From being a white ball minnow for almost a decade ( mid 90s to mid 2000s) - the rise of England in all white ball cricket is something BCCI should look upto.

[rangeelaraja]

England is easily the most improved white ball team. The way they have gone about constructing their white ball bench strength and their attacking approach is a bit reminiscent of Lanka of yore.

 

Even at our best our batting has been top heavy. England has smoking guns 1-8. 

 

Again, it is a shame that with all the resources at our disposal, the BCCI is ZERO in terms of planning and team building. Anything outside the commercial aspect, they have zero vision. 

[kepler37b]

48 minutes ago, rangeelaraja said:

England is easily the most improved white ball team. The way they have gone about constructing their white ball bench strength and their attacking approach is a bit reminiscent of Lanka of yore.

 

Even at our best our batting has been top heavy. England has smoking guns 1-8. 

 

Again, it is a shame that with all the resources at our disposal, the BCCI is ZERO in terms of planning and team building. Anything outside the commercial aspect, they have zero vision. 

Cannot blame BCCI. As a nation we are piss poor in organization. Look at our town planning and traffic 

 

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by kepler37b

[aditya19]

More than sl they remind me of india 2011 team..batsman having belief to chase any score..india went in reverse direction our improved bowlers made the batsman lazy.

[sage]

forget mid 2000s. even in the early 2010s they had a top 4/5 of cook/strauss/trott/bell

Edited November 9, 2021 by sage

[The Realist]

Yeah I would take it easy on the kool-aid. Only in the last few years have Eng developed into a good side. And once the current crop of players goes there is nothing of significance coming through, nabbing players from other countries does not count.

 

Prior to that they were a joke and used to lose to the Netherlands at tournaments. 

[cricketfan28]

England Management is a hack specialist.

[Jay]

I would rather have test series wins in England and Australia anyday over a t20 WC. An odi WC is special but is it really all that special compared to an overseas test series win? I don't personally feel it is.

 

Test reigns supreme. 

T20 is for shitty teams to excel like Pakistan. That's their only window of opportunity to salvage something. 

 

Odi WC yes is equally important as tests but I certainly wouldn't want to get butchered in a test series to win the world cup like Dhoni did in 2011-2013. 

 

Thats why I always said we need to have t20 separate captains. It's a different format ffs. LoI different captain. Tests different. Look how much of a difference it made for England. 

 

Enough with sooperstar culture and backward thinking. Like urine move forward. Don't be like feces and crap backwards like Pakistanis. 

[sage]

2 hours ago, The Realist said:

Yeah I would take it easy on the kool-aid. Only in the last few years have Eng developed into a good side. And once the current crop of players goes there is nothing of significance coming through, nabbing players from other countries does not count.

 

Prior to that they were a joke and used to lose to the Netherlands at tournaments. 

nonsense they have incredible depth now

[vvvslaxman]

You need multi dimensional players. You cannot play with one dimensional players. If you have 5 bowlers who can't bat to save their lives or 5 batsmen who can't  bowl to save their lives you are putting yourself under huge pressure of having a near perfect match every single time.  Look at England

 

Stokes/Moeen Ali both are all rounders.  Woakes/Rashid/Archer more than capable bat.  They have plethora of such players with multi skills. They are not the first side to have a team like that. 1983 world cup Indian squad had variety of all rounders. 2011 world cup winning side had a lot of bowlers.  One dimensional hacks have to be extremely consistent. It is not the approach that is the issue. Problem is if top order fails what do we do?  The so called fake all rounders are unreliable.

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/icc-cricket-world-cup-2019-1144415/england-vs-new-zealand-final-1144530/full-scorecard

 

Same England was 86/4 in 23.1 overs in the final. You think current India would recover and tie the game? No way.  

 

 

 

 

[sage]

7 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

You need multi dimensional players. You cannot play with one dimensional players. If you have 5 bowlers who can't bat to save their lives or 5 batsmen who can't  bowl to save their lives you are putting yourself under huge pressure of having a near perfect match every single time.  Look at England

 

Stokes/Moeen Ali both are all rounders.  Woakes/Rashid/Archer more than capable bat.  They have plethora of such players with multi skills. They are not the first side to have a team like that. 1983 world cup Indian squad had variety of all rounders. 2011 world cup winning side had a lot of bowlers.  One dimensional hacks have to be extremely consistent. It is not the approach that is the issue. Problem is if top order fails what do we do?  The so called fake all rounders are unreliable.

