Indian spearhead - Bhuvi v SA spearhead - Nortje (T20WC22)

[zen]

Talking about "stats" as someone said "Bhuvi" the top pick on excel

 

In 2022 so far

 

Bhuvi 

 

	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	Ave	Econ	SR	4	5
v Afghanistan	1	1	4.0	1	4	5	5/4	0.80	1.00	4.8	0	1
v Australia	2	2	7.0	0	91	1	1/39	91.00	13.00	42.0	0	0
v England	2	2	6.0	1	25	4	3/15	6.25	4.16	9.0	0	0
v Hong Kong	1	1	3.0	0	15	1	1/15	15.00	5.00	18.0	0	0
v Ireland	2	2	7.0	1	62	2	1/16	31.00	8.85	21.0	0	0
v Pakistan	2	2	8.0	0	66	5	4/26	13.20	8.25	9.6	1	0
v South Africa	5	4	14.0	0	85	6	4/13	14.16	6.07	14.0	1	0
v Sri Lanka	3	3	10.0	0	75	3	2/9	25.00	7.50	20.0	0	0
v West Indies	6	6	19.0	1	139	5	2/35	27.80	7.31	22.8	0	0

 

Bhuvi destroying AFG, HK, SL, WI, etc.!

 

 

While Rabada, not good enough to be played against those teams  

 

 

	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	Ave	Econ	SR	4	5
v England	2	2	7.0	0	65	1	1/35	65.00	9.28	42.0	0	0
v India	7	7	25.0	1	183	4	1/15	45.75	7.32	37.5	0	0

 

 

Edited October 9, 2022 by zen

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, zen said:

Talking about "stats" as someone said "Bhuvi" the top pick on excel

 

In 2022 so far

 

Bhuvi 

 

Career summary

Groupinghttp://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/blackArrowUp.gif	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	Ave	Econ	SR	4	5
v Afghanistan	1	1	4.0	1	4	5	5/4	0.80	1.00	4.8	0	1
v Australia	2	2	7.0	0	91	1	1/39	91.00	13.00	42.0	0	0
v England	2	2	6.0	1	25	4	3/15	6.25	4.16	9.0	0	0
v Hong Kong	1	1	3.0	0	15	1	1/15	15.00	5.00	18.0	0	0
v Ireland	2	2	7.0	1	62	2	1/16	31.00	8.85	21.0	0	0
v Pakistan	2	2	8.0	0	66	5	4/26	13.20	8.25	9.6	1	0
v South Africa	5	4	14.0	0	85	6	4/13	14.16	6.07	14.0	1	0
v Sri Lanka	3	3	10.0	0	75	3	2/9	25.00	7.50	20.0	0	0
v West Indies	6	6	19.0	1	139	5	2/35	27.80	7.31	22.8	0	0

 

Bhuvi destroying AFG, HK, SL, WI, etc.!

 

 

While Rabada, not good enough to be played against those teams  

 

 

Career summary

Groupinghttp://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/blackArrowUp.gif	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	Ave	Econ	SR	4	5
v England	2	2	7.0	0	65	1	1/35	65.00	9.28	42.0	0	0
v India	7	7	25.0	1	183	4	1/15	45.75	7.32	37.5	0	0

 

 

 

• so rabada vs eng and india - 9 games 5 wkts 
• bhuvi vs Eng+ SA+ Aus - 9 games 11 wkts 

 

 

lannat hai rabada pe

 

not to forget bhuvi was Man of the series vs Eng and SA where as rabada was avg 65 and 45 against eng and india 

Edited October 9, 2022 by Ankit_sharma03

[zen]

8 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

• so rabada vs eng and india - 9 games 5 wkts 
• bhuvi vs Eng+ SA+ Aus - 9 games 11 wkts 

 

 

lannat hai rabada pe

 

Exactly, lannat hai Rabada pe ... Was only played in 7 games and that too in Eng & Ind, while the great Bhuvi played the teams in everywhere, honing his skills against those teams w/o accounting for their actual strength and form 

Edited October 9, 2022 by zen

[zen]

Talking more about stats

 

In 2022

 

Avesh Khan  Avg 32, Eco 9, SR 21

 

Rabada Avg 50, Eco 8, SR 38 

 

 

I guess, Avesh must be better

 

 

 

PS (talking about picking games from Avesh's stats, while taking every game from Rabada's stats) 

 

Rabada 7 games, 5 wkts (v Eng & Ind)

 

Avesh 6 games, 5 wkts (v Eng & SA) 

 

So Avesh took as many wkts against those selected teams by playing 1 game less

Edited October 9, 2022 by zen

[zen]

More noob-like stats and analysis:

 

2022

 

Harshal Avg 30, Eco 9, SR 19 

 

Rabada Avg 50, Eco 8, SR 38 

 

 

So all 3 india bowlers have better "stats"(and therefore must be better than Rabada) ...Poor Rabada!

 

 

 

 

[express bowling]

White ball cricket, and even more so T20 cricket, is about seizing the big moments and acing the crunch situations. It is not about overall stats of a player.

 

Steve Smith won't be considered a great ODI batsman based on overall stats.  Average of 44 and SR of 87 is not great in this era.

 

But he scored a 100+ in the semifinal of the 2015 WC and followed with with a 56 not out in the WC final to win a low scoring game. Scored 65 in the QF as well.

 

That is called a crunch player who seizes the big moments and helps his team win big tournaments.

 

I want such crunch players. I don't want the stats padders who look after themselves by performing well in low key games. 

