Ravichandran Ashwin... is he fit enough to play test cricket?

[Vilander]

7 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Nobody is defending anything, we are having a facts based argument here.

 

On his 22nd ball to Moeen he got him out. Moeen scored 9 runs in the previous 21 balls.

 

On his 49th ball to Curran he got him out. In the previous 48 balls Curran scored 23 runs off his bowling. Also an LBW umpire's call but let us forget that for the time being and focus only on the numbers.

 

What do you think is lacking in the stats? Moeen 9(22) and Curran 23(49).......their 2 best batsmen this innings. Average 16, SR never mind.

 

RELEVANT LINK

 

Same question.

 

very good perspective.

[cric_fan]

He just sucks overseas.

 

[Gollum]

38 minutes ago, Vilander said:

dude i agree...they are super fit.

 

but is Ashwin fit enough to be an international athelete..

 

be honest, if you were paid millions and had the skill to be a great international athlete.

 

Would you have any lack of motivation in the morning to pump iron and do all sorts of core strength training to be absolutely on top of what you can do when you are on prime time..how can the guy have a paunch ?  

My comment was aimed at the 'regular every day joe' part. I have seen many Ranji cricketers training from up close and even the fat ones are supremely fit compared to regular Indians.

 

I agree he isn't quite up to the mark desired for an international cricketer of such high repute. I wish he works harder but my focus in test cricket will always be on the skill set. Kumble, Warne, Saqlain, Herath, MacGill, Mushtaq, Kaneria etc were some good/outstanding spinners who were quite short on the fitness parameter. I am sure these guys work hard but maybe the focus is on supple wrists, strong fingers, shoulder strength, hip motion and endurance (long spells) rather than pumping iron...after all spin bowling is a subtle art and doesn't demand brute strength. We do not know for sure how they spend their time, so we can't make judgements on their work ethic. May be the kind of workout these great spinners do doesn't help with their gut measurements or swiftness or explosive power like say the training routine of other specialists. Just my speculation but may be they refrain from weights because it affects their flexibility? I am only making this point because most of the great spinners I have seen look unfit but somehow have the ability to bowl non stop for 35 overs in a day without breaking a sweat, forget cramps which affect even fit batsmen like Kohli, Dravid, Kaif with similar workload.

 

Same is true for the spinners of yesteryear (but fitness wasn't an integral part of cricket back then).......Jadeja, Swann, Lyon may be Murali/Vettori (unsure) are exceptions and deserve credit. 

Edited August 30, 2018 by Gollum

[Vilander]

2 minutes ago, Gollum said:

My comment was aimed at the 'regular every day joe' part. I have seen many cricketers training from up close and even the fat ones are supremely fit compared to regular Indians.

 

I agree he isn't quite up to the mark desired for an international cricketer. I wish he works harder but my focus in test cricket will always be on the skill set. Kumble, Warne, Saqlain, Herath, MacGill, Mushtaq, Kaneria etc were some good/outstanding spinners who were quite short on the fitness parameter. I am sure these guys work hard but maybe the focus is on supple wrists, strong fingers, shoulder strength, hip motion and endurance (long spells) rather than pumping iron...after all spin bowling is a subtle art and doesn't demand brute strength. We do not know for sure how they spend their time, so we can't make judgements on their work ethic. May be the kind of workout these great spinners do doesn't help with their gut measurements or swiftness or explosive power like say the training routine of other specialists. Just my speculation but may be they refrain from weights because it affects their flexibility? I am only making this point because most of the great spinners I have seen look unfit but somehow have the ability to bowl non stop for 35 overs in a day without breaking a sweat, forget cramps which affect even fit batsmen like Kohli, Dravid, Kaif with similar workload.

 

Same is true for the spinners of yesteryear (but then fitness wasn't an integral part of cricket back then).......Jadeja, Swann, Lyon may be Murali/Vettori (unsure) are exceptions and deserve credit. 

Ashwin is pear shaped. Has flimsy wrists. Warne was not ( he was fat though) neither was Kumble..or Murali..

 

He needs to gain core strength, he is obviously tall so has a good frame but nothing else is going for him, may be he is able to run and stand around for long periods and his fitness is primarily from playing cricket and running around.

 

Needs core strength of an athlete and its not that difficult i think he does not do basics even for attaining that, hip problems thigh problems overall unfit..but supremely skilled.

[vvvslaxman]

Passed co co cola test :)

[vvvslaxman]

9 minutes ago, Vilander said:

Ashwin is pear shaped. Has flimsy wrists. Warne was not ( he was fat though) neither was Kumble..or Murali..

 

He needs to gain core strength, he is obviously tall so has a good frame but nothing else is going for him, may be he is able to run and stand around for long periods and his fitness is primarily from playing cricket and running around.

 

Needs core strength of an athlete and its not that difficult i think he does not do basics even for attaining that, hip problems thigh problems overall unfit..but supremely skilled.

True. Madhavan actor was slim, little chubby. he bulked like anything for iruthi sutru. May be this guy should join a professional gym and work on it.

[Vilander]

1 minute ago, vvvslaxman said:

True. Madhavan actor was slim, little chubby. he bulked like anything for iruthi sutru. May be this guy should join a professional gym and work on it.

In intent yes, Although Madhavan just put on some muscles..not sure if he got any core strength or flexibility..

