Bombay Stock Exchange ( $ 4 trillion USD ) on the verge of exceeding London Stock Exchange in market capitalization ( value )

[rangeelaraja]

https://swarajyamag.com/news-brief/a-rise-of-more-than-37-per-cent-in-indian-stock-market-will-make-it-overtake-the-uks-in-value-might-happen-sooner-than-you-think

 

 

Thanks to the great savings culture we have and an increasing capital markets savvy populace - we are almost at par with London Stock exchange in terms of value of stocks.

 

I think it is reasonable to expect Sensex ( not at 61K ) to breach 100K by 2024  - which would be a CAGR of 17 % - which should be expected if the real economy grows 8-9 % real.

[rangeelaraja]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-11/roaring-india-stock-market-on-track-to-overtake-u-k-s-in-value

 

 

Quote

India’s equity market is on the cusp of overtaking that of the U.K. in value to join the world’s top-five club, at least by one measure. The likely feat comes as record-low interest rates and a retail-investing boom propel stocks in the former British colony to record highs.

 

 

Shameless despicable desis disgracefully choose to address India by " former British Colony"

[sandeep]

Never understand why desis get excited about such meaningless 'metrics'.

 

 

[mishra]

5 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Never understand why desis get excited about such meaningless 'metrics'.

 

 

I think if you start from way behind in say a never ending marathon, every time you overtake sometone aka meaningless stat is actually achievement. 
 

Or lets put it another way. People from a remote village take pride just in case someone from their village cleared Civil Services exam. Because he is smartest person among the villager. And feeling is absolutely understandable 

[sandeep]

1 hour ago, mishra said:

I think if you start from way behind in say a never ending marathon, every time you overtake sometone aka meaningless stat is actually achievement. 
 

Or lets put it another way. People from a remote village take pride just in case someone from their village cleared Civil Services exam. Because he is smartest person among the villager. And feeling is absolutely understandable 

That's a comparison that does not fit.

[rangeelaraja]

5 hours ago, sandeep said:

Never understand why desis get excited about such meaningless 'metrics'.

 

 

 

How is it “meaningless “ ? Do you think if it were truly “meaningless” major global news outlets would publish such news ? 
 

Britain - a country that was until 80 years ago the most eminent economic power in the world and had a colonial outpost in almost every corner of the planet and more relevantly  colonized India for 200 years - we have nudged them in 80 years despite extraordinary odds to even survive as a country. 
 

This number is an indication of the coming of age of Corporate India. 
 

London Stock exchange was the benchmark and now our very own BSE has or is about to nudge it. 
 

It may be a bit symbolic - but it is a strong reminder that India that was the  prosperous civilization on the planet for a millennia while Europe and the Western world were in their darks ages ——-is on its way to its glory days. 

70-80 years is a very small time in the life cycle of a 5000 yr+ civilization like India .

 

I am a massive massive admirer of America — but fathom this - India achieved independence in 1947 and is only 74 years as a country that was colonized for centuries. 

 

America achieved independence in 1776,

74 years later  in 1850 - what was the status of America in the comity of nations ?  An upcoming country with huge resources - but nothing like even the tiny European powers. 
 

India of 2021 is far far more accomplished RELATIVELY than what America was in 1850 - if we use 74 years as a benchmark —— and we did all this under the grind of democracy. 
 

Likewise - America became the undisputed numero UNO around 1945/46 after the WW2 

- that’s roughly 170 years after it’s independence.

 

Can you even imagine what India is going to be in 2117 ( if we apply some linear extrapolation) ? 
 

I think linear extrapolation is more than fair because we are too old and too wise  a civilization not to find our rightful place again.

 

What you call a “meaningless metric “ is just a small symbolic milestone, a milestone none the less.

 

 

Edited October 15, 2021 by rangeelaraja

[coffee_rules]

6 hours ago, sandeep said:

Never understand why desis get excited about such meaningless 'metrics'.

 

 

Instead, We should deride ourselves with GHI and world ranking next to Sudan and New Guinea

[ravishingravi]

If you see the % investment per capita in stock markets, this is nothing. With consistent growth and more domestic investment, this could third largest by market cap in 2030. 

[rangeelaraja]

41 minutes ago, ravishingravi said:

If you see the % investment per capita in stock markets, this is nothing. 

 

 

Sorry but you make  an extremely ignorant comment.  Obviously the per capita investment would be lower because our per capita incomes are much lower.

 

But it is way more complicated than that.  Culturally, most Indians prefer to invest saving in gold and property - so it is even more dumb to make per capita comparisons.

 

The more pertinent thing is - Market value of corporate India is now equal in market value of corporate Britain. 

 

 

[mishra]

9 hours ago, sandeep said:

That's a comparison that does not fit.

