maniac Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Just now, Cricketics said: He will most likely play in Vijay Hazare and will get few tons there or at least big scores. Yeah then he can obviously duh.... but domestic cricket plenty of competitors will make hay...IPL will help him “standout” among his peers. Link to comment
Cricketics Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 5 minutes ago, maniac said: Yeah then he can obviously duh.... but domestic cricket plenty of competitors will make hay...IPL will help him “standout” among his peers. I will rephrase it and put it again what my real concern is with IPl when you say why IPl performance should be seen first. Please read it carefully Young players, most of them, do not get proper chance to bat and often miss out scoring on first or 2nd opportunity. And then are dropped by their respective teams. BCCI selectors now end up reading too much into those performances and do not select them for even 50 over ODI’s. Important. Coming in 13th over in t20 game in IPl and getting out in 17th over to up the run rate for the team has nothing to do with 50 over cricket. However when selection is done, most times IPl performance will be taken into consideration and such guys will miss out. That is the reason why Rishab Pant doesn’t get picked or Iyer or Hooda or many players who have not put on big runs in t20s regularly in IPl but are surely capable of putting big scores in 50 overs for India Link to comment
adi B Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 He's the next kohli. Time to draft him in odi squad,even virat got his breakthrough in 2008 srl series Link to comment
maniac Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Cricketics said: I will rephrase it and put it again what my real concern is with IPl when you say why IPl performance should be seen first. Please read it carefully Young players, most of them, do not get proper chance to bat and often miss out scoring on first or 2nd opportunity. And then are dropped by their respective teams. BCCI selectors now end up reading too much into those performances and do not select them for even 50 over ODI’s. Important. Coming in 13th over in t20 game in IPl and getting out in 17th over to up the run rate for the team has nothing to do with 50 over cricket. However when selection is done, most times IPl performance will be taken into consideration and such guys will miss out. That is the reason why Rishab Pant doesn’t get picked or Iyer or Hooda or many players who have not put on big runs in t20s regularly in IPl but are surely capable of putting big scores in 50 overs for India Rishabh Pant and even Pandey have good FC records but they also stood out in IPL because they played quality attacks in pressure situations. Hell even Rahane and Karthik for the matter of fact are in LOI scheme of things because they do well in the IPL. Samson has not set FC alight but is in the scheme of things and always brought up because of his IPL heroics. On the other hand Pujara has an enviable List A record but it is considered a joke to even bring his name for Odis for a reason. Look IPL is not the only benchmark totally agree and you don’t have to score buckets of runs there but that gives a good glimpse of you can play international standard bowling or handle pressure like crowd and expectations. I don’t think Gill will be or should be used after 15 overs to slog.that is not his expertise..in fact Indian team needs some lower order hitters and that is up for grabs if someone can cash in this season...if he can come top of the order and even score 20s and 30s against good bowlers that will help him more to standout than scoring 2-3 100s in FC. Edited January 30, 2018 by maniac Link to comment
maniac Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Do you think Hardik Pandya is in the side for FC heroics or IPL or even someone like Sundar? Link to comment
Cricketics Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 Just now, maniac said: Do you think Hardik Pandya is in the side for FC heroics or IPL or even someone like Sundar? Pandya was seen as a hitter and hence he got into both ODI and t20 side, someone who could also bowl. Shubman clearly does not have such talent to hit big like Pandya. So IPl suits perfectly for Pandya as he can showcase his talent which he did earlier and India was looking for a finisher for both ODI’s and t20 and he was best person that time. Shubman’s role will be for number 3, or number 4 most likely, the way he plays, the rotation game. Link to comment
maniac Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 minute ago, Cricketics said: Pandya was seen as a hitter and hence he got into both ODI and t20 side, someone who could also bowl. Shubman clearly does not have such talent to hit big like Pandya. So IPl suits perfectly for Pandya as he can showcase his talent which he did earlier and India was looking for a finisher for both ODI’s and t20 and he was best person that time. Shubman’s role will be for number 3, or number 4 most likely, the way he plays, the rotation game. 4 batting slots are taken...1,2,3 and 6(Dhoni) so roles are open at 4 and 5...even 5 is interchangeable with Dhoni so that leaves 4 or 6 You need to be multidimensional in that role and hence players who are being tried there Rahane,Rahul,Pandey,Jadhav are all good at both FC level and maybe bar Jadhav have shown quick scoring skills in the IPL. once again Gill has all the tools but he has to show case pressure skills and also maybe quick scoring ability via IPL....like it or not IPL gives you the limelight. Gill’s only advantage is he is young and has a huge upside but without even proving anything neither at IPL or FC he can’t jump way ahead of the pecking order....pretty sure FC has a lot of guys churning out runs at 4 and 5 and to move ahead of them he needs to score a lot of runs there for starters and obviously because of his age he will standout just like Pant...to get quicker attention he would have to own it in the IPL...period like it or not IPL is a benchmark as the examples I have quoted. Link to comment
