Is Kohli's IPL Performance Being Staged to Secure WC 2024 Spot?

[Ultimate_Game]

2 hours ago, putrevus said:

Good thing for change, bowlers did something for change. 
 

Kohli will be just fine.

 

Bowlers have done pretty well for the most part. It's the batsmen who have yet to show up in any knockout game and that's the reason for 0 ICC trophies

[putrevus]

7 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Bowlers have done pretty well for the most part. It's the batsmen who have yet to show up in any knockout game and that's the reason for 0 ICC trophies

I don’t think so.

 

Bowlers for once have done something.

[Ultimate_Game]

14 hours ago, putrevus said:

I don’t think so.

 

Bowlers for once have done something.

 

Bowlers have shown up more often than not even when you give them a par score. In WC 2023, they were the best bowling lineup. In 2010s they've shown up almost everytime. It's the batting where we've struggled big time in knockouts. I can't recall even one performance from any top order batsman in any knockout match which could make the difference a la Head. And that's where we fail. In 2010s and 2020s, we're expecting bowlers to perform miracles in every knockout match and defend a below par total. As an example we scored a pathetic 240 in WC2023 final when even a 270 could've made the difference and that would've been a par score. At Adelaide in WT20 in 2022, we put up a pathetic 160 odd on a batting beauty. In WT20 2021, our batting simply didn't show up and expecting bowlers to defend below par scores was unreasonable.

 

Even today's match was a miracle and an exception, rather than the rule. Eventually, our batting has to show up in knockouts. We can't keep on lauding our stars and anointing them "King" or "Hitman" when they continuously fail to show up in knockouts. Show up at least once and play an innings like Head played in WTC final or WC2023 final, or the ones which Gambhir played. No WC has been won without a batsman showing up for their team - Richards, Lloyd and company in 1970s, Kapil, Srikanth, Amarnath, Patil etc. in 83, Imran, Inzimam, Miandad in 92, Aravinda De Silva in 96, Steve Waugh in 1999, Ponting & Martyn in 2003, Gilchrist & Hayden in 2007, Dhoni & Gambhir in 2011, Steve Smith in 2015, Stokes in 2019, and Head in 2023. Literally every WC required one tournament defining innings in a knockout. This is where our stars go missing. In 2019 we simply had to play out the new ball while chasing 230 odd and we were 5/3. You can blame bowling all you want but likes of Bumrah, Shami etc. simply haven't received any support from their batsmen who have failed every knockout across tourneys. This won't change unless someone steps up and plays a defining innings in a knockout but I'm not holding my breath based on batsmen's track record.

Edited June 10, 2024 by Ultimate_Game

[Adamant]

He is trying to attack from ball one and isn’t succeeding bcoz the pitch is not that easy.

 

I am quite sure that when it comes off we will see a masterclass and that too against big teams.

 

Also lets wait to see how we chase totals, Kohli will be of paramount importance in chasing

[Kron]

7 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Bowlers have shown up more often than not even when you give them a par score. In WC 2023, they were the best bowling lineup. In 2010s they've shown up almost everytime. It's the batting where we've struggled big time in knockouts. I can't recall even one performance from any top order batsman in any knockout match which could make the difference a la Head. And that's where we fail. In 2010s and 2020s, we're expecting bowlers to perform miracles in every knockout match and defend a below par total. As an example we scored a pathetic 240 in WC2023 final when even a 270 could've made the difference and that would've been a par score. At Adelaide in WT20 in 2022, we put up a pathetic 160 odd on a batting beauty. In WT20 2021, our batting simply didn't show up and expecting bowlers to defend below par scores was unreasonable.

 

Even today's match was a miracle and an exception, rather than the rule. Eventually, our batting has to show up in knockouts. We can't keep on lauding our stars and anointing them "King" or "Hitman" when they continuously fail to show up in knockouts. Show up at least once and play an innings like Head played in WTC final or WC2023 final, or the ones which Gambhir played. No WC has been won without a batsman showing up for their team - Richards, Lloyd and company in 1970s, Kapil, Srikanth, Amarnath, Patil etc. in 83, Imran, Inzimam, Miandad in 92, Aravinda De Silva in 96, Steve Waugh in 1999, Ponting & Martyn in 2003, Gilchrist & Hayden in 2007, Dhoni & Gambhir in 2011, Steve Smith in 2015, Stokes in 2019, and Hea din 2023. Literally every WC required one tournament defining innings in a knockout. This is where our stars go missing. In 2019 we simply had to play out the new ball while chasing 230 odd and we were 5/3. You can blame bowling all you want but likes of Bumrah, Shami etc. simply haven't received any support from their batsmen who have failed every knockout across tourneys. This won't change unless someone steps up and plays a defining innings in a knockout but I'm not holding my breath based on batsmen's track record.

Play one match winning innings. One  lol. Roro and coolie have failed repeatedly dor about 7 tournaments. Should have been dropped after 2020 itself. 

 

 

[cowboysfan]

The one time his tuktuking is needed he decides to play outrageous dumb shots,cant take the Delhi out of him.

