ODI squad for Zimbabwe

[Frustrated]

Won't mind if our top order batsmen play more of Arshdeep in the nets before the WC.  As their problems against left arm pacer continues till date.  

[Ankit_sharma03]

10 hours ago, Frustrated said:

Wonder why no Arshdeep in odi squad.   Is he being groomed for only T20?  

They are giving one final rest to the ones who ll play nonstop after that. Arshdeep , iyer , sky are dropped for that purpose 

 

[vishalvirsingh]

Long Story SHORT-

 

Umran Malik is also getting the same treatment that Varun Aroon got. Varun aroon was said to be spraying the ball all over and Umran who bowled accurately in IPl did spray in a few matches.

 

But Umesh Yadav sprays even today, deepak chahar does , avesh khan and Prasidh too- why cant you have some patience with a guy who has some exceptional capability.

 

No one bowls 150K today and this guys has bowled @157K at IPL. He is at least 8 to 10K faster than the closest Indian fast bowler i.e. jasprit Boom.

 

So there is a lot of difference. Another fast bowler we have is Navdeep Saini and Tyagi also seems a genuine fast bowler. I am not sure that they are being trained and groomed well.

 

an under 140K Line n length bowler will never be dangerous once the new ball is gone. as soon as the shine is gone these bowlers need weather ( swing conditions) or the Pitch offering some swing Or some genuine tricks to be successfull. we just need to get Umran into indian 18 and get him to bowl more and some times play him ....once he is 15 games old , his line n length will automatically fall into place.

[Chakdephatte]

17 hours ago, Suhaan said:

Avesh is disappointing,for India Umran is certainly a rare commodity

Did we ever had the opportunity to have an express bowler like him before?

Krishna,Siraj have had their taste of international cricket They aren't going anywhere

You arr arguing as if Umran has played 25-30 games?You have to fast-track few guys he and Tyagi are one of those

 

This hypocrisy. Umran needs 25-30 games for no reason. Avesh is disappointed after 8 matches. And that when he has way better T20 potential than one-dimensional Umran.

Edited August 1, 2022 by Chakdephatte

[Suhaan]

4 hours ago, Chakdephatte said:

 

This hypocrisy. Umran needs 25-30 games for no reason. Avesh is disappointed after 8 matches. And that when he has way better T20 potential than one-dimensional Umran.

Listen dude,it was you who first came up with this

And if it were true, Umran didn't even play that amount of cricket which Avesh has

So ,you have already decided Umran has a lesser ceiling than Avesh?

[Chakdephatte]

35 minutes ago, Suhaan said:

Listen dude,it was you who first came up with this

And if it were true, Umran didn't even play that amount of cricket which Avesh has

So ,you have already decided Umran has a lesser ceiling than Avesh?

 

And you have decided other talents are just of the mill but Umran is exceptional. 

 

23 hours ago, Suhaan said:

Umran is not just your regular run of the mill bowler,same goes with Tyagi

You have to think out of the box to for some certain guys

You cannot limit him into an economical bowler,he will always go for runs His upside will always win India games as well

 

And what exactly is wrong with me saying what I said? How is it different than you saying, "You have to think outside of box for certain guys." If I feel X is better than Y, I'll say it.

 

36 minutes ago, Suhaan said:

Listen dude,it was you who first came up with this.

 

Came up with what? It was Lone Wolf who started it. Secondly, you said Umran will go for runs. I felt it even last day, you misunderstood my reply to it (when you said 25-30 games).

[Suhaan]

20 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

And what exactly is wrong with me saying what I said? How is it different than you saying, "You have to think outside of box for certain guys." If I feel X is better than Y, I'll say it.

Yes,same way i feel Umran isn't finished yet to be branded rubbish so early

 

20 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

Came up with what? It was Lone Wolf who started it. Secondly, you said Umran will go for runs. I felt it even last day, you misunderstood my reply to it (when you said 25-30 games).

I simply don't like when a youngster like him is discarded at the drop of a hat

 

Im not a fan of a particular player,i back youngsters

This same forum was after Pant when he started,i found it really disappointing and kept backking him and even had nasty debates with detractors

 

Umran has serious potential and needs right backing and i feel he has to play against weaker sides regularly(besides getting on with A tours)

I meant he's not a regular thing to have happened to Indian cricket,i really hope and wish he comes good for it will benefit India the most across formats

Edited August 1, 2022 by Suhaan

[Sandz]

10 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

But why only Arshdeep, why not Mohsin, Khaleel, Yash or Mukesh ?
Mohsin, Yash and Khaleel are taller and faster (atleast Mohsin is), while Mukesh can generate greater amount of swing at the similar pace. They performed better than Arshdeep in the IPL as well. Maybe they might turn out to be better than Arshdeep.

 

Discussion was about Arshdeep and none of the others. I would certainly like Mohsin, Tyagi and Sen to be brought into team India fold as well but not at the expense of Arshdeep who has done really well on the limited opportunities given to him, remember he only has played a couple of games and shouldnt be cast aside just to try others who may or may not perform when given the chance, just look at Prasidh, he was supposed to be the saviour on the SAF tour where he never got picked 

 

Edited August 1, 2022 by Sandz

[Sandz]

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

We had Varun Aaron, and we mishandled it royally.
 

 

Absolutely, no disrespect to Avesh or Arshdeep, but there is no harm in propelling ahead someone with higher potential. 

 

What is your basis in saying that Umran has higher potential than the other two? It gets thrown around a lot that he has a higher ceiling, what ceiling is this and how high is it? Other than speed and hype what does he has over them? 

 

I am in no way saying that Umran should be discarded, just that he needs to improve a hell of a lot before playing for team india again.

[Chakdephatte]

34 minutes ago, Suhaan said:

I simply don't like when a youngster like him is discarded at the drop of a hat.

