#HijabRow in Karnataka Schools - where do you stand?

[ash]

6 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

 

Who are these people demanding blanket ban on hijab? 

 

First leftist spread the propaganda that Indian govt has banned hijab in all schools and now next propaganda is that people are demanding blanket ban on hijab. 

There was a post about it for which I replied why it is hypocritical to ask for a Hijab ban. Just a discussion, let’s not get carried away by it

[Trichromatic]

2 minutes ago, ash said:

There was a post about it for which I replied why it is hypocritical to ask for a Hijab ban. Just a discussion, let’s not get carried away by it

 

Which post? 

[Stan AF]

Not surprised this is happening in Karnatak Pradesh. I mean what do you expect from a state whose official poverty is at 21%, god knows the real numbers are. This state is a lab for useless communal issues.

 

Concentrate on issues that will improve your living standards fools.

[Trichromatic]

On 2/11/2022 at 9:07 PM, ash said:

Lol at people acting as if they are doing a service to Indian Muslim women by wanting to ban Hijab 

 

 

Lol at people acting as if India wants to ban hijab for all Muslims everywhere.

 

If a school allows hijab, no one is complaining about it.

 

If a schools bans hijab, some people are supporting the decision and some are opposing it.

 

Then there are some people are discussing imaginary issues like demands of banning hijab for Muslims everywhere.

[ravishingravi]

1 hour ago, Stan AF said:

Not surprised this is happening in Karnatak Pradesh. I mean what do you expect from a state whose official poverty is at 21%, god knows the real numbers are. This state is a lab for useless communal issues.

 

Concentrate on issues that will improve your living standards fools.

 

Lavanya died in your state while resisting conversion. So is your state also going down the same path ?

[Alam_dar]

1 hour ago, Trichromatic said:

 

Lol at people acting as if India wants to ban hijab for all Muslims everywhere.

 

If a school allows hijab, no one is complaining about it.

 

If a schools bans hijab, some people are supporting the decision and some are opposing it.

 

Then there are some people are discussing imaginary issues like demands of banning hijab for Muslims everywhere.

 

This is  not going to stop at the school level, but the next logical step is a ban upon Hijab in all the private offices. 

 

I simply oppose it while:

 

(1) Other religious signs are not banned, but only the Muslim community is targeted. 

(2) The basic principle of Secularism is to support the basic rights and choices of an individual as much as possible,  unless these choices collide with the task. 

(3) Targeting only Hijab in the schools (while leaving all other religious signs) is not a WISE move, and it will only strengthen the radical Mullahs and you will push normal Muslims too towards the Islamic radicalism. 

 

We are not blaming the right for banning Hijab all over the country, but we are criticising it for it's DOUBLE STANDARDS, which is devoid of wisdom, which will only strengthen the radical Islam. 

 

[Trichromatic]

3 minutes ago, Alam_dar said:

 

This is  not going to stop at the school level, but the next logical step is a ban upon Hijab in all the private offices. 

 

I simply oppose it while:

 

(1) Other religious signs are not banned, but only the Muslim community is targeted. 

(2) The basic principle of Secularism is to support the basic rights and choices of an individual as much as possible,  unless these choices collide with the task. 

(3) Targeting only Hijab in the schools (while leaving all other religious signs) is not a WISE move, and it will only strengthen the radical Mullahs and you will push normal Muslims too towards the Islamic radicalism. 

 

We are not blaming the right for banning Hijab all over the country, but we are criticising it for it's DOUBLE STANDARDS, which is devoid of wisdom, which will only strengthen the radical Islam. 

 

 

How is it next logical step?

 

Schools have donned uniform all over India for decades. 

 

Private offices are moving away even from business formals and going towards business casuals, let alone moving towards uniforms.

[coffee_rules]

8 hours ago, Alam_dar said:

 

Wisdom my brother !!! Wisdom!!!

