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India have won as many ICC trophies since 2011 as Pakistan have in their entire history......

Dil Dil India

By Dil Dil India
in Cricket Talk

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Dil Dil India Rising Star

Dil Dil India

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A lot of bleating goes around about how close India-Pak have been even since 2003 and h2h records are disingenuously used for this. However India have totally raised their game in the big tournaments which are the grand slams of cricket. In the last 5 years starting from 2011, India have won 2 ICC trophies which is equivalent to what Pak have done in their lifetime. Significantly, India went through Pakistan in both these tournaments (unlike Pakistan in 1992 and 2009) and both runs were dominant with the Ct run being unbeaten(no rain saving them there with the opponent needing 70 odd to win..). Thoughts?

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Adi_91 Newbie

Adi_91

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India has always been a good side in the ICC tournaments except that we had weak bowling attacks almost everytime. And also a weak batting lineup once Sachin got out in the LOIs. If not for these, I am sure we would have more ICC tournaments. Sometimes, the opposition team played well too. But overall, we would have a couple more.

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kira Newbie

kira

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India has always been a good side in the ICC tournaments except that we had weak bowling attacks almost everytime. And also a weak batting lineup once Sachin got out in the LOIs. If not for these, I am sure we would have more ICC tournaments. Sometimes, the opposition team played well too. But overall, we would have a couple more.

Our bowling has always outperformed the pakistani bowling in most ICC tournaments, it is better to have a weak bowling attack which performs when it matters the most rather than an attack which is supposedly "strong" but fails every time it matters

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Adi_91 Newbie

Adi_91

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Our bowling has always outperformed the pakistani bowling in most ICC tournaments, it is better to have a weak bowling attack which performs when it matters the most rather than an attack which is supposedly "strong" but fails every time it matters

 

But it has failed too in ICC tournaments. ICC World Cup 2003 final and 2011 semi final.

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express bowling Grand Master

express bowling

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Even in test matches, if we consider bilateral series between two countries, it is tied 4 series wins each...the rest being draws.

BUT

Out of their 4 series wins, Pakistan won 2 of them during the period of home umpires...they had 2 great umpiring heroes during that period...Shakur Rana and Khizar Hyat....we could not get a Pakistani out unless his stumps were shattered .....and while we were batting, we were given LBW almost every time the ball hit our pads ( Height and direction immaterial ) ( this heroic umpiring was seen again in 1998 when Sachin was given out by Mr. Rana in Sharjah after he scored 130 + and the ball hit his pad way outside the leg stump )     :laugh:

If we consider bilateral test series played between India and Pakistan under proper umpiring....we are actually ahead 4-2.

Edited by express bowling
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Dil Dil India Rising Star

Dil Dil India

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Even in test matches, if we consider bilateral series between two countries, it is tied 4 series wins each...the rest being draws.

BUT

Out of their 4 series wins, Pakistan won 2 of them during the period of home umpires...they had 2 great umpiring heroes during that period...Shakur Rana and Khisar Hyat....we could not get a Pakistani out unless his stumps were shattered .....and while we were batting, we were given LBW almost every time the ball hit our pads ( Height and direction immaterial ) ( this heroic umpiring was seen again in 1998 when Sachin was given out by Mr. Rana in Sharjah after he scored 130 + and the ball hit his pad way outside the leg stump )     :laugh:

If we consider bilateral test series played between India and Pakistan under proper umpiring....we are actually ahead 4-2.

Even the test H2H is 12-9 only and not overwhelmingly in their favour. To be fair their overall test record is still probably better but nowhere near as much as they would like you to believe. Last time I checked India had better test records in and overall vs SA and Aus, 2 countries where no Asian team has won test series up until now. India have also won 3 test series vs West Indies whereas Pakistan have 0. India also won series in England and New Zealand before Pakistan managed to IIRC. I see India overtaking Pakistan overall in test cricket over the next few years if the present trends continue.

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Rightarmfast Grand Master

Rightarmfast

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Even in test matches, if we consider bilateral series between two countries, it is tied 4 series wins each...the rest being draws.

BUT

Out of their 4 series wins, Pakistan won 2 of them during the period of home umpires...they had 2 great umpiring heroes during that period...Shakur Rana and Khisar Hyat....we could not get a Pakistani out unless his stumps were shattered .....and while we were batting, we were given LBW almost every time the ball hit our pads ( Height and direction immaterial ) ( this heroic umpiring was seen again in 1998 when Sachin was given out by Mr. Rana in Sharjah after he scored 130 + and the ball hit his pad way outside the leg stump )     :laugh:

If we consider bilateral test series played between India and Pakistan under proper umpiring....we are actually ahead 4-2.

True Story -:

In a live interview in early 80's, the interview asks Imran Khan -  What do you need to become World Champion team?

IK - 2 people , Sunny Gavaskar and Kapil Dev!

 

Interviewer to Sunil Gavaskar - What do you need to become World Champion team?

SG - 2 people , 2 Pakistani umpires!

 

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express bowling Grand Master

express bowling

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True Story -:

In a live interview in early 80's, the interview asks Imran Khan -  What do you need to become World Champion team?

IK - 2 people , Sunny Gavaskar and Kapil Dev!

 

Interviewer to Sunil Gavaskar - What do you need to become World Champion team?

SG - 2 people , 2 Pakistani umpires!

 

:cantstop:

It was this bad really. 

Pakistani umpiring, during the '70s and '80s,  reached a " height "  which is impossible in these days.

 

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express bowling Grand Master

express bowling

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A bit of rivalry is good,it was missing on icf for a long time.but we shouldn't be comparing to Pakistan,they are hardly the benchmark

bwahaaha loving it :hysterical::hysterical:

During the '70s, '80s and early part of '90s, Pakistani bowlers, umpires and bottle caps  made them generate win-loss stats that were above the benchmark, hence the comparison to put things in perspective.    :agree:

Just looking at the very average Pakistan cricket team in the last 10 years won't give you the full picture.

Edited by express bowling
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kira Newbie

kira

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India has won 

2  World Cups

1 T20 World Cup

2  Champion's Trophy

5  Asia Cups

 

Pakistan has won

1  World Cup

1  T20 World Cup

0  Champion's Trophy

2  Asia Cups

 

We are far better at  winning the big LOI tournaments that matter.

Even the 2nd asia cup that they won was because they were lucky, India were eliminated due a stupid rule even though we had same points as bangladesh and a much better runrate, we would have won had we played the final, even bangla was close to beating pakistan and choked in the end

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