KL Rahul vs Shreyas Iyer for number 4 spot in ODIs

[jusarrived]

How many times do have to say this , no specialist opener has ever succeeded as a MO bat in ODIs . So the comparison is pointless. 
 

KL cannot bat 4 , it’s just a waste of time trying him out there . Give him a run of 6 months as opener and if he fails(not just score soft runs) move on to likes of Shaw/Gill . 
 

On Iyer , again deserves a run though I think he is below the high standards of our middle order bats in the past , two things in his favour is his game against spin and his self belief . 
 

KLs all round game + Iyers confidence & batting against spin  , is probably the batsmen we are looking for ? 

[Sandeep99]

NOTA

 

get in gill please 

[Straight Drive]

9 hours ago, putrevus said:

Iyer should be given fair chance to prove himself , it would be very wrong to discard him after one failure.Rahul on other hand is suitable only for as opener, if and when that role becomes open , he should be considered along with Gill.

What does he needs to prove. Isnt an average of 42 combined with sr of 103 enough proof so far? What is the average and sr that you expect from Iyer or any other batsman who is in nascent stage of ODI career. Would you please specifiy the performance cirteria in numbers?

 

So far voting is as follows:

Iyer - 38

Rahul - 2

Others - 3

Edited January 15, 2020 by Straight Drive

[Frustrated]

KL has not made any impact in ODIs yet.  His SR of 82 (after playing so many odis) is at par with that of a tail ender. He should be in the odi team only if he keeps wickets.  Yes, he is an obvious choice in t20 where he has had lot of impact.  

[Straight Drive]

3 minutes ago, Frustrated said:

KL has not made any impact in ODIs yet.  His SR of 82 (after playing so many odis) is at par with that of a tail ender. He should be in the odi team only if he keeps wickets.  Yes, he is an obvious choice in t20 where he has had lot of impact.  

In T20i Rahul is world class, in ODI his strike rate reminds me of the matches i watched in 70's.

[express bowling]

13 hours ago, Straight Drive said:

In T20i Rahul is world class, in ODI his strike rate reminds me of the matches i watched in 70's.

 

Exactly  !

 

Rahul's SR has been a serious concern in ODIs.

Edited January 15, 2020 by express bowling

[Vk1]

1 hour ago, Frustrated said:

KL has not made any impact in ODIs yet.  His SR of 82 (after playing so many odis) is at par with that of a tail ender. He should be in the odi team only if he keeps wickets.  Yes, he is an obvious choice in t20 where he has had lot of impact.  

He has never been given a consistent run and at a constant position

[tweaker]

Now we have a new no 4 in Kohli..

How many batsmen have batted at no 4 during Kohli captainship

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 hour ago, express bowling said:

 

Exactly  !

 

Rahul SR has been a serious concern in ODIs.

thats what happen when u keep someone on edge and keeps changing position

A player will play for numbers if he knws he is 1-2 innings away from being dropped. His ability to play fast shudnt be even a question looking at his s/r in t20. IF it was rahane or rayudu u knw they lack ability only. With a sword on head a player gets confused coz if he plays fast n gets out he knws he ll be dropped so he goes for numbers. Constant change in position also doesnt help anyone. Pant is another example a guy who bat at 162 s/r in IPL  has a s/r of 121 in international t20.  

 

This KL vs Dhawan will cost the team- Now both will play for themselves. Kohli will have to take hard call no matter who it is and give him security of 15-20 games. most importantly a role needs to be defined that he needs to play in certain way....dhawan having played for years knws his role not rahul. Rahul needs a security of 15-20 games n a defined role of what is expected of him and if he fails drop him.  A player who can play at 145 s/r in t20 can easily bat at a good s.r in ODI its just about mindset. When sehwg was made to open he was given a security n role to bash the ball. When rohit was made to open he was given the security n role that he has to take his time n then play his game. 

 

Kohli has to understand he cant keep everyone happy, dhoni took a hard call in his days as captain n so has to kohli without worrying about backlash be it anyone.  Also then back his call , he cant switch to plan B in 2-3 games

 

Bringing someone new wont help either if u can handle current players properly....no matter whom u bring gill, shaw or anyone if thats how ull handle any player same wud be the result

Edited January 15, 2020 by Ankit_sharma03

[Ankit_sharma03]

11 hours ago, Cricwala said:

In 6 ODIs we have played since WC 2019, we have played the following No. 4s - Iyer (3), Pant (2), Kohli (1)...ahh, it feels like 2018 never ended or maybe this is what the great masters mean when they say time is circular.

Aise krte krte 3-4 saal nikal jayenge

Wc se pehle rahane 4 pe khelega

Select mayank hoga 4 ke liye

Iyer adhe match khelega 4 pe

Semi final me. Dube aayega 4

 

Circle of life

[Hakuna Matata]

44 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

thats what happen when u keep someone on edge and keeps changing position

A player will play for numbers if he knws he is 1-2 innings away from being dropped. His ability to play fast shudnt be even a question looking at his s/r in t20. IF it was rahane or rayudu u knw they lack ability only. With a sword on head a player gets confused coz if he plays fast n gets out he knws he ll be dropped so he goes for numbers. Constant change in position also doesnt help anyone. Pant is another example a guy who bat at 162 s/r in IPL  has a s/r of 121 in international t20.  