maniac Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) Playing Musa and Shaheen is not even in the same ball park as playing Anderson and Philander in a T20 game leave alone Starc and Rabada simple. Gill needs to be fast tracked via decent performances in A tours and IPL....period. This innings and tournament has made him a hot prospect.,,,doesn’t get him a free ticket into the Indian side where a lof people have toiled for years to get in queue ...some move ahead of others because of being in the right place and grabbing opportunities be it IPL or a standout FC season. Edited January 30, 2018 by maniac kajubadamchor and Muloghonto 2 Link to comment
Cricketics Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 2 minutes ago, sarchasm said: What makes me think? It's not my thought alone. Pretty much every cricketer who has played at this level has said just how much of a step up first class cricket is from U19 club level standard. Including Dravid. But aside from experiences of these former and current cricketers, we also have examples of U19 cricketers over the years who have struggled to hack it at first class level. Someone as talented as KL Rahul, who's 10 times the batsman Gill at this age, took his time to find his bearings in Ranji. No this is not how it works today. If you are good or look special you sbould be fast tracked, be it a bowler or a batsman. People like you will send bowler like Nagarkoti or Mavi play in FC cricket for next 3-4 years while Ishant Sharma gets picked in ODI side to fk us up over and over again. Many won’t learn much while if given a chance at top level, they can succeed. Ever watched grandslam Tennis tournament? Ever heard of wild cards? 17-18 year old straight from high school, or challenger level college player gets thrown into first round being a US or Australian born playing home slam, after they had lost to 600th ranked player. What happens next? We see this same player beating top 100 level player in first round of a grandslam. Moral of the story - After grinding out all year in in challenger level and losing to 600th to 800th ranked players, the guy suddenly becomes grandslam contender in matter of momths. Why? Because some players change their game and learn fast as they play against top players. The above is story about Nick Kyrgios or many such players in mens tennis today. Indian sportsmen habe lacked and stayed behind in many sports like Tennis because we do not have such wildcard system in most of our sports to promote our youngsters as we do not host many such events. Cricket is the only sport we are dominant in, and giving wildcards to the brightest in Cricket in our country is not wrong. Many of them can turn out special. Samcric 1 Link to comment
maniac Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Just now, Cricketics said: No this is not how it works today. If you are good or look special you sbould be fast tracked, be it a bowler or a batsman. People like you will send bowler like Nagarkoti or Mavi play in FC cricket for next 3-4 years while Ishant Sharma gets picked in ODI side to fk us up over and over again. Many won’t learn much while if given a chance at top level, they can succeed. Ever watched grandslam Tennis tournament? Ever heard of wild cards? 17-18 year old straight from high school, or challenger level college player gets thrown into first round being a US or Australian born playing home slam, after they had lost to 600th ranked player. What happens next? We see this same player beating top 100 level player in first round of a grandslam. Moral of the story - After grinding out all year in in challenger level and losing to 600th to 800th ranked players, the guy suddenly becomes grandslam contender in matter of momths. Why? Because some players change their game and learn fast as they play against top players. The above is story about Nick Kyrgios or many such players in mens tennis today. Indian sportsmen habe lacked and stayed behind in many sports like Tennis because we do not have such wildcard system in most of our sports to promote our youngsters as we do not host many such events. Cricket is the only sport we are dominant in, and giving wildcards to the brightest in Cricket in our country is not wrong. Many of them can turn out special. So wild card only for Gill? There are plenty of wildcards that can be thrown into the side lol. People were asking for Pant because he did well in U19,FC and IPL-checked 3 boxes H.Pandya- because we needed a fastbowling allrounder and he did well on A tours and IPl K.Pandya and Sundar- because we need a batting allounder/ spinner and they did well in IPL. Gill has only done well in U19 WC and has a good start to FC career but as I said he has a lot of eye balls on him now but not yet the next level where they can take a punt on him....you are getting confused between the word “fast track” someone into the scheme of things or give someone the “India Cap” right away. Gill has earned a lot more “opportunities” to prove himself not the “opportunity” to start representing the country yet. philcric 1 Link to comment
