Weeding out deadwoods. But How?

[Laaloo]

7 minutes ago, velu said:

 

how do you wantyou to be killed ? 

hanging or shot

 

With dhoni in the team  both are pretty much the same 

[express bowling]

2 hours ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

 Also if we remove Not Out's from a stats his avg will indeed go down bcoz you are removing the games when he actually played well. There is no logic behind it.

 

You don't remove the innings with not outs.  That is obviously unfair.

 

You consider runs per innings    ( total runs /  innings batted ) ... to get a clearer picture 

 

From the  list in OP

 

Runs per innings

 

 

Kohli       62  at   97 SR

Rohit       53   at  98 SR

Dhawan  51   at  104  SR

Rahane   49  at 79 SR

Dhoni      31   at  81 SR

Pandya   25   at  115 SR

Jadhav   21   at  95 SR

 

 

If you have lower runs per innings, you must have a high SR

 

1.  Kohli, Dhawan and Rohit are statistically good both in terms of runs per innings and SR.

2.  Pandya makes up for low runs per innings with great SR.

3. Dhoni should have a  SR of 100+ ... for a batsman with 31 runs per innings.

4. Jadhav should have a SR of 110+ as he has only 21 runs per innings.

5. Rahane should get his SR  at 90+

 

 

This shows that Dhoni, Jadhav and Rahane have a lot of room for improvement.

 

 

p.s - Statistics should additionally have Runs per innings for LOIs ...  as getting out in the last 2  overs , trying to hit 6s,  is better than staying not out after following a safe approach.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 12, 2018 by express bowling

[putrevus]

1 minute ago, express bowling said:

 

You don't remove the innings with not outs.  That is obviously unfair.

 

You consider runs per innings    ( total runs / total innings ) ... to get a clearer picture 

 

From the  list in OP

 

Runs per innings

 

 

Kohli       62  at   97 SR

Rohit       53   at  98 SR

Dhawan  51   at  104  SR

Rahane   49  at 79 SR

Dhoni      31   at  81 SR

Pandya   25   at  115 SR

Jadhav   21   at  95 SR

 

 

If you have lower runs per innings, you must have a high SR

 

1.  Kohli, Dhawan and Rohit are statistically good both in terms of runs per innings and SR.

2.  Pandya makes up for low runs per innings with great SR.

3. Dhoni should have a  SR of 100+ ... for a batsman with 31 runs per innings.

4. Jadhav should have a SR of 110+ as he has only 21 runs per innings.

5. Rahane should get his SR  at 90+

 

 

This shows that Dhoni, Jadhav and Rahane have a lot of room for improvement.

 

 

p.s - Statistics should have runs per innings for LOIs ...  as getting out in the last 2 overs overs , trying to hit 6s,  is better than staying not out after following a safe approach.

 

 

 

 

 

Great post this should be benchmark in judging players .

[kosingh]

Pandya's career will go the Yusuf Pathan way, I fear.

[Mosher]

Consolidating doesn't mean playing dot balls which Dhoni does these days a lot. Forget about hitting 4's and 6's he struggles to even rotate the strike and sucks up the momentum. We need a busy player at 4 who will keep rotating the strike with 1's and 2's and then change gears when needed. Dhoni fails at both. 

[rkt.india]

8 minutes ago, kosingh said:

Pandya's career will go the Yusuf Pathan way, I fear.

#7 is that kind of a position, i am afraid. 

[putrevus]

4 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

#7 is that kind of a position, i am afraid. 

That is why it is incredibly important that Pandya improves his bowling, he is not no4/no5 so unless he bowls his ten overs he will become expendable very soon.Sooner or later top three will struggle and pressure will fall on lower order to deliver.

[vvvslaxman]

3 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

#7 is that kind of a position, i am afraid. 

That used to be Raina's position. Someone who can walk in and start hitting. It is a tough position. Since Yuvi was giving us bowling option along with Raina, Sehwag we could go with 4 bowlers. Now our batsmen can't bowl. It forces us to pick someone like Pandya. 

