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Khota

Those who wanted Vijay/rahul over Dhawan - Time to eat a crow

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4 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

He scored 36 runs and faced 25 less number of balls than M Vijay.  Vijay made 15 runs. Your main job in these parts is seeing off new ball. He couldn't even face that many balls. Scoring 15 runs more and facing 25 balls less is pretty much useless for team. Even the runs he scored was streaky. How the heck you justify this crap with crap argument

So in short Vijay scored less but faced few more balls. Your main job is to score runs and see the ball off just not seeing the ball off. Now if the criteria is to have a batsman just not score for two days and see the ball off I will look for a adequate replacement. Currently Dhawan is a better option. It will not register with you but maybe later on. I have a gut feeling if Dhawan playes the next game guess who will score more. Can you confidently say your boy will score more? I can.

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3 hours ago, Khota said:

If you honestly dont have any issues with Rohit then we can continue this diiscussion.

 

He is indeed the top 5 now that is currently. Dont look at the previous averages and old stats. This is the current Rohit we are talking about. He is in touch, and is seeing the ball really well. Go look at the current stats for this tour and comeback and tell us all that he is not top 5. I will listen to you.

 

I have no idea why Rohit gets such a bad rap on this forum. Instead of appreciating him people ridicule him. The current Rohit can walk into any batting line up in the world. If he does bad I would be the first one to critisize him but currently he is my go to guy. Great player.

current stats

Ashwin n pandya has more runs then him. 

He is avg 19.5 in this series....ru kidding me . Ur calling stats of 19.5 good ........thats not even good in t20

What in touch havent ur read he was always in touch before going overseas and then boom everything gets exposed

 

No he will not be kept in any lineup ......whole world knows his technical weekness. Recently dean jones wrote and article 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/sports/cricket/india-in-south-africa/rohits-defensive-skills-letting-him-down-in-tests-dean-jones/articleshow/62553083.cms

 

 

No he is not..... in top 5

Kohli, rahane, rahul, pujara, vijay and heck even dhawan are better test batsman then rohit. They all have overseas 100......rohit has no 100 overseas

 

He is 2nd best batsman in t20 n odi but test his career wud be done soon

 

Everybody bajaoes him coz they watch test cricket , unlike u who watches t20 and comments on test cricket. 

Edited by Ankit_sharma03

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1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

current stats

Ashwin n pandya has more runs then him. 

He is avg 19.5 in this series....ru kidding me . Ur calling stats of 19.5 good ........thats not even good in t20

What in touch havent ur read he was always in touch before going overseas and then boom everything gets exposed

 

No he will not be kept in any lineup ......whole world knows his technical weekness. Recently dean jones wrote and article 

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/sports/cricket/india-in-south-africa/rohits-defensive-skills-letting-him-down-in-tests-dean-jones/articleshow/62553083.cms

 

 

No he is not..... in top 5

Kohli, rahane, rahul, pujara, vijay and heck even dhawan are better test batsman then rohit. They all have overseas 100......rohit has no 100 overseas

 

He is 2nd best batsman in t20 n odi but test his career wud be done soon

 

Everybody bajaoes him coz they watch test cricket , unlike u who watches t20 and comments on test cricket. 

I think you are confusing current with previous.

 

Here are the runs scored so far by batsman: Rohit is in top 5. What happened before is called history for a reason.

 

Most runs
Player Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 0 4s 6s
AB de Villiers (SA) 2 4 0 200 80 50.00 303 66.00 0 2 0 25 2
V Kohli (INDIA) 2 4 0 191 153 47.75 290 65.86 1 0 0 20 0
F du Plessis (SA) 2 4 0 173 63 43.25 392 44.13 0 2 1 25 0
AK Markram (SA) 2 4 0 134 94 33.50 212 63.20 0 1 0 23 0
D Elgar (SA) 2 4 0 117 61 29.25 261 44.82 0 1 1 16 1
HH Pandya (INDIA) 2 4 0 115 93 28.75 157 73.24 0 1 0 16 1
HM Amla (SA) 2 4 0 90 82 22.50 188 47.87 0 1 0 15 0
R Ashwin (INDIA) 2 4 0 90 38 22.50 144 62.50 0 0 0 14 0
RG Sharma (INDIA) 2 4 0 78 47 19.50 190 41.05 0 0 0 9 1
KA Maharaj (SA) 2 4 0 74 35 18.50 130 56.92 0 0 0 9 1
M Vijay (INDIA) 2 4 0 69 46 17.25 200 34.50 0 0 0 9

0

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Khota said:

I think you are confusing current with previous.

