What has Ben Stokes done in test matches outside England as an all-rounder?

[Trichromatic]

Any significant performance?

[Gollum]

Zero. Got a useless 250 on a patta in RSA where both sides scored 700. Useless 100 in Perth, match where his team was crushed. Nothing in SC, only humiliations in WI. Did ok enough with bat in NZ but Eng lost that series comfortably. 

 

When it comes to test performances outside home, Shardul Thakur the AR has a better legacy. Never mind an ATG like Jadeja. 

Edited February 10, 2024 by Gollum

[Gollum]

Ashwin's rearguard blockathon in 2021 SCG>>>>>Stokes' entire test career outside home. 

Edited February 10, 2024 by Gollum

[Majestic]

He was an England great due to being very good with bat and good with bowl. But now that he doesn't bowl, his batting is just good enough to be in the team and captaincy is certainly refreshing.

 

In terms of performance, he doesn't have anything memorable to note in Australia and India. He has great record in South Africa and that's just about it when it comes to performance away from home. A clutch know with bat in T20 World Cup Final.

 

 

Edited February 10, 2024 by Majestic

[putrevus]

Stokes is the greatest allrounder of this generation. There is no one close to him.He is an asset in all formats.

 

Injuries have caught up with him otherwise he would have been just fine with ball .

 

No everyone can be Ian Botham. 

 

 

Edited February 10, 2024 by putrevus

[Gollum]

Just now, putrevus said:

Stokes is the great allrounder of this generation. There is no one close to him.He is an asset in all formats.

 

Injuries have caught up with him otherwise he would have been just fine with ball .

 

 

Sir Jaddu is the greatest AR of modern test cricket. Don't confuse formats. 

[putrevus]

3 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Sir Jaddu is the greatest AR of modern test cricket. Don't confuse formats. 

No he is not, he is not even close to Stokes. Don't get confused with Jadeja just because he is Indian.

Edited February 10, 2024 by putrevus

[R!TTER]

This is absurd - Jadeja is the biggest(luckiest?) match winner post 2k in tests, at least in terms of W/L ratio & no one's close to him!

Opposition team Australia  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka  or West Indies  Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2011  Match result lost match  Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20  and runs scored greater than or equal to 200  Ordered by batting - bowling average (descending) Page 1 of 1 Showing 1 - 45 of 45   First Previous Next  Last  Return to query menu Cleared query menu Overall figures Player Span Mat Runs HS Bat Av 100 Wkts BBI Bowl Av 5 Ct St Ave Diff   Shakib Al Hasan (BAN) 2011-2022 22 1798 217 42.80 2 63 6/33 38.41 5 3 0 4.39   BA Stokes (ENG) 2013-2024 41 2094 155 25.53 3 88 6/99 35.73 2 28 0 -10.20   RA Jadeja (IND) 2013-2024 13 583 104 25.34 1 44 6/138 36.36 1 11 0 -11.01   R Ashwin (IND) 2011-2024 24 949 91* 21.56 0 88 6/46 33.14 2 9 0 -11.57   PJ Cummins (AUS) 2017-2024 16 460 64* 15.33 0 67 6/27 27.82 3 8 0 -12.48   CR Woakes (ENG) 2016-2022 17 777 61* 25.06 0 50 6/70 37.60 2 6 0 -12.53   VD Philander (SA) 2011-2020 17 552 52 21.23 0 41 5/70 34.04 1 1 0 -12.81   JO Holder (WI) 2014-2023 36 1564 82* 24.82 0 70 5/41 38.84 3 32 0 -14.01   MA Starc (AUS) 2011-2024 26 659 99 14.64 0 113 6/50 28.87 7 6 0 -14.23   JE Root (ENG) 2013-2024 50 3280 180* 34.52 3 25 5/8 50.76 1 58 0 -16.23   Having Ashwin by his side has helped him greatly, also Ashwin's benefitted just as well. Now admittedly the numbers can be a bit skewed depending on your "bias" but against top 8 sides he has a W/L ratio of almost 3:1 while the next best is probably Ashwin & he's primarily a bowler these days

Opposition team Australia  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka  or West Indies

Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2011

Match result won match

Qualifications runs scored greater than or equal to 500  and wickets taken greater than or equal to 50

Ordered by batting - bowling average (descending)

