Should Siraj play over Umesh in D/N test?

[Lone Wolf]

Saini Umesh Siraj..  These are our choices for 3rd pacer.  Who will be better operator of New ball among these three?  Shami used to be first change when Ishant & Bumrah shared the new ball.  Siraj can move the ball initially.  Saini has pace but not extra movement.  Umesh is terrible outside.  So who will be 3rd pacer? 

Edited November 24, 2020 by Lone Wolf

[Serpico]

I think Siraj is set for the debut. Kohli seem to back him, he gave a statement yesterday saying siraj should make his dad proud. 

 

I get a feeling that umesh lost kohli's trust. This year at rcb, umesh got only 2 matches where as saini and siraj got most matches

 

All three of them will be competing for the thrid paser spot in the practice matches

[sandeep]

Umesh has been waiting for his chance for a while and there was an argument 15 months ago that he might deserve it.  

 

But I do not trust him in Aus conditions.  And there's no way to know his current form/fitness.  

 

So at that point, it comes down to which bowler is in good rhythm and fitness on the day - that's a captain's call. I hope the right one gets taken.

[Lone Wolf]

11 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Umesh has been waiting for his chance for a while and there was an argument 15 months ago that he might deserve it.  

 

But I do not trust him in Aus conditions.  And there's no way to know his current form/fitness.  

 

So at that point, it comes down to which bowler is in good rhythm and fitness on the day - that's a captain's call. I hope the right one gets taken.

Umesh failed Badly in 2nd test vs NZ.  He has been awful outside India since always. 

[Ankit_sharma03]

Absolutely , if not pink ball i wud have pref saini but siraj is better with movement so Siraj 

Edited November 24, 2020 by Ankit_sharma03

[Khota]

All pace bowlers should play. They all should be rotated to extend their playing years.

[sandeep]

53 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Absolutely , if not pink ball i wud have pref saini but siraj is better with movement so Siraj 

On what basis is this theory - "Siraj is better with movement"?  

 

Siraj has a better FC record because he targetted the stumps a lot more and racked up a lot of wickets beating Ranji batsmen with pace.  

 

Honestly, neither of them have shown much of anything to indicate that one's "style" of bowling is better suited to Aus conditions than the other.  

 

Neither can come close to replacing Ishant's experience and sheer quality.  Siraj seems the more riskier option but who knows.

[maniac]

Siraj should get a go ahead 

[Serpico]

14 minutes ago, sandeep said:

On what basis is this theory - "Siraj is better with movement"?  

he did take more wickets than saini in India A tour of England in 2018 (15 wkts vs 6)

[Lone Wolf]

It'll be now handy if both Siraj & Saini play the ODI series as well.  Only one of them will get to play the first tour game.  So Saini will likely play in T20Is along with Chahar & Nattu.  Siraj should play both tour games & do well to impress TM. 

Edited November 24, 2020 by Lone Wolf

[sandeep]

20 minutes ago, Serpico said:

he did take more wickets than saini in India A tour of England in 2018 (15 wkts vs 6)

How does that translate to more "movement" specifically?  Its sheer conjecture.

[Serpico]

2 minutes ago, sandeep said:

How does that translate to more "movement" specifically?  Its sheer conjecture.

generally swing bowlers tend to do better in england. sam curran took a 5ffer in the same match siraj took 8 wickets

[coffee_rules]

Never seen any D/N matches. Pink ball , does it swing more because of night conditions? If so, Siraj should be selected. Probably the only Umesh fan here, I’d prefer him over others, he has pace . I am surprised to say, Ishant will be missed, esp his lower order batting in tests. 

[BacktoCricaddict]

29 minutes ago, sandeep said:

How does that translate to more "movement" specifically?  Its sheer conjecture.

That's why they do net practice, no?  At least one would hope so.

[rkt.india]

2 hours ago, sandeep said:

On what basis is this theory - "Siraj is better with movement"?  

 

Siraj has a better FC record because he targetted the stumps a lot more and racked up a lot of wickets beating Ranji batsmen with pace.  

 

Honestly, neither of them have shown much of anything to indicate that one's "style" of bowling is better suited to Aus conditions than the other.  

 

Neither can come close to replacing Ishant's experience and sheer quality.  Siraj seems the more riskier option but who knows.

You have not seen his bowling with India A? 

[rkt.india]

1 hour ago, coffee_rules said:

Never seen any D/N matches. Pink ball , does it swing more because of night conditions? If so, Siraj should be selected. Probably the only Umesh fan here, I’d prefer him over others, he has pace . I am surprised to say, Ishant will be missed, esp his lower order batting in tests. 

Umesh has lost pace. Was bowling very slow this IPL. 

Edited November 24, 2020 by rkt.india

[coffee_rules]

Siraj is the great swing hope for India, bowling banana swingers like great Wasim Akram.  Hype koi humse seekhe. When selected and if he fails, others will bump this thread for sure

[Ankit_sharma03]

2 hours ago, sandeep said:

On what basis is this theory - "Siraj is better with movement"?  

 

Siraj has a better FC record because he targetted the stumps a lot more and racked up a lot of wickets beating Ranji batsmen with pace.  

 

Becoz i have seen him bowl in domestic a lot, he pitches further up and allows to move the ball whereas saini bowls more short of length . 

Siraj is also very good with reverse swing , siraj only doesnt have FC record he destroyed A teams of England,WI, SA n Aus when he took 40 wkts in 5 A games which is when he shud have played for India....they all were in diff condition not just india 

 

Quote

 

Honestly, neither of them have shown much of anything to indicate that one's "style" of bowling is better suited to Aus conditions than the other.  

 

Neither can come close to replacing Ishant's experience and sheer quality.  Siraj seems the more riskier option but who knows.

 

ishant isnt even in question as of now

Im talking about pink ball test  which will be Siraj vs saini vs Umesh

Siraj with pink ball and Saini for rest thats my choice , Saini wud be the key for Smith coz he is the one who consistently bowls that length that smith doesnt enjoy and has pace

 

If ishant was avl i wud have picked him coz he is dangerous when there is movement avl

Edited November 24, 2020 by Ankit_sharma03

[sandeep]

22 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

You have not seen his bowling with India A? 

I have, I even watched the Windies board live stream of the A tour 4 day games there.  Siraj is a very good bowler, but 'movement' isn't exactly his calling card.  For example in that windies A game, there was another bowler Sandeep Warrier who was bowling beautiful outswingers, while Siraj was not getting close to that kind of movement.  

[rkt.india]

1 minute ago, sandeep said:

I have, I even watched the Windies board live stream of the A tour 4 day games there.  Siraj is a very good bowler, but 'movement' isn't exactly his calling card.  For example in that windies A game, there was another bowler Sandeep Warrier who was bowling beautiful outswingers, while Siraj was not getting close to that kind of movement.  

You don't need Huge movement to get wickets. You just need to get the nicks because he bowls wicket taking length. Warrier swings the ball too in fact more than Siraj but his bowling is floaty when he goes fuller. Siraj also moves the ball both ways. Siraj is sharper at the fuller length and hits the deck better to extract seam movement with red ball which has been evident in his outings with India A. He keeps threatening both sides of the edges. Though team has to go with what they are doing in the nets. Both Saini and Siraj are gambles as they haven't played in Aus before AFAIK but if they give green track at Adelaide, it will be better to go with Siraj.