 

Here are the runs scored so far by batsman: Rohit is in top 5. What happened before is called history for a reason.

 

Most runs
Player Mat Inns NO Runs HS Ave BF SR 100 50 0 4s 6s
AB de Villiers (SA) 2 4 0 200 80 50.00 303 66.00 0 2 0 25 2
V Kohli (INDIA) 2 4 0 191 153 47.75 290 65.86 1 0 0 20 0
F du Plessis (SA) 2 4 0 173 63 43.25 392 44.13 0 2 1 25 0
AK Markram (SA) 2 4 0 134 94 33.50 212 63.20 0 1 0 23 0
D Elgar (SA) 2 4 0 117 61 29.25 261 44.82 0 1 1 16 1
HH Pandya (INDIA) 2 4 0 115 93 28.75 157 73.24 0 1 0 16 1
HM Amla (SA) 2 4 0 90 82 22.50 188 47.87 0 1 0 15 0
R Ashwin (INDIA) 2 4 0 90 38 22.50 144 62.50 0 0 0 14 0
RG Sharma (INDIA) 2 4 0 78 47 19.50 190 41.05 0 0 0 9 1
KA Maharaj (SA) 2 4 0 74 35 18.50 130 56.92 0 0 0 9 1
M Vijay (INDIA) 2 4 0 69 46 17.25 200 34.50 0 0 0 9

0

 

 

 

Kahawat suni hai Andho men Kanna raja

History is meant to be taken a lesson from and what has changed . He failed last time and so has this time. 

Last time he avg 11 now he avg 19............ohh boy what an improvement 

 

Had bhuvi played last game, chances are he wud have been higher and his avg is still higher this series. HE also made runs on tough pitches. 

Have u seen anyone selecting a team with 1-2 game samples. By this logic no team will ever build. Even chappell didnt make such radical changes 

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6 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Kahawat suni hai Andho men Kanna raja

History is meant to be taken a lesson from and what has changed . He failed last time and so has this time. 

Last time he avg 11 now he avg 19............ohh boy what an improvement 

 

Had bhuvi played last game, chances are he wud have been higher and his avg is still higher this series. HE also made runs on tough pitches. 

Have u seen anyone selecting a team with 1-2 game samples. By this logic no team will ever build. Even chappell didnt make such radical changes 

Bottom line he is top 5. He will be top 5 after the next test. I have confidence to back that. Do you?

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37 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

I have confidence that he ll never be a good test player specially if there is a bit of grass on pitch. Sooner or later it ll be curtains on his test career 

You are good at evading. Let me put you in a spot. Can you name 4 batsman who will score higher than him in the next test? Show some faith and name 4 who are better.

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5 minutes ago, Khota said:

You are good at evading. Let me put you in a spot. Can you name 4 batsman who will score higher than him in the next test? Show some faith and name 4 who are better.

only idiots deal in one test match predictions. 

U see unlike u have seen test cricket for years and i knw a few test is a bad sample . I hve tailender outscore in games over main players. I hve seen sometimes avg having a day for scoring more

 

But no one is regd as legend for having 1 good day or 2-3 good games

 

U think ill stoop to that stupidity level were kohli scores 15 and rohit 19 and ill say oh rohit is a better test batsman...........

 

Just wait , rohit career as test batsman wudnt last long. Wait for a while . Even dhawan 

Edited by Ankit_sharma03

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1 minute ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

only idiots deal in one test match predictions. 

U see unlike u have seen test cricket for years and i knw a few test is a bad sample . I hve tailender outscore in games over main players. I hve seen sometimes avg having a day for scoring more

 

But no one is regd as legend for having 1 good day or 2-3 good games

 

U think ill stoop to that stupidity level were kohli scores 15 and rohit 19 and ill say oh rohit is a better test batsman...........

 

Just wait , rohit career as test batsman wudnt last long. Wait for a while . Even dhawan 

I am beginning to think you dont like me.

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4 minutes ago, Khota said:

I am beginning to think you dont like me.

I envy ur confidence, i wish i had that while saying something which m quite clueless about. 

But I think i shudnt say that our very captain is thinking like that . Atleast he plays test cricket, atleast i can give u the benefit of doubt that u dnt watch test cricket 

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On 17/01/2018 at 5:57 AM, Khota said:

Vijay was destined to fail and he did not disappoint.

How are you saying 'destined to fail'? I could not see technical flaws in Vijay but I saw plenty in Dhawan.