Page 1 of 1

Showing 1 - 13 of 13

First Previous

Next  Last

Return to query menu Cleared query menu

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	HS	Bat Av	100	Wkts	BBI	Bowl Av	5	Ct	St	Ave Diff
RA Jadeja (IND)	2013-2024	38	1606	175*	38.23	2	185	7/42	19.85	10	20	0	18.37
BA Stokes (ENG)	2015-2024	43	2859	176	42.67	6	85	6/22	26.64	2	69	0	16.02
MG Johnson (AUS)	2011-2015	18	534	92*	33.37	0	99	7/40	19.84	5	9	0	13.52
R Ashwin (IND)	2011-2024	50	1619	124	28.91	4	323	7/59	18.56	28	18	0	10.35
VD Philander (SA)	2011-2019	33	920	74	26.28	0	152	6/21	17.13	11	14	0	9.14
MM Ali (ENG)	2014-2023	28	1187	155*	31.23	1	110	6/53	23.53	4	15	0	7.70
CR Woakes (ENG)	2014-2023	17	548	137*	28.84	1	65	5/50	22.56	1	12	0	6.27
MA Starc (AUS)	2011-2024	49	1083	84	24.61	0	215	6/66	23.41	7	24	0	1.19
SCJ Broad (ENG)	2011-2023	57	1080	74*	20.37	0	256	8/15	19.99	9	23	0	0.38
PJ Cummins (AUS)	2011-2024	32	577	44*	17.48	0	158	6/23	17.65	9	16	0	-0.17

[R!TTER]

Away from home he still has an advantage!

 

Opposition team Australia  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka  or West Indies

Home or away away (home of opposition)  or neutral venue

Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2011

Match result lost match

Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20  and runs scored greater than or equal to 200

Page 1 of 1

Showing 1 - 27 of 27

First Previous

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Return to query menu Cleared query menu

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	HS	Bat Av	100	Wkts	BBI	Bowl Av	5	Ct	St	Ave Diff
Shakib Al Hasan (BAN)	2017-2022	8	655	217	40.93	1	20	6/33	40.25	1	1	0	0.68
RA Jadeja (IND)	2013-2023	10	478	104	28.11	1	30	6/138	38.03	1	10	0	-9.91
BA Stokes (ENG)	2013-2024	27	1234	120	22.85	1	52	6/99	35.05	2	19	0	-12.20
R Ashwin (IND)	2011-2023	18	661	62	20.03	0	55	6/46	33.90	1	8	0	-13.87
MA Starc (AUS)	2013-2023	17	437	99	13.65	0	77	6/50	27.58	6	3	0	-13.92
PJ Cummins (AUS)	2017-2023	11	215	50	9.77	0	46	6/91	28.15	2	7	0	-18.37
SCJ Broad (ENG)	2012-2023	29	597	58*	12.97	0	84	6/81	32.01	1	10	0	-19.03
JM Anderson (ENG)	2012-2024	31	213	23*	6.65	0	96	6/42	28.29	4	20	0	-21.63
K Rabada (SA)	2015-2022	18	266	36	8.86	0	60	4/13	32.13	0	11	0	-23.26
TA Boult (NZ)	2012-2022	23	274	26	10.53	0	77	5/57	34.49	4	10	0	-23.95

 

This includes the absolute BS 2 WTC finals on a "neutral venue" against pace heavy attacks 

Opposition team Australia  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka  or West Indies

Home or away away (home of opposition)  or neutral venue

Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2011

Match result won match

Qualifications wickets taken greater than or equal to 20  and runs scored greater than or equal to 200

