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India cap is not cheap- players like Dube devalue it

maniac

By maniac
in Cricket Talk

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putrevus Grand Master

putrevus

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, maniac said:

We don’t need Pandya and and an inferior version of him. Not advocating for him but at-least Shankar is a proper batsman in the classical mould. That’s at-least an alternative.

Shankar is useless in T20s and Calling Shankar a proper batsman is stretch. You don't need classical batsmen for T20s, you need hitters who can hit from ball one.

 

Shankar, Pandya and this guy all are bits and pieces players at best.They are not allrounders.But Pandya and this guy are needed to give that late flourish and fifth bowling option.

 

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nsareen Collaborator

nsareen

Posted
Posted

What a useless thread title, what has Dube done so bad that he is part of the rubbish title ? I remember jadeja’s early days, he use to be spanked like anything & if not for the backing he got, he would not be what he is today. Players like Dube are rare and needs to be given the right amount of support to succeed and make a mark.


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rkt.india Grand Master

rkt.india

Posted
Posted
On 11/10/2019 at 9:33 PM, maniac said:

I think you are trying to provoke me :laugh: but let me try to clarify again. A guy like Gill,Pant,Kishen,Shaw,Samson,Iyer,Aggarwal etc getting an extended run is fine. These guys are proper cricketers with talent and we need to show patience.

 

Guys like Krunal and Dube not so much as they are not really good in one area. They are in because the fit a certain mould. Not that they are any good.

 

I don’t know what point I am missing or what am I saying that is not able to get through to you. 

Dube averages 48 in FC cricket, 43 in list A cricket. What is Samson's and Kishen's average? Even Iyer's averages are similar.

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express bowling Grand Master

express bowling

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, maniac said:

We don’t need Pandya and and an inferior version of him. Not advocating for him but at-least Shankar is a proper batsman in the classical mould. That’s at-least an alternative.

 

Maniac Bhai .... classical batsmen are not needed in T20s, especially if they are batting at No.5 to No.7.

 

We need high SR big hitters who can hit the ball from ball one.

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gakgupta Collaborator

gakgupta

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 11/3/2019 at 10:38 PM, maniac said:

We seem to induct  anyone and everyone in the team even if it is only the T20 format. 
 

Players have to come through a grind, u-19,FC,A and B teams and then maybe as a last criteria IPl.

 

These performances have to be taken on a weighted average.

 

Just because a player bowled a couple of 140k deliveries and hit a couple of slogs  doesn’t mean he is rewarded with the india cap. It is too sacred.

 

There are plenty of players who have worked hard, performed day in and out waiting on the wings and trash like this gets rewarded :wall:

 

Well...

Look at the position he is playing...

At number 6 or 7, we need someone who can hit from first ball...

It's not about ....how organized the batsmen is...or how technically good he is...

May be the selectors know a thing or 2 about selection ......

I think he earned his chance for T20's

 

Edited by gakgupta
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Ankit_sharma03 Grand Master

Ankit_sharma03

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, gakgupta said:

Well...

Look at the position he is playing...

At number 6 or 7, we need someone who can hit from first ball...

It's not about ....how organized the batsmen is...or how technically good he is...

May be the selectors know a thing or 2 about selection ......

I think he earned his chance for T20's

 

neways 6 n 7 is not even place to bat these technically sound batsman

Samson, gill tried that in IPL n failed

Rohit n Kohli avg 12 n 14 in ODI while batting their 

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maniac Grand Master

maniac

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

Maniac Bhai .... classical batsmen are not needed in T20s, especially if they are batting at No.5 to No.7.

 

We need high SR big hitters who can hit the ball from ball one.

Bhai the point is let us say you can only bat one way of tonking the ball, are useless in every other scenario and your bowling is mediocre at best and you are a 6th bowler how is that 3 dimensional? Sounds one dimensional to me.

 

The best T20 players in the world are all proper batsman who can even play tests. Not specialist hitters

 

India- Rohit,Rahul and Kohli

England- Bairstow,Butler and even Morgan and Stokes

Pakistan- Babar Azam

Australia- Finch,Warner and Smith

Nzl- Taylor and Williamson 

SA - Dekock

 

Now coming to WI I have never seen Russell or Pollard perform in international games and win matches singlehandedly. Most times when WI wins it is either a proper bat like Gayle or someone like Samuels responsible for winning them 2 finals.

 

A good batsman can play in all roles but a hack cannot do Vice versa. I think Iyer has shown more composed big hitting than any of these

specialist big hitters.

 

A guy like Butler will fire 9 out of 10 times than a specialist big hitter like Brathwaite or Asif Ali

 

 

 

 

Edited by maniac
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Ankit_sharma03 Grand Master

Ankit_sharma03

Posted
Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, maniac said:

 

The best T20 players in the world are all proper batsman who can even play tests. Not specialist hitters

 

India- Rohit,Rahul and Kohli

England- Bairstow,Butler and even Morgan and Stokes

Pakistan- Babar Azam

Australia- Finch,Warner and Smith

Nzl- Taylor and Williamson 

SA - Dekock

 

These names u have given is the best xample of how ur getting carried away with images

 

Stokes sorry doesnt have a good t20 record....avg of 15 , s/r of 130 not good for lower order batsman

Aus- Smith himself hasnt been gr8 in t20....his record is similar to dhawan

NZL- Ross taylor , 25 avg n 121 s/r

 

So ur just getting carried away with names ......these are not good records in t20 

 

Now notice one thing all these guys have good record coz they bat up....bat them low all of them struggle which is why ben stokes avg 15 

 

Quote

Now coming to WI I have never seen Russell or Pollard perform in international games and win matches singlehandedly. Most times when WI wins it is either a proper bat like Gayle or someone like Samuels responsible for winning them 2 finals.

