitely not yet a India A bowler, Arshad should be compared to sen, tyagi, prasidh, all India u19 bowlers have outbowled Pakistan pacers since 2016, Arshad on top is a massive age fraud.

 

 

 

Bhai how is age relevant. Its not u 19 cricket.

[the don]

7 hours ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

Bumrah bowled brilliantly against Pakistan in both the games during 2018 Asia cup. Bowled fast and pin point yorkers. 

 

He also got Fakhar Zaman out in CT Finals but unfortunately it turned out to be a no ball. That was the game right there.

 

In 2019 WC, Bumrah and Bhuvi were almost unplayable in their opening spell on that rainy day in Manchester. But he was not required to do much later in that game as Pakistan was crumbling in its own against the likes of Pandya and Vijay Shankar. 

 

He was also good against them in 2016 WT20 getting Sharjeel khan out early but again a game where spin dominated and he was not required to do anything.

 

The only game he flopped was that 2021 T20 WC game but based on that 1 game I would not say Bumrah never performed against Pakistan.

 

Hope we unleash the beast this time. Mind you he got very good record in Pallekelle where we would face poyzz on 2nd sept.

Lets be honest. He was a let down in the CT 17 final, compared to Amir who blew away the Indian top order. I rate Bumrah very highly but his achievements in white ball cricket are negligible. Amir’s opening over in the 2009 final> Bumrah’s knockout efforts so far.

[Lone Wolf]

2 hours ago, Bigg Brother said:

Absolutely right about Jadeja. Not only that, we are grooming another clone of Jaddu- Akshar who is as hopeless as Jaddu in LOIs.

He is legend in the eyes of Indian pans already.  Never understood the logic.  Guy gets more respect than likes of Yuvi Raina ever got... 

Axar improved his batting but his bowling has regressed badly. 

I hope Kuldeep gets the backing on Indian decks as 3rd spinner from here on. 

[eulbninem]

Wonder how old Naseem Shah is in this video 

[vvvslaxman]

On 8/16/2023 at 12:03 AM, Austin 3:!6 said:

 

As much as I would love for us to repeat the thrashings we have given them in 2018 Asia cup but the situation is very different this time. Indian team was much better back then. We had most feared top 3 of Rohit, Dhawan and Kohli who were in their prime years. I know Kohli didnt even play that Asia cup but Pakistan couldnt even get our openers out. Our bowling was also much better then with fit and young Bumrah and inform Kul-Cha. Also, we had the chanakya named Dhoni behind the stumps. The only weakness we had back then was the middle order but our openers/no.3 were so good that it mitigated that issue. 

 

Our team now is full of trash where golden generation players have psssed their prime and young ones are playing for their place in the team. On top of that we have an entitled coach who likes to back his favorite players even though they are injured and ignoring present form. The entire vibe about this 2023 Indian team is not good.

 

I couldn't care less about Pakistan team. As long as our own team is good, like the one we had in 2018, we would thrash them. But unfortunately our team is not good this time and chances of we losing against Pakistan is high. Heck, we just lost an ODI series in Bangladesh and somehow won 2-1 against a team that failed to even qualify for world cup.

 

 

We are in transition stage. We may run into some shocking losses along the way.  They just have to hope Gill plays important matches on flat roads and he clicks.