Also Dhawan has consistently failed overseas whereas Vijay rocked abroad. How are you saying that Dhawan would have done well?

On what basis you are backing Dhawan when we can see clearly that he has problems with short ball?

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51 minutes ago, anish2tweet said:

How are you saying 'destined to fail'? I could not see technical flaws in Vijay but I saw plenty in Dhawan.

Also Dhawan has consistently failed overseas whereas Vijay rocked abroad. How are you saying that Dhawan would have done well?

On what basis you are backing Dhawan when we can see clearly that he has problems with short ball?

Harsh words on my part. Vijay is good and dont get me wrong but currently I think Dhawan has the edge. I personally want Vijay to go out and score a century next time.

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On 1/20/2018 at 12:20 PM, Khota said:

So in short Vijay scored less but faced few more balls. Your main job is to score runs and see the ball off just not seeing the ball off. Now if the criteria is to have a batsman just not score for two days and see the ball off I will look for a adequate replacement. Currently Dhawan is a better option. It will not register with you but maybe later on. I have a gut feeling if Dhawan playes the next game guess who will score more. Can you confidently say your boy will score more? I can.

No. What i am saying his gigantic surplus runs of 15 runs was basically useless. All of them were streaky. Basically that guy survived by luck. If you can't objectively see that you are helpless. There are millions of instances some random tailender outscores a middle order batsman. You cannot justify his place over the specialist because of that. You are completely ignoring the point. 

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18 hours ago, Khota said:

Harsh words on my part. Vijay is good and dont get me wrong but currently I think Dhawan has the edge. I personally want Vijay to go out and score a century next time.

What edge. Except his bat edge he has nothing. He is a great hack in one dayer. But in Tests with slip worse than a tailender. We all saw how he played Morkels bounce. Embarrassing . 

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30 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

No. What i am saying his gigantic surplus runs of 15 runs was basically useless. All of them were streaky. Basically that guy survived by luck. If you can't objectively see that you are helpless. There are millions of instances some random tailender outscores a middle order batsman. You cannot justify his place over the specialist because of that. You are completely ignoring the point. 

 

28 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

What edge. Except his bat edge he has nothing. He is a great hack in one dayer. But in Tests with slip worse than a tailender. We all saw how he played Morkels bounce. Embarrassing . 

All you do is argue with lot of hotair. You are not sure that your boy will score more runs but you keep on saying he is better. Is it not an irony?

 

When you talk about tailenders scoring more and comparing them with openers I have lost all respect for you and your limited knowledge of cricket.

 

 

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40 minutes ago, Khota said:

 

All you do is argue with lot of hotair. You are not sure that your boy will score more runs but you keep on saying he is better. Is it not an irony?

 

When you talk about tailenders scoring more and comparing them with openers I have lost all respect for you and your limited knowledge of cricket.

 

 

I was merely using your dumb logic to show how dumb that logic is. He scored 10 runs more so he is better. Who would argue like that? Someone who has no knowledge of nuances in cricket, someone who lacks observation skills to understand the difference between a good batsman and a hack against a given set of conditions. We can be ignorant of all those things. But atleast you should  look at history before opening your mouth. There is no history that suggest Dhawan would do well in Tests in these parts. He confirmed that with his two streaky innings in the first Test. And rightfully kicked out by his own buddy. As a testimony M Vijay made 46 runs in the first innings in the 2nd test.  I am still amazed that you are still sticking to your retarded logic.

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4 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

I was merely using your dumb logic to show how dumb that logic is. He scored 10 runs more so he is better. Who would argue like that? Someone who has no knowledge of nuances in cricket, someone who lacks observation skills to understand the difference between a good batsman and a hack against a given set of conditions. We can be ignorant of all those things. But atleast you should  look at history before opening your mouth. There is no history that suggest Dhawan would do well in Tests in these parts. He confirmed that with his two streaky innings in the first Test. And rightfully kicked out by his own buddy. As a testimony M Vijay made 46 runs in the first innings in the 2nd test.  I am still amazed that you are still sticking to your retarded logic.

You are losing it.

I would argue like that all day long because it is meaningful as it is side by side.

Dhawan did not play the second test on the easy pitch. Could have won with him.

Edited by Khota

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There was no sideways movement nor bounce which was on offer in first test. I am not saying Dhawan would have succeeded,Dhawan simply does not have tools to succeed when ball is moving, but can anyone say for sure Rahul has tools to succeed when there is movement.