Bong loved it when their economy overtook Pakistan. They deserve that celebration 

[velu]

this non-stop up move is making me nervous , have to think multiple times before selling puts  

 

[ravishingravi]

3 hours ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

 

Sorry but you make  an extremely ignorant comment.  Obviously the per capita investment would be lower because our per capita incomes are much lower.

 

But it is way more complicated than that.  Culturally, most Indians prefer to invest saving in gold and property - so it is even more dumb to make per capita comparisons.

 

The more pertinent thing is - Market value of corporate India is now equal in market value of corporate Britain. 

 

 

 

Sorry, but your response doesn't make sense. We should have exceeded UK market cap long time back. 

 

When one discusses per capital, we are not talking of folks below poverty line. Salaried individuals, sole proprietors, partnerships / businessmen etc. The percentage of savings invested in stock market is nothing in comparison with developed markets. We are still largely investing in fixed income market. 

 

One of the driving factors for these investments are 4 million Demat accounts created each month. Indian domestic investors would be investing close to 3 trillion rupees by 2030 ( number would be close to 1/3 rd of that now ). 

 

The market valuations are still not justifiable given the high P/E ratios and perfomances are not yet justifying the movement. It is also a function of low interest rate environment. 

 

The sensex is not even close to touching its potential. The bull has just begin to kick in. 

 

 

[sandeep]

9 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

Instead, We should deride ourselves with GHI and world ranking next to Sudan and New Guinea

Not sure what your point is  - one can either be satisfied with trumpeting hollow 'achievements', or set sights higher.   Not everything boils down to a "with us or against us' simpleton mindset.  Not everyone who isn't happy regurgitating 'hip hip hooray' chest-thumping, is a 'hater'.  You'd think as long-time regulars on this space, you would know better than that.  But its fine.

[coffee_rules]

50 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Not sure what your point is  - one can either be satisfied with trumpeting hollow 'achievements', or set sights higher.   Not everything boils down to a "with us or against us' simpleton mindset.  Not everyone who isn't happy regurgitating 'hip hip hooray' chest-thumping, is a 'hater'.  You'd think as long-time regulars on this space, you would know better than that.  But its fine.

 

I don't have much reading into the subject, probably was not right to comment, was upset about that other thread. most of the recent uptick in trade could be the amount of Hedge funds from US and world over has invested in volatile markets like India to get a lot of returns. The general outlook in the wake of China-US conflict, is that India would get a lot of capital investment from FDI in the stock market. If you can ignore the Modi guNagaan initially, he (John Chambers former CEO of Cisco) speaks about how India is looked at 

 

 

Edited October 15, 2021 by coffee_rules

[rangeelaraja]

7 hours ago, ravishingravi said:

 

Sorry, but your response doesn't make sense. We should have exceeded UK market cap long time back. 

 

When one discusses per capital, we are not talking of folks below poverty line. Salaried individuals, sole proprietors, partnerships / businessmen etc. The percentage of savings invested in stock market is nothing in comparison with developed markets. We are still largely investing in fixed income market. 

 

One of the driving factors for these investments are 4 million Demat accounts created each month. Indian domestic investors would be investing close to 3 trillion rupees by 2030 ( number would be close to 1/3 rd of that now ). 

 

The market valuations are still not justifiable given the high P/E ratios and perfomances are not yet justifying the movement. It is also a function of low interest rate environment. 

 

The sensex is not even close to touching its potential. The bull has just begin to kick in. 

 

 

 

@ravishingravi

 

You know very little my friend, this is not even half baked knowledge.

 

You contradict your own-self in the statements highlighted in bold. If we should have exceeded UK market cap back long time back then how are current market valuations unjustifiably high ? 

 

First off - per capita retail investors contribution to the markets has to do with the overall attractiveness of other asset classes in the country.

In India property and GOLD are still no.1 preferred by most middle class families. All the residual savings goes to stocks -- this is unlike alot of Western countries.

 

Secondly to your absurd point above, here is a little piece of knowledge : 

 

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/marketcapgdp.asp

 

Stock Market Cap / GDP ratio has been proven to be a solid thumb rule indicator of stock market attractiveness ( overvalued, undervalued, fairly priced ) 

 

Where a ratio of 1 = has been an indicator of about fully priced/fair value.

 

This Finance rule has worked for over 100 years of historical data and is used by someone who can be called the father of Rakesh Jhunjhunwala - ( Warren Buffet )

 

The fact that India and UK's GDP are both a shade above $ 3 trillion and the market cap of LSE and BSE are roughly $ 3.5 trillion  i.e.  1.15 times the GDP  again justifies this ratio rule and that global markets are a little overvalued.

 

India's economy is only now shading UK for GDP so it makes sense that BSE is also shading LSE. 

 

So there was no way our market cap should have exceeded theirs long time back while our GDP was smaller.  

 

The US has a 2021 GDP of roughly $23T vs. NYSE market cap of $26 T. Again justifying how this ratio works.

