'Delhi Chalo' movement/farmers protest

[Khota]

22 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

Tell me where I said such a thing. stop putting words into my mouth and stop being such a cheerleader. Anybody who sits on PM chair must answer to claims whether they are fat cows are not. I used jallikattu to see how the majority can be wrong. Is your kambala up and running now. You're welcome. You should thank the people of TN for that.

 

Edit: Where did I make it a personal argument

Jaillikatu is Indian equivalent of running of bulls. If I have time I would love to participate. Kepp on enjoying your tradition. Haters are gonna hate.

[coffee_rules]

2 minutes ago, Khota said:

When you dont have people supporting your views you call it silent majority. That is a term that I use when I have no support. The issue is just not two states all states and their farmers need to be gauranteed MSP. All of them.

 

The silent majority will be effective like they did in 2014, 2019. MSP for all crops can't be guaranteed. It is done for 2 crops majorly in PH which takes most of it, Rest are under poverty and need reforms like these. Even those 2 crops govt said MSP is guaranteed, but these protesters want only to repeal all laws or they will keep stealing generators out of Jio towers.

[coffee_rules]

41 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

Tell me where I said such a thing. stop putting words into my mouth and stop being such a cheerleader. Anybody who sits on PM chair must answer to claims whether they are fat cows are not. I used jallikattu to see how the majority can be wrong. Is your kambala up and running now. You're welcome. You should thank the people of TN for that.

 

You said it..:

 

Quote

I would rather have these corrupt zamindaars and some individual farmers who are more in number than big corporations that have political connections who can create an oligarchy like the US and other western nations. 

Quote

Edit: Where did I make it a personal argument

 

You don't fail once to bring about a point that this guy lives in the west and don't know how democracies work! I have lived in India for first 21 yeats in a middle-class family (even now), so, don't bring an argument on where one lives, it has to be on its merit.

 

Having a few corporations invest in cold storage or infrastructure where Farmers can store and bargain a better price than settle for APMCs and MSPs doesn't mean Monsatoization of the whole agrarian sector, Oh! the evil corporates are coming to get your land and what you eat! This is nothing but fearmongering

 

I am not a cheerleader, I hate it that the BJP govt is spineless and bending to some of the negotiations like stubble burning. SC of India has proclaimed that the stubble burning causes pollution in Delhi and this govt relented to remove penalties for stubble burning in these negotiations . Now more bans on fire crackers during diwali and dia burning will also be banned by Kejriwal and Mamtadi. Anti-CAA and this protests have given a model to get to streets and cause incovenience to people and get their way.  

Edited December 31, 2020 by coffee_rules

[Khota]

42 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

 

The silent majority will be effective like they did in 2014, 2019. MSP for all crops can't be guaranteed. It is done for 2 crops majorly in PH which takes most of it, Rest are under poverty and need reforms like these. Even those 2 crops govt said MSP is guaranteed, but these protesters want only to repeal all laws or they will keep stealing generators out of Jio towers.

and the govt. does not give it in writing. Seems like you are having selective problems who make little money but no problem with PSU's that loot govt. I see.

[coffee_rules]

4 minutes ago, Khota said:

and the govt. does not give it in writing. Seems like you are having selective problems who make little money but no problem with PSU's that loot govt. I see.

 

@LordPrabhzy has already clarified you umpteen times, and still you repeat it every time. 
this spineless govt was ready to give it in writing that MSP will stay and still they are protesting with all kinds of demands and now only wants the laws to repealed. Come Jan4 there is more talks with Red unions and who knows they might accept all demands and shove the reforms back up the 94% poor farmers for the rest of the country.

[Real McCoy]

On 12/30/2020 at 6:15 PM, Real McCoy said:

@Under_Score@Khota@Singh bling I came to know from a close friend that his friend in college who was a top scorer in engineering who left all the high paying jobs to farm in the land he purchased was found dead in a railway track. He worked in Bangalore and his farm was not far from there. This happened a couple of years ago. I'm not even going into the politics here but this is how things are now these days no matter which party is at top. This large scale factory farming is bad for us in the long run. Yes zamindars are bad but what's happening here is small fish being swallowed by the big fish. I would rather have these corrupt zamindaars and some individual farmers who are more in number than big corporations that have political connections who can create an oligarchy like the US and other western nations. I have also heard from an older guy that you cannot buy any land in western TN without the "blessings" of a certain Kannadiga ex-businessman turned spiritual guru who runs an ashram there. @Jimmy Cliff , please share any information if you have on this

You left the previous sentence to paint me as a pro-zamindars guy. Whether that was an accident or by intention I don't know. I'll give the benefit of doubt to you. The bolded part provides context. While zamindars are bad they are not as bad as large scale farming. THats whay I was trying to say.