 

[Pollack]

1 hour ago, speedheat said:

Bot, dhoni now a days is a liability, since you are a gadget or software operated from bcci HQ,  let me explain you dhonis credibility in language of gadgests, Bot, today's dhoni is  as useless as

1)Nokia 3210 in india,

3) landline telephones

3) STD booth

4) Kodak dc25 camera

and

Nickelodeon timeblaster alaram clock

Made it simple for you, thank me,lol

5) A coin box telephone. Was very useful once upon a time.(So was dhoni) Now useless since everyone has mobile.

[Austin 3:!6]

1 hour ago, Laaloo said:

Have you seen his numbers at #4 in the last year? Lol they are worthy. The lower dhoni bats is better for us. Actually it would be better if he doesn't get to bat at all.

What are you talking about man? Dhoni batted only ONCE at #4 in last 1 year.

[Rasgulla]

1 hour ago, putrevus said:

He was captain for longest period of time, if he was that good at number 4 why didn't he promote himself when India was losing all those away matches why did he hide.There is one reason he is not that good at that spot he knows it very well too.

If he bats at #4 who would bat at #6 back in those then ? You are struggling to find a #6 now   Ohh if we are winning he bats up to improve average orelse he is hiding LOL. Averages over 50+ with 88SR at #4 but but he is never good. Talk about agenda of certain people..

[Rasgulla]

1 minute ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

What are you talking about man? Dhoni batted only ONCE at #4 in last 1 year.

You know that dumbass agenda.. You really think he would do any research before posting such rubbish. Best way to reply to them is this..

 

 

Aliaaaa

[Rasgulla]

@speedheat Cancer bot you should have retired with your Ailiaaa those so called gadgets are still useful than your Ailiaaa ever was.. 

 

[shortbread]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

We have this guy Rohit sharma who is not completely guilt free scores only against certain oppositions in certain conditions.

My fear is it will be too late by the time the team management realizes.

 

Heading to England, only the top four teams will qualify out of 10. Apart from Bangladesh and Sri-Lanka every other team has a gun pacer. On a fresh English wicket even if flat, combined with a new ball and overcast conditions, Rohit will be a walking wicket. This will then expose Kohli early on.

 

In the two Champions trophies played in England, he has failed against every decent opponent scoring only against the likes of WI, SL, Bangladesh! 

 

This time though India plays against every one of the 9 other competing sides, so the top six will be in a dog eat dog battle. If Dhawan doesn't fire in even one of these games India will be staring at being two down immediately. What's worse is that Rohit is a very slow starter.....his numbers this series Game1 - 20 (30 balls), Game2 - 15 (17 balls), Game3 - 0 (6 balls), Game4 - 5 (13 balls)!! He will be out within 10 overs and leave India with a low run rate piling pressure on batsmen following. 

 

 

[putrevus]

14 minutes ago, Rasgulla said:

If he bats at #4 who would bat at #6 back in those then ? You are struggling to find a #6 now   Ohh if we are winning he bats up to improve average orelse he is hiding LOL. Averages over 50+ with 88SR at #4 but but he is never good. Talk about agenda of certain people..

who is batting at no 6 now.If he was adamant in batting at no4 because he is so good (as per your assertion) , he should have done that then only no point in asking him to be moved to no 4  now.

 

So what you are saying is he is no good at no 6 now so let us move him up to no4.It does not work like that.He had every chance to play at no 4 he did not choose to when he had to offer something there, now he is just holding up an younger player.

[Austin 3:!6]

45 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

You don't remove the innings with not outs.  That is obviously unfair.

 

You consider runs per innings    ( total runs /  innings batted ) ... to get a clearer picture 

 

From the  list in OP

 

Runs per innings

 

 

Kohli       62  at   97 SR

Rohit       53   at  98 SR

Dhawan  51   at  104  SR

Rahane   49  at 79 SR

Dhoni      31   at  81 SR

Pandya   25   at  115 SR

Jadhav   21   at  95 SR

 

 

If you have lower runs per innings, you must have a high SR

 

1.  Kohli, Dhawan and Rohit are statistically good both in terms of runs per innings and SR.

2.  Pandya makes up for low runs per innings with great SR.

3. Dhoni should have a  SR of 100+ ... for a batsman with 31 runs per innings.

4. Jadhav should have a SR of 110+ as he has only 21 runs per innings.

5. Rahane should get his SR  at 90+

 

 

This shows that Dhoni, Jadhav and Rahane have a lot of room for improvement.