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/icc-cricket-world-cup-2019-1144415/england-vs-new-zealand-final-1144530/full-scorecard

 

Same England was 86/4 in 23.1 overs in the final. You think current India would recover and tie the game? No way.  

 

 

 

 

why do you think our batsmen dont care about bowling part time anymore?

[sensible-indian]

 

12 hours ago, The Realist said:

Yeah I would take it easy on the kool-aid. Only in the last few years have Eng developed into a good side. And once the current crop of players goes there is nothing of significance coming through, nabbing players from other countries does not count.

 

Prior to that they were a joke and used to lose to the Netherlands at tournaments. 

Their success is not due to players only (though they have some amazinggg hitters).

Their mindset is amazing.

 

They have understood 50s and 100s in ODIs are completely meaningless these days if it means players start slow.

 

They were down in the dumps in the WC 2019 but they stuck to their guns and with Roy coming in, they blew apart everyone else.

 

Even in the finals, while Stokes played slow and held the innings, Buttler's blitzkreig in that finals kept them in the game.

 

They had luck in the finals but if we are all honest, they deserved the WC more than NZ.

Edited November 10, 2021 by sensible-indian

[mani sha]

Few pointers here 

 

- india got lucky to have Sachin sehwag and yuvi in same team with dhoni to win the wc . 
- india approach to odi has been ok . We have missed out cos of fanboy culture . Our top 3 have stifled growth of our lower order . 
 

england have improved but rules of game changed . Spin is no longer important . Two white balls and u have england as wc champions. It’s no coincidence that the lack of spin in white ball cricket has helped nz and england . 
 

indias only issue is t20 cricket . We are slowly changing our approach . We will be in final next year provided we play players in form 

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

23 hours ago, rangeelaraja said:

Even at our best our batting has been top heavy. England has smoking guns 1-8. 

So you're saying guys like Pant, Pandya, Suryakumar Yadav etc. are useless.

[sensible-indian]

1 minute ago, TNAmarkFromIndia said:

So you're saying guys like Pant, Pandya, Suryakumar Yadav etc. are useless.

They are not useless but if you barely give them any chances to bat and then throw them in a tourney and expect them to perform in a crisis, thats very hard.

 

In bilaterals, our top 3 scores every run (batting slowly at first) and we win.

 

In tourneys, pressure gets to the top 3, they get out and leave the tough job for others to do.

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

1 minute ago, sensible-indian said:

They are not useless but if you barely give them any chances to bat and then throw them in a tourney and expect them to perform in a crisis, thats very hard.

They all played IPL before WC. Not like they had no match practice in pressure situations before this.

[sensible-indian]

Just now, TNAmarkFromIndia said:

They all played IPL before WC. Not like they had no match practice in pressure situations before this.

 

Every post of yours has this video tagged.

 

----

 

IPL is different from international cricket.

 

Their roles might be a bit different too.

 

The bowlers are different.

 

The pressure is different (in a tourney).

 

There is a reason team building is such a big deal.

 

Or else anyone can assemble a list of best performers, put them in a team, pack them off to play a tourney and win it.

 

But it doesn't work that way.

[Bigg Brother]

Not mid-2000s,they were minnow till 2014. Australia literally used to bully them. Amazing how post-2015, they beat Australia every now and then without breaking a sweat. 

[TNAmarkFromIndia]

Just now, sensible-indian said:

Every post of yours has this video tagged.

Guess you don't know what a signature is.

 

1 minute ago, sensible-indian said:

IPL is different from international cricket.

 

Their roles might be a bit different too.

Pant, Pandya, Suryakumar Yadav mostly had the same roles for their franchises that they had for India in the WC. Again, can't use that excuse.

[sensible-indian]

3 minutes ago, TNAmarkFromIndia said:

Guess you don't know what a signature is.

 

Pant, Pandya, Suryakumar Yadav mostly had the same roles for their franchises that they had for India in the WC. Again, can't use that excuse.

1. A video signature slows down the page and makes the posts hard to read. Especially mobile.

 

2. Again, it's not an excuse. Plus, most of the big hitting in IPL is outsourced to West Indies players and foreigners. Can't do the same in international cricket. That's just one use case.