1 hour ago, Real McCoy said:

you want deregulation but want to be overseen by strong govts There is no perfect govt with perfect people. you need to know that living in a country that has more knowledge about democracy. I know how a common Indian thinks and how a politician coming out of the ranks of the populace thinks. This is doomed to be a failure. Better prevent this now than regret later. 22 states accpeting it is not an indication that its good. 24 states dont celebrate jallikattu. Does that mean SC can ban it under some psuedoethical org like PETA. The will of the people need to be accepted and modi hasnt done enough to quell any reservations and fears amongst the people. Its his duty to do this

Here again I was pointing that you should know more since you are educated and living in a democratic country that knows more about democracy than the common man in India. I'm saying the exact opposite of what you said in this bolded part of the following quote from you. I may not have phrased the sentence the right way but this is what I meant. and my main point was there is no perfect govt as the people themselves are not perfect as you were of the opinion that strong govts can control any abuse of law. If that is getting too personal for you, you should talk to randomguy and sarcasm and see how nasty they get when you disagree with them. And according to you randomguy is reasonable. oh well

17 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

 

You said it..:

 

 

You don't fail once to bring about a point that this guy lives in the west and don't know how democracies work! I have lived in India for first 21 yeats in a middle-class family (even now), so, don't bring an argument on where one lives, it has to be on its merit.

 

Having a few corporations invest in cold storage or infrastructure where Farmers can store and bargain a better price than settle for APMCs and MSPs doesn't mean Monsatoization of the whole agrarian sector, Oh! the evil corporates are coming to get your land and what you eat! This is nothing but fearmongering

 

I am not a cheerleader, I hate it that the BJP govt is spineless and bending to some of the negotiations like stubble burning. SC of India has proclaimed that the stubble burning causes pollution in Delhi and this govt relented to remove penalties for stubble burning in these negotiations . Now more bans on fire crackers during diwali and dia burning will also be banned by Kejriwal and Mamtadi. Anti-CAA and this protests have given a model to get to streets and cause incovenience to people and get their way.  

 

[Khota]

8 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

 

@LordPrabhzy has already clarified you umpteen times, and still you repeat it every time. 
this spineless govt was ready to give it in writing that MSP will stay and still they are protesting with all kinds of demands and now only wants the laws to repealed. Come Jan4 there is more talks with Red unions and who knows they might accept all demands and shove the reforms back up the 94% poor farmers for the rest of the country.

Those are the excuses. They need to gaurantee MSP for all farmers all over India.

[coffee_rules]

@Real McCoy I misunderstood about what you were saying. I was reading so many responses and missed it. 

Regarding evil PETA, you are preaching to the choir. SC didn't ban Jallikattu based on PETA, but on basis of some of the archaic articles in our beloved constitution. We have some many colonial time laws , PETA employs all charity money in expensive lawyers who dig up some gray areas in the constitution to get bans on only Hindu customs and traditions. The track record is for every one to see.  I don't see the equivalence in this issue, but maybe you do. This is not an organic movement as being perceived by some and as projected by the MSM, just like the Shaheen Bagh protests. It's all political and India is always in a election mode, where oppisition tries to hurt the govt for some election in some remote corner of India. It's a never ending cycle. 

[coffee_rules]

11 minutes ago, Khota said:

Those are the excuses. They need to gaurantee MSP for all farmers all over India.

 

DO you know MSP is decided bt states? Some states opted for APMC/MSP model, some of the farmers' friendly open wholesale markets., It can work for staple diet crops and not for all the crops one can grow in India. Do you realize what they are demanding?

How can center guarantee MSP for all states for all markets? It will be called federalism if Center does enact such a law.

[SecondSlip]

@coffee_rules 

 

How much is BJP IT Cell paying you for blindly defending your godfather Modi and everything he does? 

   

[coffee_rules]

9 minutes ago, SecondSlip said:

@coffee_rules 

 

How much is BJP IT Cell paying you for blindly defending your godfather Modi and everything he does? 

   

0.02c every post I make here. 

[Real McCoy]

2 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

@Real McCoy I misunderstood about what you were saying. I was reading so many responses and missed it. 

Regarding evil PETA, you are preaching to the choir. SC didn't ban Jallikattu based on PETA, but on basis of some of the archaic articles in our beloved constitution. We have some many colonial time laws , PETA employs all charity money in expensive lawyers who dig up some gray areas in the constitution to get bans on only Hindu customs and traditions. The track record is for every one to see.  I don't see the equivalence in this issue, but maybe you do. This is not an organic movement as being perceived by some and as projected by the MSM, just like the Shaheen Bagh protests. It's all political and India is always in a election mode, where oppisition tries to hurt the govt for some election in some remote corner of India. It's a never ending cycle. 