 

 

p.s - Statistics should additionally have Runs per innings for LOIs ...  as getting out in the last 2  overs , trying to hit 6s,  is better than staying not out after following a safe approach.

 

 

 

 

 

With due respect, not really. Top orders get to face more deliveries and so runs per innings will be more most of the time. That's why not outs add a speculative amount of runs and boost the average. Your formula only works if we measure players who came exactly on the same over to bat.

[Laaloo]

23 minutes ago, Austin 3:!6 said:

What are you talking about man? Dhoni batted only ONCE at #4 in last 1 year.

Toh do/teen saal ka numbers lo. That's even worse because dhoni has regressed a lot. I wanted to save you the embarrassment but I guess you're asking for it.

 

 

 

Copying from another thread: http://www.indiancricketfans.com/forums/topic/106170-dhoni-should-bat-at-number-4-or-not-be-played/

Edited February 12, 2018 by Laaloo

[express bowling]

This is how Dhoni has done in various batting positions in the last 3 years  ( roughly the period when his ability to hit has reduced noticeably  )

 

                                                          Ave          SR

4th position	2015-2017	9	9	0	320	80	35.55	415	77.10	0	2	1	25	7
5th position	2015-2017	17	17	3	667	134	47.64	730	91.36	1	4	0	44	20
6th position	2015-2018	20	20	9	640	85*	58.18	755	84.76	0	5	0	51	11
7th position	2017-2017	3	3	2	65	49*	65.00	58	112.06	0	0	0	6	2

 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/28081.html?class=2;spanmax1=12+Feb+2018;spanmin1=12+Feb+2015;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

 

 

Statistics are not the be-all and end-all,  but it looks like No.5 is his best position, although even there his SR has to go up to atleast 100.

 

No.4 is worst , both in terms of SR and runs per innings..

[Pollack]

4 minutes ago, express bowling said:

This is how Dhoni has done in various batting positions in the last 3 years  ( roughly the period when his ability to hit has reduced noticeably  )

 

                                                          Ave          SR

4th position	2015-2017	9	9	0	320	80	35.55	415	77.10	0	2	1	25	7
5th position	2015-2017	17	17	3	667	134	47.64	730	91.36	1	4	0	44	20
6th position	2015-2018	20	20	9	640	85*	58.18	755	84.76	0	5	0	51	11
7th position	2017-2017	3	3	2	65	49*	65.00	58	112.06	0	0	0	6	2

 

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/28081.html?class=2;spanmax1=12+Feb+2018;spanmin1=12+Feb+2015;spanval1=span;template=results;type=batting

 

 

Statistics are not the be-all and end-all,  but it looks like No.5 is his best position, although even there his SR has to go up to atleast 100.

 

No.4 is worst , both in terms of SR and runs per innings..

Now, now.........

Dhoni fans: Dhoni should bat at no. 3.

 

[Rasgulla]

19 minutes ago, putrevus said:

who is batting at no 6 now.If he was adamant in batting at no4 because he is so good (as per your assertion) , he should have done that then only no point in asking him to be moved to no 4  now.

 

So what you are saying is he is no good at no 6 now so let us move him up to no4.It does not work like that.He had every chance to play at no 4 he did not choose to when he had to offer something there, now he is just holding up an younger player.

He is batting at #6 now because team has no options.. They have tried couple of players who turned out to be even worse.. since Virat is so good at #3 when isn't he batting at #6 and letting "Youngster" Iyer play at #3 then.. since we are having problems at #6? Are you telling me he is afraid ? Even I can use your stupid logic.. 

 

"Let us move him" ??? Are you go and tell Virat where to play him ? What difference does you or me thinking will have any effect on them?

What opportunities are you even on about ? He played 1 match at #4 last year since Virat became captain. Not sure about blocking part #4 and #6 is still open for anyone.. Lets just say he ll bat at #5 whether you like it or not till 2019WC.. 

 

Like I already said try to find players to replace #4 #5 #6 #7 then we can think about removing Dhoni and Pandya.. Reality is they ll play till 2019wc no matter how much you moan and cry.. Would be better off looking for 2 places that are still up for grab..

Edited February 12, 2018 by Rasgulla