Russell took away semi final in 2016 from us

russell n pandya  s/r and avg are both better then stokes.....so how are u calling stokes better i hve no idea

 

Samuels is himself not a gr8 example with a s/r of 116.....he has played a few key knocks but so wud have rusell but since they bat low it wnt look a big score it wud be mostly 20-30s

Quote

A good batsman can play in all roles but a hack cannot do Vice versa. I think Iyer has shown more composed big hitting than any of these

specialist big hitters.

Then why did gill n samson fail in IPL at that position

make kohli m, rohit bat at those position i wanna see how good will they do 

 

top order will always get more balls as compare to these guys who gets max 10-12 balls.....how are they suppose to have better record then kohli, rohit n all 

 

Simple question can these rohit, kohli, finch, warner be even as effective as these guys at 6,7 .....Not in long run

 

Edited by Ankit_sharma03
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express bowling Grand Master

express bowling

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, maniac said:

Bhai the point is let us say you can only bat one way of tonking the ball, are useless in every other scenario and your bowling is mediocre at best and you are a 6th bowler how is that 3 dimensional? Sounds one dimensional to me.

 

I have not called Dube 3 dimensional.

 

Quote

The best T20 players in the world are all proper batsman who can even play tests. Not specialist hitters

 

India- Rohit,Rahul and Kohli

England- Bairstow,Butler and even Morgan and Stokes

Pakistan- Babar Azam

Australia- Finch,Warner and Smith

Nzl- Taylor and Williamson 

SA - Dekock

 

That is because most of them get the chance to bat at 1 to 4 and get to play lots of deliveries.

 

Quote

Now coming to WI I have never seen Russell or Pollard perform in international games and win matches singlehandedly. Most times when WI wins it is either a proper bat like Gayle or someone like Samuels responsible for winning them 2 finals.

 

A good batsman can play in all roles but a hack cannot do Vice versa. I think Iyer has shown more composed big hitting than any of these

specialist big hitters.

 

 

A Kohli or a Williamson won't be able to score a 22 off 10 balls while coming to bat with 3 overs left. 

 

They need some balls to get set.

 

Specialist hitters are needed for this ... but they won't become batting greats as they don't get a chance to score a 50+ or a 80+.

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Vilander Mentor

Vilander

Posted
Posted
On 11/5/2019 at 8:57 AM, maniac said:

A billion people aspire to

earn it.

just being picky here. 

 

I dont like it when anyone equates Indian male cricket team to a cherish of a billion people.

 

49% female all off ( most follow but dont aspire)

 

say 25% under poverty ( so lets consider 12.5% off)  

 

40% older than 40 ? so lets take 20% off

 

thats 81.5% off right there.

 

Then there is kashmir 20mil were 50% who dont aspire to be anything India ,NE another 50 mil people not really interested much in cricket,parts of bengal and Kerala ( 80 mil) for football

 

So lets say 100 mil people where half ( 50mil) the people are not interested in india male cricket , - So thats ~ 5%  corrected to male  only so 2.5 % off

 

so i say 84% of Indian population does not aspire to be in Indian male cricket team ( most of them follow it through) 

 

 

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Vilander Mentor

Vilander

Posted
Posted

@maniac and the reason i ranted above is i really hate ' 1 billion indians' statement in any context.

 

usually it is followed by, 1 billion people in poverty, 1 billion people pooping in open ( mf Inida has 300 mil middle class thats more than EU), or 1 billion people raping women( *ing half is women mf)  or 1 billion dreams for any sporting event  ( most dont give a *)

 

just had to rant..god i really hate this 1 billion thing, why the * are Indians so numerous..*ing stop making babies all.

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Stuge Proficient

Stuge

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, Vilander said:

@maniac and the reason i ranted above is i really hate ' 1 billion indians' statement in any context.

 

usually it is followed by, 1 billion people in poverty, 1 billion people pooping in open ( mf Inida has 300 mil middle class thats more than EU), or 1 billion people raping women( *ing half is women mf)  or 1 billion dreams for any sporting event  ( most dont give a *)

 

just had to rant..god i really hate this 1 billion thing, why the * are Indians so numerous..*ing stop making babies all.

its 1.3 billion now a days lol

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vaul Newbie

vaul

Posted
Posted (edited)

In current SMAT his scores are 4,0,0,1.Overall he has played 26 matches so far and has average of 14.27;s/r = 134.55 .He is yet to score a fifty.

Many on ICF were boasting about his six hitting ability from ball one.He is not better than Shankar or Krunal for his utility as all-rounder.

Edited by vaul
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bowl_out Grand Master

bowl_out

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, vaul said:

In current SMAT his scores are 4,0,0,1.Overall he has played 26 matches so far and has average of 14.27;s/r = 134.55 .He is yet to score a fifty.

Many on ICF were boasting about his six hitting ability from ball one. He is not better than Shankar or Krunal for his utility as all-rounder.

Particularly in ODIs.. Kohli rate Shankar's batting highly during the NZ tour and WC.. wonder why he has suddenly fallen off the radar. 

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