How India turned copper importer from exporter in 3 yrs & Pakistan stepped in to fill the gap

[ravishingravi]

New Delhi: India, a major exporter of refined copper till a few years ago, is set to become a net importer for the third consecutive year as a plant in Tamil Nadu’s Thoothukudi continues to remain shut due to environmental concerns.

The sharp fall in India’s exports has proven to be advantageous for neighbouring Pakistan, which has stepped in to partially bridge the gap, especially to countries like China, according to trade data and exporters.

 

India turning a net importer has been both on account of a sharp increase in imports and a contraction in exports. This is mainly due to shutting of a plant of Vedanta’s subsidiary Sterlite Copper, which had a production capacity of 4 lakh tonnes.

 

Sterlite Copper’s copper smelter plant in Thoothukudi was shut down in May 2018 by the Tamil Nadu government after the state’s pollution control board made a recommendation to this effect. This followed violent protests by residents after environmental concerns that the plant posed a health hazard to those living in the area.

 

“Domestic copper industry is operating at almost half of its capacity since the last two financial years due to closure of Vedanta Ltd’s 400 thousand tonnes copper smelter at Tuticorin,” said Care Ratings in an 18 February report. It added that India will continue to be a net importer of copper in FY21, pending the resumption of Vedanta’s copper smelting facility.

 

https://theprint.in/economy/how-india-turned-copper-importer-from-exporter-in-3-yrs-pakistan-stepped-in-to-fill-the-gap/612544/
 

 

[coffee_rules]

This was a well organized Breaking India project with different groups involved, communists and churches and NGOs. 

[Yoda-esque]

Reminds me of another state that I cannot name ..the lemurians will get upset.

[sandeep]

2 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

This was a well organized Breaking India project with different groups involved, communists and churches and NGOs. 

I am not informed on the details of this copper plant, pollution etc - what's the deal here?  Would love some quality long reads if you have links?

 

[zen]

30 minutes ago, sandeep said:

I am not informed on the details of this copper plant, pollution etc - what's the deal here?  Would love some quality long reads if you have links?

 

Copper smelting can create pollution that can impact a community in multiple ways including being exposed to arsenic, lead, etc.  Basically, turning the area into hell. 
 

If the plant failed to comply, it should be shut down. For a change, good to see environment kept above the greed to make more $$$ at any cost. 
 

Nothing is more important than protecting the communities, and the securing the environment for us and the future generations. 

PS the token card of “Pak” benefitting appears to have been thrown in as well. Those who want such plants to continue esp. without proper safeguards should first attempt to swap places with those living there
 

 

Edited March 7, 2021 by zen

[Real McCoy]

This is a case where both the left and right engaged the locals in divide and conquer. For many who worked in that factory, it was a great thing. For many who lived there, it was a toxic environment. As usual the leftist group such as ngos, some evangelist churches and naxals lit the fire and added fuel to it. The right OTOH bypassed environmental regulations when the TN pollution control board told the company to shut down after a gas leak that hospitalized some people back in the 90s. There's room for exploration but in India where the wild west scenario is the norm, such warnings were taken lightly. Even in 2013, JJ asked the company to shut down after another gas leak. So they were still operating without any environmental safeguards. The case turned ugly when about 10 people were shot down by the police. Don't know who to blame but it looks like both parties are involved and the poor public were the pawns.

To those who say lemurians this or that, I say take this company and put it on Maharashtra, Gujarat, UP, Bihar and other hindi speaking states and give them the much needed employment. This will also alleviate the northern states which are looking for employment. Since Amitabh Bhachchan said breathe in a bit of Gujarat, maybe another plant can be constructed over there and see if this scenario is any different over there. Will Amitabh repeat the ad after that plant is operational

And cue in Pakistan's export in that article to make this sound extra worse. In the other thread, I opined that bipolar politics is not good. its now backed by bipolar news that doesnt even conceal its bias like BBC and CNN do.

[G_B_]

10 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

This is a case where both the left and right engaged the locals in divide and conquer. For many who worked in that factory, it was a great thing. For many who lived there, it was a toxic environment. As usual the leftist group such as ngos, some evangelist churches and naxals lit the fire and added fuel to it. The right OTOH bypassed environmental regulations when the TN pollution control board told the company to shut down after a gas leak that hospitalized some people back in the 90s. There's room for exploration but in India where the wild west scenario is the norm, such warnings were taken lightly. Even in 2013, JJ asked the company to shut down after another gas leak. So they were still operating without any environmental safeguards. The case turned ugly when about 10 people were shot down by the police. Don't know who to blame but it looks like both parties are involved and the poor public were the pawns.