 

Hope you learnt something .

 

 

 

 

[ravishingravi]

1 hour ago, rangeelaraja said:

 

@ravishingravi

 

You know very little my friend, this is not even half baked knowledge.

 

You contradict your own-self in the statements highlighted in bold. If we should have exceeded UK market cap back long time back then how are current market valuations unjustifiably high ? 

 

First off - per capita retail investors contribution to the markets has to do with the overall attractiveness of other asset classes in the country.

In India property and GOLD are still no.1 preferred by most middle class families. All the residual savings goes to stocks -- this is unlike alot of Western countries.

 

Secondly to your absurd point above, here is a little piece of knowledge : 

 

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/marketcapgdp.asp

 

Stock Market Cap / GDP ratio has been proven to be a solid thumb rule indicator of stock market attractiveness ( overvalued, undervalued, fairly priced ) 

 

Where a ratio of 1 = has been an indicator of about fully priced/fair value.

 

This Finance rule has worked for over 100 years of historical data and is used by someone who can be called the father of Rakesh Jhunjhunwala - ( Warren Buffet )

 

The fact that India and UK's GDP are both a shade above $ 3 trillion and the market cap of LSE and BSE are roughly $ 3.5 trillion  i.e.  1.15 times the GDP  again justifies this ratio rule and that global markets are a little overvalued.

 

India's economy is only now shading UK for GDP so it makes sense that BSE is also shading LSE. 

 

So there was no way our market cap should have exceeded theirs long time back while our GDP was smaller.  

 

The US has a 2021 GDP of roughly $23T vs. NYSE market cap of $26 T. Again justifying how this ratio works.

 

Hope you learnt something .

 

 

 

 

 

Well I don’t know about your understanding of markets, but you certainly seemed to have mastered the art of using a lot of words without saying anything. Raja is certainly rangeela.

 

As for learning from all that, I would say that a treasury dealer should ideally not take taxi driver’s tips when playing with corpus of his clients. 
 

[ravishingravi]

6 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

 

I don't have much reading into the subject, probably was not right to comment, was upset about that other thread. most of the recent uptick in trade could be the amount of Hedge funds from US and world over has invested in volatile markets like India to get a lot of returns. The general outlook in the wake of China-US conflict, is that India would get a lot of capital investment from FDI in the stock market. If you can ignore the Modi guNagaan initially, he (John Chambers former CEO of Cisco) speaks about how India is looked at 

 

 

Yes what he says is correct long term. You have to be out of your mind to bet against India. What we are seeing now are mix of liquidity flows, impact of solid reforms and strong macro and quarterly numbers. 
 

There will be shocks coming in. But if one stars invested for 10 years, this market is going places. 

[rangeelaraja]

44 minutes ago, ravishingravi said:

 

Well I don’t know about your understanding of markets, but you certainly seemed to have mastered the art of using a lot of words without saying anything. Raja is certainly rangeela.

 

As for learning from all that, I would say that a treasury dealer should ideally not take taxi driver’s tips when playing with corpus of his clients. 
 

 

 

There are lots of angootha chap's who do technical analysis and charting but know jack **** about basic Economics and Finance .

 

If you call Warren Buffet and Investopedia a taxi driver "tip" then you must be living under a rock. The ratio has a 100 year track record.  When you lack education its hard to reason.

 

 

[rangeelaraja]

1 hour ago, ravishingravi said:

 

Well I don’t know about your understanding of markets, but you certainly seemed to have mastered the art of using a lot of words without saying anything. Raja is certainly rangeela.

 

As for learning from all that, I would say that a treasury dealer should ideally not take taxi driver’s tips when playing with corpus of his clients. 
 

 

 

 I am a CFA charterholder. What's your qualification ?  You clearly sound like those pan thooking "brokers" who understand zilch about asset allocation and cultural bias toward asset allocation. It is sophisticated finance.

 

Retail investors in China a bit like India do not like stocks - their real estate sector is always overheated - a property in Shanghai and Beijing is often as expensive or pricier than a comparable NY property. This is the result of over exposure to real estate.

 

https://www.marketplace.org/2021/05/10/real-estate-important-gamble-china/

 

For middle class Indian households stocks will always be 3rd or 4th favorite after Property, Gold and perhaps a strong FD account.

Edited October 15, 2021 by rangeelaraja

[Vilander]

On 10/14/2021 at 2:43 PM, rangeelaraja said:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-11/roaring-india-stock-market-on-track-to-overtake-u-k-s-in-value

 

 

 

 

Shameless despicable desis disgracefully choose to address India by " former British Colony"

Seriously wtf is a former British colony piece of scum.. *ing scum. Is there any context to calling it that. India because a Republic after independence prior to that India the larger nation was under British occupation. Its not a *ing colony that prospered afterwards. *ing dim wits.