 

What we learn is this that nobody (neither liberals nor Muslims) showed any objection upon the ruling of the Kerala high court. But as soon as "Jai Sri Ram" is involved, then we see the "reaction", where even those Muslim girls are taking Hijab now as protest, who didn't take it previously. 

 

There are 80 other Muslim girls in the school that didn’t wear Hijab earlier and are not wearing now to, just 6 girls were backed by PFI are protesting and wants to break rules. Haramkhor (Naughty) wisdom . The Kerala HC decision was for a police force exam and in a non-BKP ruled state, hence L&Is didn’t protest, here the protests are in a fascist state according to rhem

[coffee_rules]

9 hours ago, Alam_dar said:

I take it serious to read the "arguments" of others with open mind and ponder upon them, before coming to any conclusion. 
 

You wrote:

I don't know how brainwashing the children to believe in the religious stories is going to help the children to become a useful individuals of the society? 

 

Their identity is only being a "Human Being". While brainwashing them to have an identity of Muslim, Hindu, Christian is like to making them in the manufactured units of these religions. 

A manufactured unit is un

able to go against the wishes of it's manufacturer. 

While we are against manufacturing, but to give them the freedom to make their own choice after becoming the adults on the bases of arguments, logic and rationale. 

 

History is already taught in the Secular European schools to the children, but without any bias and bigotry. 

While history is indeed taught by the religious people with bias and bigotry against the others. It is less of history, and more of religious brainwashing, with the aim to turn them into the manufacturing unit with that particular ideology of their parents. 

 

It is totally the opposite. All the western schools teach children philosophy and scientific theories and biology. 

And it it again totally the opposite, the whole education is based upon the aim to support the children to learn to do the "critical thinking" at their own. 

 

The religious education(/brainwashing) turn the children only into "Zombies", with ZERO ability of any critical thinking. 

You are seriously responding to sarchasm to just show how absurd it sounds when you want stop children from knowing their identity and religion. Religion is not just stories, it is about morals and how to treat others.

[coffee_rules]

9 hours ago, ash said:

 

except isolated incidents, there is no data to indicate that Indian Muslims blow themselves when challenged. Infact, the crimes and murders committed due to caste issues would be much more than Hindu - Muslim crime numbers in India.

As I keep repeating in this forum, ICFers clearly have an inherent bias, not willing to acknowledge their issues and at the same time demonising other religions. With absolutely no data to back it up. 

 

That is euphemism for getting to the streets and start destroying public property, kill people because they said something about Allah or his messenger. Anti-CAA protests. Aazad maidan, BengaluruKWB riots over a FB post of a 12-year old boy, Kamlesh Tiwary, Kishen Bharwad, etc are from recent memory

[ash]

20 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

That is euphemism for getting to the streets and start destroying public property, kill people because they said something about Allah or his messenger. Anti-CAA protests. Aazad maidan, BengaluruKWB riots over a FB post of a 12-year old boy, Kamlesh Tiwary, Kishen Bharwad, etc are from recent memory

Already provided stats for communal clashes vs SC/ST crimes, caste crimes are way more. Data does not lie. 

 

Not interested to discuss which is the “lesser evil” among the two religions, for me both sides are bad. But you as a Hindu think everything is good in your side and all Hindus are innocent saints who can’t do anything wrong. Objectivity goes for a toss if you have inherent bias like that.

[Trichromatic]

 

[Trichromatic]

1 hour ago, ash said:

Already provided stats for communal clashes vs SC/ST crimes, caste crimes are way more. Data does not lie. 

 

Not interested to discuss which is the “lesser evil” among the two religions, for me both sides are bad. But you as a Hindu think everything is good in your side and all Hindus are innocent saints who can’t do anything wrong. Objectivity goes for a toss if you have inherent bias like that.

 

Which are these "both sides"?

[MechEng]

15 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

 

Which are these "both sides"?

 

The bottom line is that everyone is still sore about Modi being the PM, which is why they are willing to make strawman arguments all the time.

