BJP's vision for India

[jusarrived]

6 hours ago, The Dark Horse said:

More tax on the working class...cut slacks on the ruling class...Farmers..meh who are they?

am guessing you have skipped the last few budgets 

[zen]

39 minutes ago, Garuda said:

 

Because it wont work. And BJP knows it. That's why they have been slowly distancing itslelf from Hindutava/RSS. I had one decent Pakistani poster who had enough honesty to admit that muslims are obligated to follow Islamic law over a nation's law if both have disagreements. So anytime where there is a disagreement, there is a struggle that every normal muslim experiences. The extreme ones dont even think. This is similar to Christians but a bit different. So the Dharmic religions and the Abrahamic religions get along like water and oil. This is assuming Hindutva and RSS are supposedly have our best interests at heart. If what you say is wrong, it could be even worse.

I am not sure what their interpretation of Hindutva is. I advised what the vision should be (not is) as BJP is one of the parties promoting Hindutva 

 

We have to create a system that is fair for everyone. The process has to start somewhere

 

 

 

 

[Garuda]

27 minutes ago, zen said:

I am not sure what their interpretation of Hindutva is. I advised what the vision should be (not is) as BJP is one of the parties promoting Hindutva 

 

We have to create a system that is fair for everyone. The process has to start somewhere

 

 

 

 

I think this thread is about BJP's vision not what should be. Its your subjective opinion not reality which is what I was hinting at. It is a political ideology as far as I'm concerned but we'll see how it progresses. I'm a bit skeptical about politicians and their ideology. We have suffered much. Thanks for your input. Its a good starting place

[zen]

3 minutes ago, Garuda said:

I think this thread is about BJP's vision not what should be. Its your subjective opinion not reality which is what I was hinting at. It is a political ideology as far as I'm concerned but we'll see how it progresses. I'm a bit skeptical about politicians and their ideology. We have suffered much. Thanks for your input. Its a good starting place

Reality is Hindutva is misunderstood. Not that it should not be implemented

 

[Garuda]

8 minutes ago, zen said:

Reality is Hindutva is misunderstood. Not that it should not be implemented

 

lol. I dont want to go over this again. You say its misunderstood but the only thing you can come up with is your own opinion of what it is.

 

17 hours ago, zen said:

Hindutva has a much deeper meaning once you don’t associate the religious bigots version of it and the libtards intrepretation of it 

 

1 hour ago, zen said:

I am not sure what their interpretation of Hindutva is. I advised what the vision should be (not is) as BJP is one of the parties promoting Hindutva 

 

We have to create a system that is fair for everyone. The process has to start somewhere

. What kinda tangled webs you weave?

[zen]

12 minutes ago, Garuda said:

lol. I dont want to go over this again. You say its misunderstood but the only thing you can come up with is your own opinion of what it is.

. What kinda tangled webs you weave?

I cannot speak for the whole world, especially considering how religion is being used by many.  As for BJP, I hope they have the correct Hindutva agenda as, the concept of Ram Rajya is not new to them.  If not, we would need someone to back the correct one 

 

Some party can have garibi hatoon as its vision but only ones getting rich would be them  .... In such cases, you have to say what your version of garibi hatoon is. 

 

[Clarke]

Couldn't resist this one

 

 

 

 

Edited April 24, 2018 by Clarke

[Garuda]

50 minutes ago, zen said:

I cannot speak for the whole world, especially considering how religion is being used by many.  As for BJP, I hope they have the correct Hindutva agenda as, the concept of Ram Rajya is not new to them.  If not, we would need someone to back the correct one 

 

Some party can have garibi hatoon as its vision but only ones getting rich would be them  .... In such cases, you have to say what your version of garibi hatoon is. 

 

There;s another thread for Soina gandhi vision

[Garuda]

48 minutes ago, Clarke said:

Couldn't resist this one

 

 

 

 

Maybe that cow needs to push Pawar off the stage

[The Dark Horse]

3 hours ago, jusarrived said:

am guessing you have skipped the last few budgets 

Living in the present..

[Mariyam]

14 hours ago, jusarrived said:

if you look beyond the masala news fed to you and purely talking economics to list a few 

1)Fiscal prudence .

2)Increase Tax revenues .

3)Make India investment friendly .

 

Points 2 & 3, one can cede to the BJP as areas of achievement. The investments to India have increased dramatically, albeit still limited to a select major states. And no doubt the tax dragnet has widened.