 

Bulking even with muscles is mostly working out and eating right ( you see all bollywood muppets do this often and Kamal hasan etc do it all the time -- very easy to do all can, just eat whey  and some creatine ( like beef or drink creatine) and go to gym or do floor exercise), some people also eat a lot and bulk with some additional adipose tissue..fat on top of a bit of muscle buildup.

 

Strength training is for specific muscle groups ( difficult to do, needs fitness instructor and or trainer - but builds core strength for a specific sport) UFC , weight lifters, gymnasts do it differently..for their own requirements..

 

Ashiwn looks like he trains for cricket does not strength train or does very little to be passable..has never done any working out in his life to build muscles which might have been a good thing for him till now for flexibility..but also makes him look very unfit when he carries a paunch..

[asterix]

^ basically “naram tatti”.... Guy who can only do soft poops... Would struggle to pass hard shyte...

[vvvslaxman]

42 minutes ago, Vilander said:

In intent yes, Although Madhavan just put on some muscles..not sure if he got any core strength or flexibility..

 

Bulking even with muscles is mostly working out and eating right ( you see all bollywood muppets do this often and Kamal hasan etc do it all the time -- very easy to do all can, just eat whey  and some creatine ( like beef or drink creatine) and go to gym or do floor exercise), some people also eat a lot and bulk with some additional adipose tissue..fat on top of a bit of muscle buildup.

 

Strength training is for specific muscle groups ( difficult to do, needs fitness instructor and or trainer - but builds core strength for a specific sport) UFC , weight lifters, gymnasts do it differently..for their own requirements..

 

Ashiwn looks like he trains for cricket does not strength train or does very little to be passable..has never done any working out in his life to build muscles which might have been a good thing for him till now for flexibility..but also makes him look very unfit when he carries a paunch..

Exactly what else you have to do. lol not like doing production support late in the night like me  With everything from cleaning the house, mowing the lawn, driving up and down 60 miles every day i still find time to work out. What is wrong with these guys.

[Sachinism]

People complaining a spinner didn't run through a batting line-up on a Day 1 pitch in England

[vvvslaxman]

17 minutes ago, Sachinism said:

People complaining a spinner didn't run through a batting line-up on a Day 1 pitch in England

I have no problems with bowling. Actually, he is bowling better than ever in an overseas tour. Needs a bit of luck. He will have a role to play at the Oval.

[asterix]

People complaining a spinner didn't run through a batting line-up on a Day 1 pitch in England

No, complaint about how left handed Curran and Moin tonked this spinner out if attack few times. Realised after a long time to change his pace to get his wicket. By that time it was too late. England ended up having a decent score once again, after getting reduced to 86/6... 

 

You don’t always need spin to take wickets...

[asterix]

As Ashwin has not been effective on Left handed batsmen, no harm in dropping him in the next match for Jaddu...

[shortbread]

 

7 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

I have no problems with bowling. Actually, he is bowling better than ever in an overseas tour. Needs a bit of luck. He will have a role to play at the Oval.

No spinner is going to be effective on a day 1 pitch with no real rough/foot holes to utilize. The reason ashin bowled so much is because apart from Bumrah, shami and Ishant, Kohli had no one else to turn to.

 

I don't like to see Bumrah bowl 20 overs a day regularly. That doesn't bode well.

[Gollum]

6 minutes ago, asterix said:

No, complaint about how left handed Curran and Moin tonked this spinner out if attack few times. Realised after a long time to change his pace to get his wicket. By that time it was too late. England ended up having a decent score once again, after getting reduced to 86/6... 

 

You don’t always need spin to take wickets...

The numbers were presented in the previous page, too bad you didn't respond to that. If you could take some time out and pin point your exact grouse we could arrive at something substantial. If 9(22) constitutes tonking, may be you have exceptionally high standards.

[cricketpitch]

On a day 1 wicket a spinner takes 2/40 and we are still complaining? The basic fact is that the moisture in the pitch dried up and it became a good batting wicket in the afternoon, like it always does in England. Sam Curran is a good young player and he just played positively and scored runs. Ashwin did well to keep runs under check and picked up 2 wickets. On an overseas tour, this is the best you can expect from your premier spinner on first innings of a Test match. I know some people just want to get rid of him from the team for Good, but that aint happening for the moment, so scream as much as you want, Juddu isn't getting in. 

[Vilander]

2 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

Exactly what else you have to do. lol not like doing production support late in the night like me  With everything from cleaning the house, mowing the lawn, driving up and down 60 miles every day i still find time to work out. What is wrong with these guys.

exactly..lol. thats what irritates me about Ashwin..

 

but sorry to hear abt production support..the ravages of IT..

 

mowing the lawn in summer and clearing the snow in winter is hard work though hehe..careful with the back but its healthy.

[The Dark Horse]

8 hours ago, rtmohanlal said:

i don't  understand the OTT  criticism Ashwin is getting here.Agreed he could have done a bit more, but 246 still is a fine performance by bowling unit. Now it is up to the batting to show up. Put at least 375  on the board and then can  have a chance.

The site needs time pass

[Khota]

He looks unfit and not at all athletic.

[VT87]

8 hours ago, Vilander said:

Define a great Indian spinner in overseas conditions waiting.

Kumble I have a huge respect about this man.if iam not wrong he was instrumental for our win in Perth and got bucket full of wickets in 2003 series in aus.i am yet waiting for that kind of performance by fatso Ashwin.hamar apna minefield expert Ashwin