BeautifulGame Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 They choked in 15 finals when Ganguly was captain and not when Dhoni became a captain. There was Dravid who captained the team for 3 years and we saw huge success in that period where we mae a world record of 17 chases in a row. You are certainly mixing up things from Ganguly's tenure to later when Dhoni became captain. Actually, we were beating every team before 2007 WC and that set back was more due to complacency rather than because the team was poor. Dravid captained us in 1 world cup and 1 Champions trophy Got knocked out of both in humiliation.The champions trophy was at home .
coffee_rules Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 16 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said: Dravid captained us in 1 world cup and 1 Champions trophy Got knocked out of both in humiliation.The champions trophy was at home . Under dravid we won a test series in WI and Eng. Good enough for a test team that is an away bunny.
BeautifulGame Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 Under dravid we won a test series in WI and Eng. Good enough for a test team that is an away bunny. We are talking about one day Cricket here.More specifically about the performance of the odi team which he left for Dhoni. No one is denying he was great captain for the test team.
Cricketics Posted January 5, 2017 Author Posted January 5, 2017 15 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said: We are talking about one day Cricket here.More specifically about the performance of the odi team which he left for Dhoni. No one is denying he was great captain for the test team. I think the whole point is that Ganguly was a good captain, Dravid was pretty good too. But it was Dhoni, under whom we had more success. Why?Because he did make some brilliant changes and the players he backed, delivered more for him than they did under previous captains. Along with that.. Players probably loved playing under Dhoni. They liked how he kept giving them chances. Even Nehra who was gone from the Indian team for a while was brought back in the INdian team by Dhoni for the 2011 world cup, where he bowled his heart out with an injured hand in the semi final. He backed unknowns like Joginder Sharma to bowl the most important over of the world cup. Under Dhoni, we won a tri series in Australia, which was an extremely big achievement. We beat Australia in the tri series by winning the first 2 finals, and the third final wasn't required. There were times under Ganguly when we barely managed to reach finals, in fact we actually lost miserably in the finals to Australia. in 03-04. We were winning many away trophies under Dhoni and different players were stepping up. Also under Dhoni, we saw whole of Indian being included. We saw players coming to the team from Kerala to unknown parts of India from where players were never picked before. These things made Dhoni special.
coffee_rules Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 20 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said: We are talking about one day Cricket here.More specifically about the performance of the odi team which he left for Dhoni. No one is denying he was great captain for the test team. Dravid's W/L ratio in ODIs is second best to Dhoni's
BeautifulGame Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 Dravid's W/L ratio in ODIs is second best to Dhoni's Pretty meaningless winning pointless Odis and getting knocked out in group stages in world cup and champions trophy
rkt.india Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 18 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said: Pretty meaningless winning pointless Odis and getting knocked out in group stages in world cup and champions trophy Really, so have you seen any team losing games and suddenly win a big ICC tournament? We might have lost in big tourny, but that team was still very good.
BeautifulGame Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 Really, so have you seen any team losing games and suddenly win a big ICC tournament? We might have lost in big tourny, but that team was still very good. Any decent captain with a decent team can win random Odis . It takes a great Captain to win world cups . See the difference?
Number Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 It depends how he impacts the team's culture, attitude and approach and how the team transitions under him. For me Border, Imran, Lloyd, Ranatunga and Ganguly were great captains in test cricket. MCcricket 1
CG Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 1 hour ago, BeautifulGame said: Any decent captain with a decent team can win random Odis . It takes a great Captain to win world cups . See the difference? Any Decent Captain with Great Players Can win a Worldcup at Home.
BeautifulGame Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 Any Decent Captain with Great Players Can win a Worldcup at Home. So how many world cups were won at home before Dhoni ?
CG Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 In current decade it's home team who have the advantage.Be it Aus or Eng who will Win next. Forget great even good players should be enough to win WC now at home.
rkt.india Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 2 hours ago, BeautifulGame said: Any decent captain with a decent team can win random Odis . It takes a great Captain to win world cups . See the difference? Ponting must be the greatest be the greatest captain of all time than, winning two ODI WCs.
BeautifulGame Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 Ponting must be the greatest be the greatest captain of all time than, winning two ODI WCs. Are we going in cycles again? Pointing inherited a team that was reigning champions Dhoni inherited a that knocked out of group stage in last three world tournaments.
coffee_rules Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 48 minutes ago, BeautifulGame said: So how many world cups were won at home before Dhoni ? MClarke is a great captain too, then.
BeautifulGame Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 In current decade it's home team who have the advantage.Be it Aus or Eng who will Win next. Forget great even good players should be enough to win WC now at home. He won the champions trophy in England and WT20 in South Africa. Also how did our Indian team do in champions trophy at home in the same period ? sandeep 1
CG Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 He won the champions trophy in England and WT20 in South Africa. Also how did our Indian team do in champions trophy at home in the same period ? I wrote this decade.You are forgetting the greatest odi side of all time was present took everything in 2000-2010.Captaincy does papy a part but it's childish to say India won just because of Dhonis captaincy.On the contrary his Captaincy was nothing special in WC 2011 like giving Nehra the final over against SA where we lost.Had struggled throughout to come good at finals it was a team effort rather than individual.Let me know some captaincy gems at WC I missed.
CG Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 What was his contribution with bat in CT in eng? maniac 1
sandeep Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 For those over-rating Gangu teili's captaincy - the guy was a quality leader of men, but was as poor a captain as MSD in Tests, when it came to tactics and strategy. Gangu forced the best ODI opener ever to bat at #4, so he could continue to tuk-tuk at 70% SR in Veeru's slipstream. Gangu's bowling changes and field placements left so much to be desired it wasn't even funny. MSD was a clear upgrade as ODI skipper over Gangu, as much as I admire Gangu's fiestiness and respect his contributions to the team. Gangu should also get credit for putting pressure on the selectors to give proper runs to new players - before he publicly took that stand, BCCI selectors were quite greenbro like in trying and chucking new faces with an odd game here and there - not to mention the horse-trading and BS zonal based selection nonsense. But let's not claim that Gangu was anywhere close to MS's class in LOI captaincy.
maniac Posted January 5, 2017 Posted January 5, 2017 I like IPL...love it even....but how the IPL has changed perspective even in posters with smart cricketing acumen(at least I thought they had) Dhoni is the Moses who led a team of chokers to winning cups I heard it all. For starters to reach a final we need to win Quarter Finals and Semi Finals-unless there is a new ICC rule I am not aware of. Dhoni's team too got knocked out in 2 WC knockouts and plenty of other first round exits unless it was the teams fault in that case for which there is a good probability. CG, express bowling and Laaloo 3
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