[coffee_rules]

2 hours ago, ash said:

Already provided stats for communal clashes vs SC/ST crimes, caste crimes are way more. Data does not lie. 

 

Not interested to discuss which is the “lesser evil” among the two religions, for me both sides are bad. But you as a Hindu think everything is good in your side and all Hindus are innocent saints who can’t do anything wrong. Objectivity goes for a toss if you have inherent bias like that.

That’s your assumption about how I think. I never deny caste menace of Hinduism. But in the context of Hindu assertions vs the state, we have always been at the receiving end, from Islamic rule to Brits. The India Independence act of 1935 is pretty much retained in our constitution, so we feel we are still being colonized, from the Brit’s to Nehruvian marxists and they are still hand-in-glove with the Islamists. Never have any issues with common Muslims who are not radical except for some moderate intellectuals who are hypocrites. Caste discrimination stats vs Religious discrimination  stats is a never ending debate with opinions as data to debate about. Waste of time. 

Edited February 13, 2022 by coffee_rules

[ravishingravi]

7 hours ago, Alam_dar said:

 

This is  not going to stop at the school level, but the next logical step is a ban upon Hijab in all the private offices. 

 

I simply oppose it while:

 

(1) Other religious signs are not banned, but only the Muslim community is targeted. 

(2) The basic principle of Secularism is to support the basic rights and choices of an individual as much as possible,  unless these choices collide with the task. 

(3) Targeting only Hijab in the schools (while leaving all other religious signs) is not a WISE move, and it will only strengthen the radical Mullahs and you will push normal Muslims too towards the Islamic radicalism. 

 

We are not blaming the right for banning Hijab all over the country, but we are criticising it for it's DOUBLE STANDARDS, which is devoid of wisdom, which will only strengthen the radical Islam. 

 

 

Your points 1-3. Do you have any basis to establish this or are you just making it up ?

 

1) No one can wear religious symbol over a uniform. If Burkha goes over the uniform and doesn't cover the face, then thats the end of that. Take it up with Swiss, Canada, France and many other nations who have this common sense. Of course they have banned it, we haven't

 

2) No basic principle of secularism is that state will not dictate / infringe with your belief system as long you are not in violation of the constitution ( which seperate religion and state ) in India.

 

3) Again, no other community wears a bee keeper suit that covers the uniform. No one wears any religious costume to  to my knowledge to ward unholy male interest. So, false equivalence again.

 

[ash]

47 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

Caste discrimination stats vs Religious discrimination  stats is a never ending debate with opinions as data to debate about.

There is no debate when numbers are provided. I have given official stats, which is pretty clear that caste based crimes outnumber communal clash crimes  by a long margin. 
 

so next time when you speak about “Indian Muslims blowing themselves up” , think about the crimes committed by your fellow UC Hindus too. Hindu-Muslim fights are real, it is a problem but the numbers are no where near the caste base atrocities.

[ash]

18 minutes ago, ravishingravi said:

No one can wear religious symbol over a uniform.

Have told about the dress that Ayyapa devotees wear over their uniform multiple times. Maybe you don’t know your religion as much as you think you do? 

[Trichromatic]

31 minutes ago, ash said:

Have told about the dress that Ayyapa devotees wear over their uniform multiple times. Maybe you don’t know your religion as much as you think you do? 

 

Can you share reference of any govt school where students wear dress when rule doesn't allow them?

 

And in case you missed it, Hijab is also not banned in many schools in India.

[ravishingravi]

31 minutes ago, ash said:

Have told about the dress that Ayyapa devotees wear over their uniform multiple times. Maybe you don’t know your religion as much as you think you do? 

Now I have no problem with school allowing them. I am sure Madrassas will allow Burkha. If it’s tradition school for Ayyapa community, sure they can. It’s school’s prerogative how they want to run their institutions. Just as this school can decide for itself.