 

Discarded at the drop of hat? Do you realize we are preparing for a World event and have to give practice to our main players rather than trying out 'talented youngsters'. And I even oppose playing Arshdeep so close to it . If anything, he is lucky to get the two matches he got this early in his career.

 

And how do you know he was dropped? Most probably, they just wanted give him international exposure, and he will come back after the WT20 is over.

Edited August 1, 2022 by Chakdephatte

[Chakdephatte]

15 minutes ago, Sandz said:

What is your basis in saying that Umran has higher potential than the other two? It gets thrown around a lot that he has a higher ceiling, what ceiling is this and how high is it? Other than speed and hype what does he has over them? 

 

Time to throw some light @Suhaan,

@Lone Wolf

I guess you are the only two.

[Suhaan]

22 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

 

Discarded at the drop of hat? Do you realize we are preparing for a World event and have to give practice to our main players rather than trying out 'talented youngsters'. And I even oppose playing Arshdeep so close to it . If anything, he is lucky to get the two matches he got this early in his career.

 

And how do you know he was dropped? Most probably, they just wanted give him international exposure, and he will come back after the WT20 is over.

We will see how our "main players" fare in the upcoming World event

If he comes back or is in the reckoning,that will be really good

[singhvivek141]

1 hour ago, Sandz said:

 

What is your basis in saying that Umran has higher potential than the other two? It gets thrown around a lot that he has a higher ceiling, what ceiling is this and how high is it? Other than speed and hype what does he has over them? 

 

I am in no way saying that Umran should be discarded, just that he needs to improve a hell of a lot before playing for team india again.

Umran has raw pace, has a decent yorker and he can really strangle the teams who are weak against pace. Pure pace hitting the stumps at 150k is not easy to dislodge.
Second name on my list was Tyagi, and he has almost all the skills which a bowler need to have (pace, bounce, movement, yorker, slower one), he just need to learn when to use them..

I agree Umran has to improve, but the pace that he carries gives him an extra edge and with little guidance he can really be a match winner with the ball.
But problem is, we are not doing A tours after Covid, and playing him against Aus, SA, NZ, Eng is a bit of gamble considering his experience. So play him against weaker team for a year and see where he goes.

[vishalvirsingh]

Saini, Umran and Tyagi are 3 seriously talented genuine fast bowlers and Our selectors have to get their focus back on them.

 

arshdeep/harshal-  nothing against them but i can assure you that they will be ripped apart very soon. already the novelty factor and the tricks that Harshal had have been READ & Understood by International Teams .they may succeed for a while in T20 games. But these 2 guys are defensive bowlers probably OK for T20 but are not going to succeed in ODI's.

check their past performances , they have not succeeded against INDIAN State teams in ODI's.

 

ideally selectors should not have picked these guys as they are customised to T20 cricket. if the selectors are thinking that Harshal and Arshdeep will go to Australia and win us the world cup- they are dreaming.

Aussie quicks /NZ genuine quicks /BOOM and other quicks around the world are the one's that will call the shots and get wickets in AUSTRALIA.

 

T20 world cup is not on INDIAN Patta's where the faster a bowler bowls , faster he is hit or snicks give away a lot of runs.

 

I am calling this out that T20 highest wicket takers and game changing bowlers will be the genuine fast bowlers - I am talking about 140+ fast bowlers only.

these magic bag trick bowlers like bhuvi ( dont think there is much swing in australia), harshal and arshdeep wont succeed. bhuvi and chahar also have swing in first spells and may succeed but i am sure harshal and arshdeep's tricks wont be a hit.

 

aussie tracks are hit the deck tracks , ideal for genuine hard working fast bowlers . i was excited about Prasidh and avesh but both are underperforming. it seems Siraj is the long run pace bowler and selectors need to get their focus back on genuine fast bowlers like umran/saini/tyagi.

 

[wanted_desi]

Umran at current control will be smashed around. He will need to work a lot harder to succeed at a international level.

[tweaker]

 Shahbaz Ahmed replaces injured Washington Sundar for Zimbabwe series.

[Majestic]

Why not Tewatiya?

[Lone Wolf]

2 hours ago, Majestic said:

Why not Tewatiya?

He is basically a part timer.  And honestly Shahbaaz has killed it in IPl & domestic cricket off late for Bengal.  Well deserved. 

[singhvivek141]

On 8/4/2022 at 12:23 AM, vishalvirsingh said:

Saini, Umran and Tyagi are 3 seriously talented genuine fast bowlers and Our selectors have to get their focus back on them.

 

arshdeep/harshal-  nothing against them but i can assure you that they will be ripped apart very soon.

 

I think we need to move away from Saini now, we missed a trick by not playing him when he was in form of his life (2016-2017) and when he was picked, got injured soon after and then Covid took over.
Now he's knocking 30's and will start loosing pace by the age of 33-34. In comparion, Tyagi and Umran are young (21-22) and if properly handled they can serve the Indian Team for a longer duration.
Even the likes of Kuldeep Sen, Mavi, Nagarkoti, Rajvardhan should also be backed, specially Nagarkoti and Rajvardhan as they have the potential to bat.

Personally, to me Arshdeep looks a very down to earth hard working lad, who can actually improve further.
He has got good accuracy, a calm head, has a left armer advantage and if he can up his pace in 135-140 range, he can trouble most of the batters.

Edited August 16, 2022 by singhvivek141

[Chakdephatte]

On 8/1/2022 at 9:48 PM, Sandz said:

What is your basis in saying that Umran has higher potential than the other two? It gets thrown around a lot that he has a higher ceiling, what ceiling is this and how high is it? Other than speed and hype what does he has over them? 

 

No reply from fast bowling experts 

Edited August 17, 2022 by Chakdephatte