Why didn't Malinga have a career like Bumrah?

[rkt.india]

5 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

Almost all countries have stopped producing good batsmen.  Fab 4 is now Fab 3 lol.  Babar is catching up. OUtside this we hardly have any good batsmen. Guy like Rahane would have never found a spot in the MO. Ishant's average is testimony lol Career average 32.22. Since 2010 31.22. Since 2016  - 23.69.  

It tells you that pitches have been more bowling friendly in the last 5 years

[Lord]

1 minute ago, rkt.india said:

It tells you that pitches have been more bowling friendly in the last 5 years

 

also the impact of T20s. Batsmen can't concentrate for long.

[vvvslaxman]

4 hours ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

So you are saying Ishant got better due to poor batting standards.

 

Is that argument applicable to Ashwin as well? Averaged 31 in his first 25 tests, since 2015 averaging 23. 

Your average don't drop by 10 points in 5 years. Have you looked at the batsmen he dismissed since 2016. Barstow, butler top the list.  Two average test batsmen

Root once. Kane once. Smith 0 time. In 2000 he bowled spells like he did to Ponting. Probably rewarded better now for that spell. I don't deny he has made some.changes. But batting standard has also gone down for all the countries.

[vvvslaxman]

9 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

Can happen ,likes of ponting,Hayden,langer,laxman all had ordinary times in the 90s and then piled it on in the 2000s

 

Batsmen reach their peak at 30 typically.  Ishant maintaining an average of 23 for the last 5 years is not like that.  Anyway this is about Malinga. I bet his average would be a tad better in this era assuming he is maintaining fitness and he didn't limit himself to LOI bowler.  He himself regretted not having been able to play more Tests due to Knee injuries.

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/lasith-malinga-it-makes-me-sad-that-i-can-t-play-tests-anymore-589364

 

 

[Jay]

2 hours ago, Khota said:

Bumrah is a beneficiary of Indian system. He has great surrounding cast around him and the pressure on the opposition is relentless.

 

Anyone who thinks the Indian pace attack in england was not the best in cricket history is delusional.

Best in history? Best Asian pace attack ever? Definitely. 

 

But not Best in history yet bro. 

 

Will be about 4th for now. 

 

Potential is there to be 2 or 3 in the future. 

 

West Indian goat attack 

Aussies of 2000-2007

Then either india current attack or saffer attack of 2009-2015

Aussie attack of current. 

[vvvslaxman]

4 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

Can happen with pacers as well ,like Anderson,roach,zak.

 

Anderson averages 21 in the last 5 years. From 34 to 39. It is hard to imagine any bowler having a peak at this age unless he is bowling to a bunch of rubbish batsmen. 

[vvvslaxman]

Just now, MultiB48 said:

Same with batsmen as well,when they pile it on it's due to rubbish bowling.

 

True. But when you can't pile it on against rubbish bowling what does that tell you about them?

[Jay]

6 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

True. But when you can't pile it on against rubbish bowling what does that tell you about them?

Works both ways. Drs changed the way batsmen play. It made a humongous difference. 

 

2000 era was flat pitch era. That's why we saw huge scores. 

 

Even vs weak n.z sides we were bowled out for less than 100 in both innings iirc in swinging pitches. 

[vvvslaxman]

Just now, Jay said:

Works both ways. Drs changed the way batsmen play. It made a humongous difference. 

 

2000 era was flat pitch era. That's why we saw huge scores. 

 

Even vs weak n.z sides we were bowled out for less than 100 in both innings iirc in swinging pitches. 

 

I think it got introduced in 2008. Southee was averaging only 31 up until 2016. After that he is averaging 24. I can't imagine DRS suddenly became more useful in the last 5 years.  Anderson boosted his average in the last 5. So did Ishant.  Just look at the names. Tell me which one is going to be a legend for their country?  We have one Root, one Kohli, one Smith, one Kane. Baring a very few exceptions battling line up is clueless against both spin and pace. 

[Jay]

7 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

I think it got introduced in 2008. Southee was averaging only 31 up until 2016. After that he is averaging 24. I can't imagine DRS suddenly became more useful in the last 5 years.  Anderson boosted his average in the last 5. So did Ishant.  Just look at the names. Tell me which one is going to be a legend for their country?  We have one Root, one Kohli, one Smith, one Kane. Baring a very few exceptions battling line up is clueless against both spin and pace. 

You are looking at names. There is just much better quality bowlers in this era. Especially depth wise. 

 

Every team has good backups an good support cast. Top teams anyway. 

 

Depends entirely on pitches and conditions. 

 

I have seen india get blown away on swinging pitches in 2000 era. 

 

Sacchu himself was Anderson bunny. Sacchu wasn't good vs spin of Monty either. 

 

South africa had one great player who made a huge difference from 2006-2012. Jacques kalis. But even in his case johnson and Harris etc tormented him on relatively docile tracks. 

 

Transpose all this great players and make them play vs curre r bowlers. They will struggle badly. 

[vvvslaxman]

Just now, MultiB48 said:

If they are bowling well how can they be rubbish.Also conditions play a big role in cricket,even likes of ponting used to struggle big time in india.