If we see it from the individual farmer, we can see what their worries are. They have a problem with zamindaars but are now encountering a bigger animal with large scale farming. I see where you are coming from that some of these protests are engineered by the opposition who are just playing on the emotions of farmers and maybe are in cahoots with the richer zamindaars. That has been the bane of Indian politics from what I've been seeing to blow up whatever issue into election mode scenario.

Here's where I see the equivalence between Jallikattu and these farmer's protests. Jallikattu protests were organized by the people and the youngsters were smarter to not allow movie stars and politics into the protests but somehow at the end they bust into the scene. The movie stars were allowed to be in the group but weren't allowed mic time. We can discuss about it in another thread but don't want to derail this thread as it was discussed too many times already.

These protests seem to be a mix of both the truth and subversive elements. One of the videos I found to be genuine because the speaker was emotional while the other was suspicious as the speakers were smiling (WTF farmers are dying and you are having a picnic like atmosphere out there). And one of them where hindi based questions were answered with an hinglish response clearly betraying the interviewee's non-farmer background. How many farmers that we know that can speak english at all let alone speak it well. And I saw one of them with green and white topis. Could that be a congressi?

But there is some truth element to farmers dying and not getting paid enough and this kind of US style free market scenario will not work out in India. Even in TN, farmers tried this protest in Delhi on a smaller level. Modi didn't even pay any attention. He didn't even give a short talk to them. There are several farmer suicides in the south nobody pays any attention. Maybe if Punjab and Haryana does something, there will be a domino effect on the other states too like Jallikattu helped Kambala

[coffee_rules]

You can't win 2 GEs showing the religion card. Just because Modi is unabashedly Hindu , opposition and his haters from Kaneda think that he is playing the religion card. None of them voting for Modi are voting based on religion card. People in 2019 voted across caste lines admitted even by lutyens media by the likes of Rajdeep and Shekar Coupta. If people want to associate him with the 2002 propaganda, it is at their own expense, the more they do, he will comeback in 2024 as well  RW is the most unhappy with Modi , BTW.

[coffee_rules]

1 minute ago, Under_Score said:

Alright, seems like you simply get high on Modi-ventures, I have to make arrangements for New Year's Daaru party this evening to get high.....

Cheers.

[Khota]

8 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

0.02c every post I make here. 

Is it tax deductible?

[Khota]

9 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

@Real McCoy I misunderstood about what you were saying. I was reading so many responses and missed it. 

Regarding evil PETA, you are preaching to the choir. SC didn't ban Jallikattu based on PETA, but on basis of some of the archaic articles in our beloved constitution. We have some many colonial time laws , PETA employs all charity money in expensive lawyers who dig up some gray areas in the constitution to get bans on only Hindu customs and traditions. The track record is for every one to see.  I don't see the equivalence in this issue, but maybe you do. This is not an organic movement as being perceived by some and as projected by the MSM, just like the Shaheen Bagh protests. It's all political and India is always in a election mode, where oppisition tries to hurt the govt for some election in some remote corner of India. It's a never ending cycle. 

I am pretty sure BJP is above all that when they were in opposition.

[ravishingravi]

 

[Khota]

15 hours ago, MultiB48 said:

Progress is complicated ,we have had a lot of brain drain and global finances are controlled by international agencies who can easily reduce your ratings, so one has to play ball with them .

 

 

Identity politics is central to the politics of every major democratic country ,India is not unique in this regard .We have already been divided on the basis of religion and without a strong Hindu identity we will be weakened by regional ,caste based infighting and proselytization.

 

Rw Hindus ,can't say all ,are quite pro Sikh and Israel,though things might be changing now but Sikhs aren't that sure and seem suspicious of our intentions...

 

Sikhs trust 99% of Hindus. it is 1% that they are not sure of.

 

Unfortunately an economic issue has been turned into a religious one by BJP. It is not one state issue, it is not UP, Punjab and haryana issue, it is an economic issue.

 

I can tell you Modi is still well liked by majority of sikhs but now they trust Kejriwal little bit more. The interesting thing is they don't trust captain and Badal as much as Kejriwal. That should tell you it is not religion at play here.

[Khota]

7 hours ago, ravishingravi said:

 

China has lifted its poor by increasing their income x3 more than Indian counterparts since mid 90's.

China is doing a bette job of wealth distribution whereas India is heading towards oligarchy.

[Yoda-esque]

You can't win 2 GEs showing the religion card. Just because Modi is unabashedly Hindu , opposition and his haters from Kaneda think that he is playing the religion card. None of them voting for Modi are voting based on religion card. People in 2019 voted across caste lines admitted even by lutyens media by the likes of Rajdeep and Shekar Coupta. If people want to associate him with the 2002 propaganda, it is at their own expense, the more they do, he will comeback in 2024 as well  RW is the most unhappy with Modi , BTW.

Let them keep doing it,these jokers have no sense of reality at ground level.He will win again.