 

People keep bringing up his 100 in Australia but that was scored on a very very flat wicket, where has Rahul showed that he has technical skills to counteract movement or bounce.Even if he has he is his own worst enemy because he has literally gifted his wickets many times.

Edited by putrevus

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6 hours ago, Khota said:

You are losing it.

I would argue like that all day long because it is meaningful as it is side by side.

Dhawan did not play the second test on the easy pitch. Could have won with him.

Nope. find someone here who agrees with your dumb logic.  There is literally none. Yea. All the matches that are missed by Dhawan are easy pitches lol.  I can argue Saurabh Tiwary would have scored 200. As long as there is no logic you can say that too.

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3 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Nope. find someone here who agrees with your dumb logic.  There is literally none. Yea. All the matches that are missed by Dhawan are easy pitches lol.  I can argue Saurabh Tiwary would have scored 200. As long as there is no logic you can say that too.

That is your problem. You seek other peoples approval. That is not important. Only thing that matters is runs scored. Rest is all noise.

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16 minutes ago, Khota said:

That is your problem. You seek other peoples approval. That is not important. Only thing that matters is runs scored. Rest is all noise.

Thanks for proving again and again that your argument is pretty childish with no cricketing knowledge.

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16 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Thanks for proving again and again that your argument is pretty childish with no cricketing knowledge.

With 100K posts and comparing runs scored by tail enders as same as the runs by openers. I am really enlightened by you the wise one.

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7 minutes ago, Khota said:

With 100K posts and comparing runs scored by tail enders as same as the runs by openers. I am really enlightened by you the wise one.

Well... comparison was made using your logic. You didn't get the drift. That is not exactly my problem.

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7 hours ago, putrevus said:

There was no sideways movement nor bounce which was on offer in first test. I am not saying Dhawan would have succeeded,Dhawan simply does not have tools to succeed when ball is moving, but can anyone say for sure Rahul has tools to succeed when there is movement.

 

People keep bringing up his 100 in Australia but that was scored on a very very flat wicket, where has Rahul showed that he has technical skills to counteract movement or bounce.Even if he has he is his own worst enemy because he has literally gifted his wickets many times.

We will not know unless Rahul is given a chance.

 

You forgot his 50s & 100s against Eng/Aus/SL in India as an opener.. Although the conditions may not have been as challenging as in SA, he did not perform badly.. As for SA, I think more than the pitch, the turmoil within the team did have an effect on the performance of the players (be it Dhawan or Rahul). We can wait till Eng series before declaring a verdict on either of them . 

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8 hours ago, Khota said:

You are losing it.

I would argue like that all day long because it is meaningful as it is side by side.

Dhawan did not play the second test on the easy pitch. Could have won with him.

I good ball would have got him as is always the case with all the Indian batsmen

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1 hour ago, diga said:

We will not know unless Rahul is given a chance.

 

You forgot his 50s & 100s against Eng/Aus/SL in India as an opener.. Although the conditions may not have been as challenging as in SA, he did not perform badly.. As for SA, I think more than the pitch, the turmoil within the team did have an effect on the performance of the players (be it Dhawan or Rahul). We can wait till Eng series before declaring a verdict on either of them . 

I think both are important in the future.

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7 hours ago, diga said:

We will not know unless Rahul is given a chance.

 

You forgot his 50s & 100s against Eng/Aus/SL in India as an opener.. Although the conditions may not have been as challenging as in SA, he did not perform badly.. As for SA, I think more than the pitch, the turmoil within the team did have an effect on the performance of the players (be it Dhawan or Rahul). We can wait till Eng series before declaring a verdict on either of them . 

Gabbar is a solid ODI player in most conditions. Ofcourse we won't be getting seaming pitches with bowlers having no restrictions in one dayers. But in Tests bowlers can bowl a little wider, they can bowl two bouncers, you will see crowded slips. His problem is bounce. On certain pitches he might do well in England like Azharuddin did where the bounce and movement. Only way Gabbar can score anything here is when the ball doesn't rise above knee. He doesn't have the ability to leae the ball like M Vijay does. M Vijay is next only to the likes of Sunny, Dravid when it comes to knowing where his off stump is. Just the shot selection has to be fixed. Gabbar has whole lot more issues. I agree about Rahul. His confidence is totally shot. He is fidgety, nervous. He is a better player than this. He should be given a 5 or 6 test run regardless of failures. 