 

But fiscal prudence? If anything, budget 2018 was as populist as they come. Nothing prudent about it. The budget could just as well have been a Congress budget. On one hand the current GoI tow tows about make in India and on the other hand the budget increases operating costs for SME level manufacturing businesses.

[Mariyam]

On 4/24/2018 at 12:48 AM, BeardedAladdin said:

Long term

1. Ram janambhoomi - #MandirWahinBanayenge

2. Article 370 - #DoodhMaangogeTohKheerDenge

3. UCC - #NoMorePseudoSecularism

Short term

Congress-mukt bharat

You may not agree with them, but you have to admit, their message is easy to understand. 

In even simpler terms, I'd say BJP thinks of India as a nation state. Congress looks at it as more of a union, but that's just my own impression - we aren't hearing from their people in the other thread. 

Do you think the BJP is serious about the UCC? If I collected a fiver, for every time a BJP spokesperson mentioned the UCC before the 2014 LS elections, I'd be a trillionaire right now. And not of the Zimbabwean variety.

However, since coming into power I haven't heard anything substantial wrt UCC. No timelines. No committee to implement the change in civil law. No special courts to handle the thousands of cases which are community specific. No nothing.

 

For the BJP, the UCC seems to be a pre election magic wand to whip up the masses into a frenzy on the lines of: 

Look, those Muslims have it so easy, the laws are biased towards them, but we are legally oppressed in our own land. Vote for BJP and we will change all that

Edited April 25, 2018 by Mariyam

[coffee_rules]

8 hours ago, Mariyam said:

Do you think the BJP is serious about the UCC? If I collected a fiver, for every time a BJP spokesperson mentioned the UCC before the 2014 LS elections, I'd be a trillionaire right now. And not of the Zimbabwean variety.

However, since coming into power I haven't heard anything substantial wrt UCC. No timelines. No committee to implement the change in civil law. No special courts to handle the thousands of cases which are community specific. No nothing.

 

For the BJP, the UCC seems to be a pre election magic wand to whip up the masses into a frenzy on the lines of: 

Look, those Muslims have it so easy, the laws are biased towards them, but we are legally oppressed in our own land. Vote for BJP and we will change all that

Look at how much opposition there is even for a minor issue like Triple-Talaq. Even staunch feminists are aying that it is a case of minority religious rights. It is stuck in RS , when BJP has numbers it can pass that bill. BJP will keep it on the agenda and will pass it when it has absolute majority.

[Garuda]

 

The part about evangelism and the foreign funded NGOs really irritates me the most; those are people that have no place in India. There should be an environment of fear, instead these bastards continue to spread their vile religion where they can. I'd love to see evangelicals get their throats cut.

I have the same feeling about foreign funded NGOs and their evangelism. But its possible to stop foreign funded NGOs by passing a law that makes it illegal. But that bolded part that you typed is very disturbing. You are neck deep in Hindutva probably even hard core hindutvadis would consider that extreme. You are just as bit of a cancer as the evangelists are. I need to take a shower again because I'm disgusted to have seen this.

[Garuda]

 

Refer to para 2 of the post you quoted. Need for people to understand Hindutva more deeply rather than the version presented by religious bigots and interpreted by libtards

You seem confused about Hindutva but this guys has is own views and not afraid to speak it. What is this but not a Hindu version of Abrahamic fundamentalism. You know the type which says you believe in our god or you die.

 

Interesting article:

 

https://swarajyamag.com/magazine/why-the-core-hindu-voter-is-upset-with-modi

 

I agree with most of it. The BJP hasn't delivered on its vision, but then again, are we being a little too impatient? Its been a mere 4 years, and the secularist institutions still have significant influence, even though its political party is in shambles.

 

The part about evangelism and the foreign funded NGOs really irritates me the most; those are people that have no place in India. There should be an environment of fear, instead these bastards continue to spread their vile religion where they can. I'd love to see evangelicals get their throats cut.

 

I have always had the feeling that the BJP isn't good for anything other than achieving a congress mukt bharat. And that seems to be the short term goal. But creating a society based on idealogy, seems a long way away. And it might not even happen under a BJP government.

 

[someone]

 

Interesting article:

 

https://swarajyamag.com/magazine/why-the-core-hindu-voter-is-upset-with-modi

 

I agree with most of it. The BJP hasn't delivered on its vision, but then again, are we being a little too impatient? Its been a mere 4 years, and the secularist institutions still have significant influence, even though its political party is in shambles.