maniac Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 @Cricketics based on your “wild card” theory who should get a shot first K.Pandya as we need a lower order hitting allrounder as shown in IPL? Vijay Shankar good batsman+allrounder with good FC records and can bat at 5 if needed and did well in IPL. or Shubman Gill based on u-19 performance? Mavi and Nagarkoti 2 young u-19s hitting 145ks which one should get their turn first? You can’t play all rookies at once right? Link to comment
Cricketics Posted January 30, 2018 Author Share Posted January 30, 2018 27 minutes ago, maniac said: @Cricketics based on your “wild card” theory who should get a shot first K.Pandya as we need a lower order hitting allrounder as shown in IPL? Vijay Shankar good batsman+allrounder with good FC records and can bat at 5 if needed and did well in IPL. or Shubman Gill based on u-19 performance? Mavi and Nagarkoti 2 young u-19s hitting 145ks which one should get their turn first? You can’t play all rookies at once right? Changes I would make to Indian odi team for next series when playing those BS series in Lanka would be to rest Kohli and drop Rahane, Karthik, Axar and bring Rahul, Nitish, Krunal and Shubman. I basically will use Krunal or Nitish instead of Axar in the team. pant comes for Dhawan as opener. In t20, he comes in for Dhoni ans still used as opener. I will pick Vijay Shankar for test tour to England. I would also rest Shami And Bhuvi for Saini and either of Nagarkoti or Mavi in the LAnka series. Give chances and rotate players around from series to series. Sgattick10 1 Link to comment
The Dark Horse Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) I would fast track him, Shaw, Mavi and Nagarkotti to the india-A team. Whoever shows promise can be brought to the Indian team. They will get a chance to compete with someone like Vijay Shankar or Saini then we'll know who's better and pick them to the Indian team based on the format of course. Edited January 30, 2018 by The Dark Horse Link to comment
Temujin Khaghan Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 The current u19 team should get good experience in IPL and first class cricket and should be in contention for 2023wc. Link to comment
Temujin Khaghan Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Once the word is out that if you play well in the u19 WC then you get a red carpet welcome into the national team even without any first class experience, then there will be tremendous corruption during the team selections in the subsequent u19 WC tournaments. Everyone will look at it as the equivalent to royal fast track road into the Indian team. sandeep 1 Link to comment
Mosher Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 IPL will be a good learning experience for Gill. Imagine a 19 year old kid getting to face a bowler like Starc in the nets. He will surely get better. sandeep, maniac and express bowling 1 2 Link to comment
Popular Post express bowling Posted January 30, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) Gill has a pronounced back and across trigger movement ... this helps tackle pace, bounce and off-stump deliveries. Pakistani pacers were bowling 140 k this morning but he was never hurried. His footwork, both forward and back, is very definitive. His head stays very still. He has a lot of power, I saw it in earlier matches. Today, we were in trouble and he did not really go for the big shots. He adapts his game to suit the match situation and always plays responsibly. I am very happy to see 2 proper batsmen, Gill and Shaw, emerge this year. Was getting tired of unorthodox batsmen with ineffective techniques who always say " this is my natural game " and throw their wicket away irrespective of the match situation. Edited January 30, 2018 by express bowling Mosher, Cricketics, philcric and 7 others 3 7 Link to comment
saik Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 Shubman if picked can fit into the no.4 slot.But there is already a big fight for that spot from Dk,Iyer,Manish and Rahane. He won't be picked unless these players fail. speedheat and maniac 1 1 Link to comment
express bowling Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 (edited) 17 minutes ago, saik said: Shubman if picked can fit into the no.4 slot.But there is already a big fight for that spot from Dk,Iyer,Manish and Rahane. He won't be picked unless these players fail. Ultimately, he will be a more dependable No.4 than these four, if he can maintain his focus. His potential ceiling in ODIs is higher than these guys too. Edited January 30, 2018 by express bowling saik 1 Link to comment
SUMO Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 39 minutes ago, saik said: Shubman if picked can fit into the no.4 slot.But there is already a big fight for that spot from Dk,Iyer,Manish and Rahane. He won't be picked unless these players fail. These two guys along with kedar are not meant for odi cricket and are substandard to build a powerful odi side. Guys like iyer hooda gill pant needs to be tried...not much of time left before wc. Kohli also played at no 4 in wc11 around very experienced batting line up. And he was just 1.5 yr old in international cricket. Cant gill re-emulate that ? Or may be pant Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now