Page 1 of 1

Showing 1 - 11 of 11

First Previous

Next  Last

Return to query menu Cleared query menu

Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Runs	HS	Bat Av	100	Wkts	BBI	Bowl Av	5	Ct	St	Ave Diff
MD Craig (NZ)	2014-2015	4	221	65	221.00	0	27	7/94	25.40	1	5	0	195.59
VD Philander (SA)	2012-2017	10	437	73	39.72	0	39	6/44	20.41	3	5	0	19.31
R Ashwin (IND)	2015-2023	12	525	118	32.81	2	64	7/71	21.15	5	1	0	11.65
BA Stokes (ENG)	2015-2024	16	1063	120	39.37	1	25	3/30	29.96	0	33	0	9.41
PJ Cummins (AUS)	2011-2023	9	245	44*	24.50	0	44	6/79	20.65	2	5	0	3.84
RA Jadeja (IND)	2014-2024	12	426	70*	28.40	0	42	5/152	25.50	1	4	0	2.90
MA Starc (AUS)	2012-2023	13	413	61	27.53	0	46	5/34	24.73	1	8	0	2.79
TG Southee (NZ)	2011-2021	9	253	50	23.00	0	42	5/62	20.45	1	9	0	2.54
Yasir Shah (PAK)	2014-2022	16	259	38*	17.26	0	118	8/41	21.57	10	13	0	-4.30
NM Lyon (AUS)	2011-2023	22	265	40*	17.66	0	104	8/64	23.12	5	9	0	-5.45

 

The only one with a positive W/L to his name 

[Number]

Problem with Jadeja is that even now his place is not confirmed in the test XI outside India. 

 

[R!TTER]

The problem with Stokes is that he's been far too inconsistent with bat/bowl anywhere including in Eng - now some would say that's just the way he plays but it's a convenient excuse to basically ignore his shortcoming or poor performances in tests! Jadeja on the other hand has been a consistent batter even on square turners in India lower down the order - his closest competitor this gen is Ashwin, or Shakib if you include minnows, not overrated Headingly "miracle" (DRS) winner Stokes 

[Trichromatic]

1 hour ago, putrevus said:

Stokes is the greatest allrounder of this generation. There is no one close to him.He is an asset in all formats.

 

Injuries have caught up with him otherwise he would have been just fine with ball .

 

No everyone can be Ian Botham. 

 

 

 

Undoubtedly. But which are his notable performances outside England in tests?

[Trichromatic]

17 minutes ago, Number said:

Problem with Jadeja is that even now his place is not confirmed in the test XI outside India. 

 

 

That's because presence of Ashwin and other pacers.

[Trichromatic]

1 minute ago, R!TTER said:

The problem with Stokes is that he's been far too inconsistent with bat/bowl anywhere including in Eng - now some would say that's just the way he plays but it's a convenient excuse to basically ignore his shortcoming or poor performances in tests! Jadeja on the other hand has been a consistent batter even on square turners in India lower down the order - his closest competitor this gen is Ashwin, or Shakib if you include minnows, not overrated Headingly "miracle" (DRS) winner Stokes 

 

Everytime you see England in a situation where team needs him to rise up to the ocassion outside England, you would see commentators talking about his capabilities which would never translate into actual performance.

[Majestic]

1 hour ago, Number said:

Problem with Jadeja is that even now his place is not confirmed in the test XI outside India. 

 

On what basis?

 

Ashwin only plays when Jadeja is injured.

[Majestic]

Away from home, it is close.

 

Stokes Bat Avg 33, Bowl Avg 33

Jadeja Bat Avg 31, Bowl Avg 32

 

[R!TTER]

2 minutes ago, Majestic said:

On what basis?

 

Ashwin only plays when Jadeja is injured.

That's only happened since 2020/21 - even till 2019 Oz tour Ashwin was the preferred A/R - heck Jadeja played just 1 test in 2018 Eng tour& none in SA 

 

He was at his absolute peak then, they really should've tried both of them more often over Sobers lite!

[Majestic]

14 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

That's only happened since 2020/21 - even till 2019 Oz tour Ashwin was the preferred A/R - heck Jadeja played just 1 test in 2018 Eng tour& none in SA 

 

He was at his absolute peak then, they really should've tried both of them more often over Sobers lite!

In 2020 NZ tour, Jadeja played a test ahead of Ashwin.

 

So, it is 4 years now since Jadeja is playing ahead of Ashwin. He has left Ashwin in the dust as far as meriting a place in Indian team outside Asia is concerned.

Edited February 10, 2024 by Majestic

[R!TTER]

Right & that's why I said 2020-21 it referred to the years not cricket season.

1 minute ago, Majestic said:

So, it is 4 years now since Jadeja is playing ahead of Ashwin.

Barely 4 years now - in that time he's also missed SA series twice(?) due to injuries.

[Majestic]

4 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Right & that's why I said 2020-21 it referred to the years not cricket season.

Barely 4 years now - in that time he's also missed SA series twice(?) due to injuries.

4 years is not barely. I don't think there is any debate on Jadeja 's place in the team.