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33 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

Gabbar is a solid ODI player in most conditions. Ofcourse we won't be getting seaming pitches with bowlers having no restrictions in one dayers. But in Tests bowlers can bowl a little wider, they can bowl two bouncers, you will see crowded slips. His problem is bounce. On certain pitches he might do well in England like Azharuddin did where the bounce and movement. Only way Gabbar can score anything here is when the ball doesn't rise above knee. He doesn't have the ability to leae the ball like M Vijay does. M Vijay is next only to the likes of Sunny, Dravid when it comes to knowing where his off stump is. Just the shot selection has to be fixed. Gabbar has whole lot more issues. I agree about Rahul. His confidence is totally shot. He is fidgety, nervous. He is a better player than this. He should be given a 5 or 6 test run regardless of failures. 

Even Dhawan would agree that Rahul and Vijay are better than him in tests :giggle: 

How could you forget him pussying out in aussie series, where he faked an injury overnight because he got scared of starc and Johnson running amok with the new ball. After that he came and scored some dead runs to save his place.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/21328875/unrest-dressing-room-shikhar-dhawan-injury-ms-dhoni

That first inning knock by vijay was a GOAT for an Indian opener and dhawan's inning on the other end was down right embarrassing. 

http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/8525/scorecard/754739/australia-vs-india-2nd-test-border-gavaskar-trophy-2014-15/

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Once again Rahul does not back himself either. It is time to think outside the box and open with Rahane and Dhawan. Pack the batting order and put some runs on board. Can win this one but with Bill Belichik Shastri coaching there is no chance.

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With constant in an out of the team not only because of captaincy and management decisions, but also some of his own like getting injured or not being fit all the time, Rahul doesn't help his case most of the time.

 

It's time to focus less on weights and more on exercises also for these guys who try to put hard yards in the gym.

 

Him replacing Dhawan or Vijay full time will be great and that too if he can perform, but Rahul has a long way to go.

 

Dhawan is good at home and yet to score much away from him and for now I will play him in 3rd test if Rahul isn't fit.

 

Vijay has been disappointment but I kind of expected. People were expecting him to reach heights but we forgot that the guy's average has declined massively since his last Australian tour. He has scored at home well just like other Indian players, and even after scoring at home his average has declined massively.

 

Our best hope is Pujara-Kohli-Rahane. Trio at 3-4-5. Rest are ordinary or have flashes of brilliance but still ordinary for now.

 

I know Pujara hasn't had a big score, but give these guys the proper run including Rahane, and I am telling you 3-4-5 of Pujara-Kohli-Rahane will win us series in England.

 

 

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Neither do i have faith in Dhawan, nor in Rahul nor in Vijay in such conditions. All 3 of them are crap in this series. But they are the 3 best openers we have so we have to keep playing andhoon me kane raje wala game. 2 out of the flop 3 have ot be picked sadly.  Just count the runs they score at home and enjoy. Forget overseas scores. 

Edited by Straight Drive

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Also the guy avg 60 in Aus 
In India we have a bad habit of looking only at stats.Last time we got good batting tracks in Aus decent in eng and sa.Lyon and Moen destroyed us .This time we got bit of juice on tracks and we failed.

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1 hour ago, Pollack said:

ICF seemed to have lot Of expectations from Vijay. M Vijay was never too good a batsman. Don't get me wrong one thing kohli did right is not dropping Vijay. He was the best option we have /had.

He is the best leaver of the ball i have seen in a long time for India.

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2 minutes ago, Dada's Army said:

Between this thread and watching Dhawan give his wickets away is where hell lies for India fans.

This series was very tough for openers. Top class bowling attack in helpful conditions.  

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Some people have no clue about sports. They have not done anything at high level. They dont know how things get executed at highest level. If I have to point at one person who was the worst so far it has been Vijay. Dont look at cricket stats as they are done incorrectly. Scratch the surface and see what it reveals.

Dhawan > Vijay and Rahul.

 

Time permitting I will post recipes for making crow. I am rushed right now.

Edited by Khota

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Vijay is more experienced at test level, as compared to Rahul and Dhawan.  Plus, he plays only one format ie test.  unlike the other 2 openers.   So, Vijay should get most of the blame and not the others ,for his failure in tests outside subcontinent.

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43 minutes ago, CG said:
1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:
Also the guy avg 60 in Aus 

In India we have a bad habit of looking only at stats.Last time we got good batting tracks in Aus decent in eng and sa.Lyon and Moen destroyed us .This time we got bit of juice on tracks and we failed.

We got greener pitches than this series last time at Lords and Old Trafford.

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We got greener pitches than this series last time at Lords and Old Trafford.
Sa pitches are quicker and Ball seamed with up and down nature.

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