 

That is why i chose bowlers who bowled in both periods. Can you bring up comparable names of the players that played in the 2000s?  One Labuchane won't make a summer.   Apart from Ashwin we don't have many great spinners nowadays. We had Warne/kumble/Murali even McGill was very good.  

 

[Jay]

I can juxtapose stats from particular period and make a mediocre player look world class. We can all nitpick. 

 

Fact of the matter Is bowlers are better now. Much harder to face the quality of attacks we see now. 

 

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

two different bowlers with different priorities 

[vvvslaxman]

1 minute ago, Jay said:

You are looking at names. There is just much better quality bowlers in this era. Especially depth wise. 

 

Every team has good backups an good support cast. Top teams anyway. 

 

Depends entirely on pitches and conditions. 

 

I have seen india get blown away on swinging pitches in 2000 era. 

 

Sacchu himself was Anderson bunny. Sacchu wasn't good vs spin of Monty either. 

 

South africa had one great player who made a huge difference from 2006-2012. Jacques kalis. But even in his case johnson and Harris etc tormented him on relatively docile tracks. 

 

Transpose all this great players and make them play vs curre r bowlers. They will struggle badly. 

 

Name one team that has a decent set of batsmen right now. All are weak.  So many bowlers improved their average in the last 5 or 6 years. Thakur is averaging 22 now. If the batting units are like this. He will continue enjoying sub 30 bowling average. Shami 24 in the last 5.

[vvvslaxman]

5 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

two different bowlers with different priorities 

 

Yes that is one important reason. He limited himself to an ODI bowler. Actually one of the worst in maintaining fitness. Consistent with Srilankan fitness history. Mendis, Rantunga, Aravinda. 

[Jay]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

Name one team that has a decent set of batsmen right now. All are weak.  So many bowlers improved their average in the last 5 or 6 years. Thakur is averaging 22 now. If the batting units are like this. He will continue enjoying sub 30 bowling average. Shami 24 in the last 5.

Bowlers made them look bad. 

 

All those past greats will be made to look just as inferior. 

 

Bowling is superior now.

[maniac]

10 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

Already did with the likes of ponting ,or do you mean someone who played well back then and are struggling now ,since that's quite hard to find, as a struggling aged player wont be allowed to continue,only young players are given that leeway. but if you go down that route likes of sachin ,sehwag ,laxman,gambhir all played well in the 2000s and struggled later on.

2007 (T20 era) onwards is the highest benchmark for cricket because take someone like Starc,Bumrah, Shami or cummins. They play all 3 formats, IPL etc (before RKT counters me Starc hasn’t played IPl in a while. I know ), they are expected to field just like anyone else on the team. Those days of Curtly Ambrose/ Walsh trying to stop the ball with his shoe or Srinath throwing underarm from the boundary are over.

 

Batsmen have to adapt to 3 different formats be it mentally or physically or technically and maintain the performance required for those formats.

 

Cricket is way too demanding now and also with more money these players have more accountability and are under a lot more pressure.

 

There is no guarantee that Bradman or Richards would make it or fail in the modern era but the modern day batsmen and bowlers would be more successful in the bygone era on their pure mental and physical strength   alone.

Edited September 14, 2021 by maniac

[vvvslaxman]

25 minutes ago, maniac said:

2007 (T20 era) onwards is the highest benchmark for cricket because take someone like Starc,Bumrah, Shami or cummins. They play all 3 formats, IPL etc (before RKT counters me Starc hasn’t played IPl in a while. I know ), they are expected to field just like anyone else on the team. Those days of Curtly Ambrose/ Walsh trying to stop the ball with his shoe or Srinath throwing underarm from the boundary are over.

 

Batsmen have to adapt to 3 different formats be it mentally or physically or technically and maintain the performance required for those formats.

 

Cricket is way too demanding now and also with more money these players have more accountability and are under a lot more pressure.

 

There is no guarantee that Bradman or Richards would make it or fail in the modern era but the modern day batsmen and bowlers would be more successful in the bygone era on their pure mental and physical strength   alone.

 

If Thakur can do it. 3 fifties in challenging situation :) Bumrah/Shami also batted well. May be main batsmen suck these days. Sam curran saved a couple of tests with bat. And also we struggled get rid of Jamieson in NZ on his debut series.

[rollingstoned]

3 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

That is why i chose bowlers who bowled in both periods. Can you bring up comparable names of the players that played in the 2000s?  One Labuchane won't make a summer.   Apart from Ashwin we don't have many great spinners nowadays. We had Warne/kumble/Murali even McGill was very good.  

 

you might have a point but is there a stat to indicate that average scores batting in any innings are lower now than they were in the first decade of the century? It would mean that the bowlers bowling then are even better than most rate them if that is the case.

[Khota]

4 hours ago, Jay said:

Best in history? Best Asian pace attack ever? Definitely. 

 

But not Best in history yet bro. 

 

Will be about 4th for now. 

 

Potential is there to be 2 or 3 in the future. 

 

West Indian goat attack 

Aussies of 2000-2007

Then either india current attack or saffer attack of 2009-2015

Aussie attack of current. 

I beg to disagree.