Good article. The key thing is BJP supporters are aspirational, that's very different from the various other parties. This bring accountability, and no wonder this government is so much scrutinized. Wherever, BJP is in power, everything matters. This includes development, progress, and even lives. That can't be said about non-BJP governments where things are rarely scrutinized to such extent.

 

Imo, before 2014, India was all about minorities fears. That was the only thing we heard day in and out. But today, we have the majority aspirations and fears, together with the minorities aspirations and fears as well. So things matter with BJP and aspirations play a big part.

[Khalpat]

Congress or BJP, I am not sure whether we have different versions of vision for India. India is too big and diverse country that differences of opinion on one or two matters can drive the vision.

 

Let's look at two sectors, Social and Economic. After 1989, when Mandal commission was implemented almost all government from Rao to Vajpayee or MMS or Modi have followed leftist model in social sector ie government took the overall responsibility by continuing reservation by talking about "Dalit, Shoshit, Vanchit". Is there any change in the policy? I didn't find any.

 

Economic sector, same policies year after year , government after government from 1991. Has there been any change? Someone brings Aadhar other one implement it. Some one initiates GST, other one implement it. Some one starts infrastructure other one continues it.

 

Kashmir, any change ? Pallet gun was used by Chidambaram and by Rijiju too.

 

Not sure what vision we are talking about. Yes, there might be differences in few policies and the way they got implemented but that doesn't change the vision. Even on Ram Mandir, it was Rao who was PM when he allowed demolition and it was Rajeev who was PM who actually opened the door. Not sure what Modi would have done if he was PM during 1992.

 

Implementation of policies, corruption, efficiency etc. Might be different and what spokesperson of parties say also might be different  but no change in vision as far as different government are concerned. "Sab mile huay hain jee". 

 

Edited May 2, 2018 by Khalpat

[Khalpat]

 

Progress is slowed down by democratic process. Political parties prioritize winning elections instead of actually implementing a vision. 

 

I have said it many times, and I'll say it again, democracy doesn't work in developing countries. 

What if the vision of the person or authority is biased. Let's say if there is an authotarian and person incharge hates Tamilians or dislikes Bihari or have strong opinion against same sex marriage. We all will be on mercy of one person.

This might work in some country to an extent but for country as diverse as India, Democracy is best form of governance.

 

This democracy makes Rahul Gandhi visit temple or makes Mr Modi stop speech during Azaan even though they personally are not willing to do it.

[maniac]

On 4/24/2018 at 1:05 AM, Garuda said:

Hindutva is a political ideology. Just like Islam where politics and religion is inseperable. Visions of Ram Rajya strikes terror in the hearts of minorites and hindus who dont have a history of worshipping Ram. Whatever happened to Unity in Diversity. Ram burnig Ravan ceremony is a celebration only prevalent in the north.

You are talkingthe language of the  Marxists and pseudo liberals...Hindutva is a "nationalist" ideology not a political one....sure just like every other thing out there it can be politicized.....True  Hindutva doesn't care about which god you pray to or which custom you follow.

 

Building a mandir for Ram,is kind of like reclaiming out history  and our essence,Was Ram born there or not is a different debate but the point here is a foregin invader pillaged a place of worship of the locals,the locals have now got back what belonged to them...that is the bigger picture.

 

To quote Sanjeev Sanyal which I really liked ......every history is written with a bias,there can't be a neutral history no matter how hard you try but at least our history can be told with our bias instead of  foreign historians.....now before you misunderstand my post,I am not saying to make up **** and invent history but facts can be told from our perspective and that has not been done in centuries.

 

For eg; Fact is a temple was destroyed....Babar's historian might say Babar broke the temple as he was against idol worship etc as per the true tenets of Islam ., The locals might say he came there to loot the wealth of the temples......both sides are correct but who tells it makes a difference and you decide who should tell it.

Edited May 3, 2018 by maniac

[randomGuy]

On 4/24/2018 at 4:13 AM, BeardedAladdin said:

The official soundtrack for this thread:

 

 

Modi can be irritating to many people. But if all dharmics (and many right thinking Muslims and Christians) cannot unite under yogi who is a fantastic personality ( fantastic orator specially) , then we are hopeless as people. Maybe he will be PM candidate in 2024 and we will find out then.