 

This KL vs Dhawan will cost the team- Now both will play for themselves. Kohli will have to take hard call no matter who it is and give him security of 15-20 games. most importantly a role needs to be defined that he needs to play in certain way....dhawan having played for years knws his role not rahul. Rahul needs a security of 15-20 games n a defined role of what is expected of him and if he fails drop him.  A player who can play at 145 s/r in t20 can easily bat at a good s.r in ODI its just about mindset. When sehwg was made to open he was given a security n role to bash the ball. When rohit was made to open he was given the security n role that he has to take his time n then play his game. 

 

Kohli has to understand he cant keep everyone happy, dhoni took a hard call in his days as captain n so has to kohli without worrying about backlash be it anyone.  Also then back his call , he cant switch to plan B in 2-3 games

 

Bringing someone new wont help either if u can handle current players properly....no matter whom u bring gill, shaw or anyone if thats how ull handle any player same wud be the result

Comparing odi SR  with t20i SR is wrong. In t20 Rahul scores most of his runs in pp mostly in boundaries. But in odi you should know how to rotate strike well not just hitting boundaries. Look at dk , his strike rate is 146 @34  in t20 , but the same guy strikes at 74 @31 in odi. But , yes Rahul should be given a role and back him up for some time. Sad thing is from past 4 yrs we didn't groom a single odi batsman. Even fans are too impatient asking a player to be dropped after few failures.

[Ankit_sharma03]

3 minutes ago, Hakuna Matata said:

Comparing odi SR  with t20i SR is wrong. In t20 Rahul scores most of his runs in pp mostly in boundaries. But in odi you should know how to rotate strike well not just hitting boundaries. Look at dk , his strike rate is 146 @34  in t20 , but the same guy strikes at 74 @31 in odi.

ability of a player remains same be it t20 or ODi, aisa to hai nhin ki rahul rahane ban jaata hai raat raat men .

• Put urself in his shoes n ask urself wud u play an attacking or high risk game if u knw ull be dropped after 2-3 failures??
• Ask urself how wud u plan ur innings n work on it if u dont knw what ur batting position is ?

 

Strike rotation gets better with time as seen with both dhawan n rohit also 

 

DK also was always in n out of team but more so it was his fault, but he also knew the minute dhoni is back he ll be dropped 

3 minutes ago, Hakuna Matata said:

But , yes Rahul should be given a role and back him up for some time. Sad thing is from past 4 yrs we didn't groom a single odi batsman. Even fans are too impatient asking a player to be dropped after few failures.

its just not about Rahul

Look at pant s/r in international n IPL....huge diff

Look at khaleel bowling- he is a hit the deck bowler who starts to bowl like  swing bowler in international 

 

Clearly their is an issue that these youngsters are not playing their natural game

 

See whoever u select back him n define his role, this is the same problem with RCB as well no one knws their role apart from AB n Kohli. 

U wanna bring new guys like gill n all i say bring them but if u keep changing their position n keep them on edge end result wud be same. 

[R!TTER]

2 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

keep them on edge end result wud be same. 

Well that's true for every profession out there. Would've ben fun to see Kohli given that treatment early on, too bad the guy loves to dish it out but can't take it himself!

[Ankit_sharma03]

3 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

Well that's true for every profession out there. Would've ben fun to see Kohli given that treatment early on, too bad the guy loves to dish it out but can't take it himself!

this is the reason guys cricketers still talk about ganguly's or dhoni's captaincy coz of the backing they gave 

 u cannot succeed in any job if u live under the fear of one error will cost u ur job . Error are made by humans n errors will happen.

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

 

Zak- iyer one weak zone is exposed now and bowler will target it

 

is he talking about same as us ?

 

 

[Lannister]

Actually Rahul was doing good at #4 in the lead up to the WC as he was mentally preparing for that role and then he was suddenly asked to open following Dhawan's injury. It takes different mindset to bat at those two positions. Mind you, he still averaged 45+ in the WC.

 

He was batting at #4 for RCB, then made to open for India in T20s and then sent back to #4 and then back to #1 again and now he is asked to play at #3. I don't know how he is tolerating this BS.

 

Only in Indian cricket we see such things and the reason for the mediocrity.

[putrevus]

Only in Indian cricket ,a cricketer like Rahul is given so many chances.Only in Indian cricket where this so called talent with List A SR under 80 is playing for the team, when far better players are being overlooked.Only  in Indian cricket out of blue due to IPL performances a guy like Rahul can become part of world cup squad based on T20 performances.

[Frustrated]

Seriously,. Few ICFers need to visit other cricket forums occasionally.   KL and Pant are not even rated among good indian batsmen.  Only in ICF we see such fan base and hype for these overrated batsmen . Sad part is. IPL performance is considered by few fellow forumers to rate their talent.    Citing examples like. Oh!!  Yuvi and Raina were also inconsistent in early part of their career makes no sense. Yuvi and Raina had single handedly won us many crucial matches in his first 15 ODIs against tough opponents. Once they were set, they could accelerate at will.  Something which KL has not achieved so far in odi.  Regarding pant, the less said the better.

[R!TTER]

1 hour ago, Frustrated said:

Yuvi and Raina had single handedly won us many crucial matches in his first 15 ODIs against tough opponents.

Yuvraj & Raina are not comparable, Yuvraj at his peak was 2x the player Raina ever was. As for the other forums, which one do you suggest we visit & why does their opinion hold more weight than others here? It is also unquestionably true that insecure players will never perform to their optimum level, if you need proof you can see the test side as well. No batsman has thrived under Brat 

[Vk1]

There were some question marks over Iyer's ability to finish the innings against quality fast bowlers, that has to become clear. Anyways Rahul is more versatile and should be told that he will be given at least 25 games to prove himself at that position.  Also, SKY should be given a chance asap.

Edited January 15, 2020 by Vk1