[putrevus]

31 minutes ago, cowboysfan said:

The one time his tuktuking is needed he decides to play outrageous dumb shots,cant take the Delhi out of him.

So if he played till 14th over and scored say 45 to 50 runs , would people be okay with it?

[diga]

4 minutes ago, putrevus said:

So if he played till 14th over and scored say 45 to 50 runs , would people be okay with it?

With the pitches we see, that may not be a bad idea... 

PS: Vaguely remember he scored a great knock when SA pitches were prepared with lot of spice in 2018-19 

Edited June 10, 2024 by diga

[cowboysfan]

3 minutes ago, putrevus said:

So if he played till 14th over and scored say 45 to 50 runs , would people be okay with it?

100%.these kinds of pitches need one guy to bat through the innings.

[Bigg Brother]

He will do just fine but don't be delusional about his orange cap. He isn't in that great touch and that is expected from 35 yr old who is trying to catch up the game which is moved ahead of his game. Will do just fine, but don't expect MOTT kind of performance which he delivered in 2014 and 2016 . That era and that Kohli is long gone. 

[putrevus]

33 minutes ago, cowboysfan said:

100%.these kinds of pitches need one guy to bat through the innings.

Who determines pitches are bad? India's score after ten overs was 81/3 on the same pitch.

 

Would you be suprised if India's middle order collpased even on flat pitches.

 

India was 148/4 in 28th over after  Kohli got out in finals and ended up with 240.

[Ultimate_Game]

8 hours ago, Adamant said:

He is trying to attack from ball one and isn’t succeeding bcoz the pitch is not that easy.

 

I am quite sure that when it comes off we will see a masterclass and that too against big teams.

 

Also lets wait to see how we chase totals, Kohli will be of paramount importance in chasing

 

My take is that why change what works for him? His best innings are at no. 3, and he's comfortable doing so. Why turn him into Head? If we want someone to play that role, get Jaiswal or Abhishek. Let Kohli stay at 3. We're trying to fix what's not broken. Going hard from ball 1 is simply not his game and he'll fail more often than succeed.

Edited June 10, 2024 by Ultimate_Game

[Bigg Brother]

As I said , dont be delusional about his orange cap, he is not in form but he will do bare minimum in super 8, will bail India out in one off match in super 8 so SS can make amazing episode on him. He will never win you wc with this form. 

Edited June 13, 2024 by Bigg Brother

[New guy]

On 6/10/2024 at 3:10 PM, putrevus said:

So if he played till 14th over and scored say 45 to 50 runs , would people be okay with it?

But wasnt this the excuse given to keep Jaiswal out? These pitches need proper technique, these pitches need anchors, players to hold ends, blah blah. So if you are failing at doing that, how is Jaiswal worse?

[jf1gp_1]

I just hope selectors finally realise its time to look at the future 

[diga]

Dont think team mgmt is brave enough to drop Kohli during knockouts for an youngster like Jaiswal.. only hope is that Kohli finds form or we are doomed

[putrevus]

Why would any TM drop Kohli. Thankfully they are not idiots like fans.

 

He will be fine in super 8 and he will be the reason if India wins anything also.Let us hope bowlers help him for change in important matches.

 

Some people just have to whine all the time.

[Ultimate_Game]

13 hours ago, putrevus said:

Why would any TM drop Kohli. Thankfully they are not idiots like fans.

 

He will be fine in super 8 and he will be the reason if India wins anything also.Let us hope bowlers help him for change in important matches.

 

Some people just have to whine all the time.

 

Like he has been doing so for more than a decade now 

 

The only reason India wins is if Pant plays freak innings or two or Bumrah and spinners show up. Rohit and Kohli are going to be no-show in knockouts as they have been throughout.

 

And whining is justified when even likes of Pak, SL, WI, and NZ (forget Eng or Aus) have won an ICC trophy over the last decade but our so called "King" has yet to do anything of note in the matches when it matters.

Edited June 16, 2024 by Ultimate_Game

[vvvslaxman]

3 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Like he has been doing so for more than a decade now 

 

The only reason India wins is if Pant plays freak innings or two or Bumrah and spinners show up. Rohit and Kohli are going to be no-show in knockouts as they have been throughout.

 

And whining is justified when even likes of Pak, SL, WI, and NZ (forget Eng or Aus) have won an ICC trophy over the last decade but our so called "King" has yet to do anything of note in the matches when it matters.

Let him first IPL first Then internationals. Baby steps.

[Adamant]

3 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Like he has been doing so for more than a decade now 

 

The only reason India wins is if Pant plays freak innings or two or Bumrah and spinners show up. Rohit and Kohli are going to be no-show in knockouts as they have been throughout.

 

And whining is justified when even likes of Pak, SL, WI, and NZ (forget Eng or Aus) have won an ICC trophy over the last decade but our so called "King" has yet to do anything of note in the matches when it matters.

Yeah he will be no show like Kohli has been in Wt20 2016 sf, wt20 2014 sf, wt20 2014 final, wt20 2016 virtual ko and Wc 2023 semis and finals.

Nice