Edited October 9, 2022 by express bowling

[Number]

Bhuvi certainly isn't a great T20 bowler and can be easily replaced even by an Indian bowler in most of the matches where ball doesn't swing.

However Rabada hasn't done much in T20s either. 

[coffee_rules]

Rabada is not a great T20 bowler to compare against. 

[zen]

Just now, coffee_rules said:

Rabada is not a great T20 bowler to compare against. 

 

Ok, whom do you want the great Bhuvi to be compared against? 

 

Pak's Saheen, which is also in Ind's group? 

[Adamant]

40 minutes ago, express bowling said:

White ball cricket, and even more so T20 cricket, is about seizing the big moments and acing the crunch situations. It is not about overall stats of a player.

 

Okay, noted. 

Now tell me when did Rabada perform in crunch situations? 

 

This thread is just comparing Rabada and Bhuvi as t20 bowlers. 

 

 

[Adamant]

41 minutes ago, express bowling said:

White ball cricket, and even more so T20 cricket, is about seizing the big moments and acing the crunch situations. It is not about overall stats of a player.

 

Steve Smith won't be considered a great ODI batsman based on overall stats.  Average of 44 and SR of 87 is not great in this era.

 

But he scored a 100+ in the semifinal of the 2015 WC and followed with with a 56 not out in the WC final to win a low scoring game. Scored 65 in the QF as well.

 

That is called a crunch player who seizes the big moments and helps his team win big tournaments.

 

I want such crunch players. I don't want the stats padders who look after themselves by performing well in low key games. 

Also, basw on your analysis. 

Devilliers, Sachin etc aren't great players. 

 

This is something which I absolutely disagree with. 

Rating a player as great just bcoz he performed in the finals or semifinals. 

 

Faulkner must be a great player too. 

[Adamant]

For those who are putting Rabada over Bhuvi in t20s, please tell me what's the criteria. 

 

The most obvious one is speed, Indians are getting too much obsessed with pace, quite ironic as we have been the worst fast bowling nation ever. 

[Adamant]

I am well aware of OP's iq level, seeing his strawman arguments makes my belief even more rigid.. 

[express bowling]

I did not talk about great players.

 

I talked about the players I want for white ball cricket. 

 

Tendulkar and deVilliers proved their greatness in test cricket.

 

P.S .. There can be crunch situations and big matches other than finals and Semifinsls too. 

Edited October 9, 2022 by express bowling

[zen]

39 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

P.S .. There can be crunch situations and big matches other than finals and Semifinsls too. 

 

Only stats-padding situations count 

 

 

 

Edited October 9, 2022 by zen

[Chakdephatte]

1 hour ago, express bowling said:

White ball cricket, and even more so T20 cricket, is about seizing the big moments and acing the crunch situations. It is not about overall stats of a player.

 

Steve Smith won't be considered a great ODI batsman based on overall stats.  Average of 44 and SR of 87 is not great in this era.

 

But he scored a 100+ in the semifinal of the 2015 WC and followed with with a 56 not out in the WC final to win a low scoring game. Scored 65 in the QF as well.

 

That is called a crunch player who seizes the big moments and helps his team win big tournaments.

 

I want such crunch players. I don't want the stats padders who look after themselves by performing well in low key games. 

 

Ok, but what does this have to do with the ongoing discussion about Rabada and Bhuvi?

[Chakdephatte]

2 hours ago, zen said:

More noob-like stats and analysis:

2022

Harshal Avg 30, Eco 9, SR 19 

Rabada Avg 50, Eco 8, SR 38 

 

So all 3 india bowlers have better "stats"(and therefore must be better than Rabada) ...Poor Rabada!

 

2 hours ago, zen said:

Avesh Khan  Avg 32, Eco 9, SR 21

 

Rabada Avg 50, Eco 8, SR 38 

I guess, Avesh must be better

 

Funny post. You have just assumed Harshal and Avesh are bad bowlers and bowled worse than anyone. Have you observed others in the same phase? Why Rabada can't bowl worse than him? Are you just assuming he cannot?

[zen]

4 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

 

 

Funny post. You have just assumed Harshal and Avesh are bad bowlers and bowled worse than anyone. Have you observed others in the same phase? Why Rabada can't bowl worse than him? Are you just assuming he cannot?

 

The post is supposed to be funny (and those who understand the point, got it)! 

 

[sandeep]

3 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

• so rabada vs eng and india - 9 games 5 wkts 
• bhuvi vs Eng+ SA+ Aus - 9 games 11 wkts 

 

 

lannat hai rabada pe

 

not to forget bhuvi was Man of the series vs Eng and SA where as rabada was avg 65 and 45 against eng and india 

 

 

 

 

But but but but pphassst bro,  

[sandeep]

2 hours ago, express bowling said:

White ball cricket, and even more so T20 cricket, is about seizing the big moments and acing the crunch situations. It is not about overall stats of a player.

 

Steve Smith won't be considered a great ODI batsman based on overall stats.  Average of 44 and SR of 87 is not great in this era.

 

But he scored a 100+ in the semifinal of the 2015 WC and followed with with a 56 not out in the WC final to win a low scoring game. Scored 65 in the QF as well.

 

That is called a crunch player who seizes the big moments and helps his team win big tournaments.

 

I want such crunch players. I don't want the stats padders who look after themselves by performing well in low key games. 

Please remind us which "crunch" moments has Rabada delivered in for T20s,  which is where this comparison is being made.  Rabada is an elite level choker in T20s, special even among South Africans.