To those who say lemurians this or that, I say take this company and put it on Maharashtra, Gujarat, UP, Bihar and other hindi speaking states and give them the much needed employment. This will also alleviate the northern states which are looking for employment. Since Amitabh Bhachchan said breathe in a bit of Gujarat, maybe another plant can be constructed over there and see if this scenario is any different over there. Will Amitabh repeat the ad after that plant is operational

And cue in Pakistan's export in that article to make this sound extra worse. In the other thread, I opined that bipolar politics is not good. its now backed by bipolar news that doesnt even conceal its bias like BBC and CNN do.

 

 

You have to admit though closing down had impact upsteam in TN itself in the kongu belt with many electronic parts suppliers.

 

Also copper mining will take place where the mines are right? 

 

Its actually in the interest of the TN government to pump in money to make the copper plant environmentally friendly.

 

 

[Real McCoy]

15 minutes ago, G_B_ said:

 

 

You have to admit though closing down had impact upsteam in TN itself in the kongu belt with many electronic parts suppliers.

 

Also copper mining will take place where the mines are right? 

 

Its actually in the interest of the TN government to pump in money to make the copper plant environmentally friendly.

 

 

Agree. TN govt should place the proper regulations based on the complaints received by the locals and the company should follow it to the tee. Some of the complaints from the locals can be unreasonable like leftists who don't want the plant to open at all. Arundhati Roy and her faux concern for tribal people while she lives in a bungalow for example is the typical leftist scumbag. Also the company must operate within regulations and not be too lax when it comes to affecting the environment. Its a bit like desi people who throw garbage in front of other people's lawns but get irritated when it happens to them. The CEOs and higher ups don't live within the region to get affected by the poor environment but will subject the locals and the workers to the same. We need both to come towards the center and cooperate not exploit each other

[coffee_rules]

1 hour ago, zen said:

Copper smelting can create pollution that can impact a community in multiple ways including being exposed to arsenic, lead, etc.  Basically, turning the area into hell. 
 

If the plant failed to comply, it should be shut down. For a change, good to see environment kept above the greed to make more $$$ at any cost. 
 

Nothing is more important than protecting the communities, and the securing the environment for us and the future generations. 

PS the token card of “Pak” benefitting appears to have been thrown in as well. Those who want such plants to continue esp. without proper safeguards should first attempt to swap places with those living there
 

 

The environmental impact is well established, so is the regulation from both center and state to address the pollution. There is growth and development policy to follow for manufacturing industries investment, that should be encouraged for employment and GDP as well. There should be regulation as well to control environmental and pollution aspects.  This was one of the reasons why US and developed countries moved out of manufacturing, but can India afford? 

 

Such friction is a hot bed for activists and NGOs to get involved and create anarchy. There were many sources that showed how the protests led sudden surge of people and got involved in riots, public property damage and life threatening to police. Similar to Red Fort riot, but TN police didn’t hesitate to open fire.

 

This is a balanced report on the two court decisions, one by SC under UPA in 3013 that made the factory function, while apex court in 2018 reversed the order. 
 

https://swarajyamag.com/business/thoothukudi-sterlite-copper-plant-what-made-madras-high-court-to-rule-against-its-opening

 

 

[Real McCoy]

5 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

The environmental impact is well established, so is the regulation from both center and state to address the pollution. There is growth and development policy to follow for manufacturing industries investment, that should be encouraged for employment and GDP as well. There should be regulation as well to control environmental and pollution aspects.  This was one of the reasons why US and developed countries moved out of manufacturing, but can India afford? 

 

Such friction is a hot bed for activists and NGOs to get involved and create anarchy. There were many sources that showed how the protests led sudden surge of people and got involved in riots, public property damage and life threatening to police. Similar to Red Fort riot, but TN police didn’t hesitate to open fire.

 

This is a balanced report on the two court decisions, one by SC under UPA in 3013 that made the factory function, while apex court in 2018 reversed the order. 
 

https://swarajyamag.com/business/thoothukudi-sterlite-copper-plant-what-made-madras-high-court-to-rule-against-its-opening

 

 

Is that a balanced report Anything that favors a certain viewpoint cannot be balanced no matter how hard they try.

Back to the topic, India cannot afford to move out of manufacturing. But we can find a way to extract copper and save locals from health hazards as well. The left wants to use this hazard excuse to stop all activity. The right wants to do its thing without any concern for the public health and minimize costs as much as possible. Indian govt and TN govt must weigh in on the cost of importing from China and the cost increase if a solution is reached and make a decision.

[zen]

27 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

The environmental impact is well established, so is the regulation from both center and state to address the pollution. There is growth and development policy to follow for manufacturing industries investment, that should be encouraged for employment and GDP as well. There should be regulation as well to control environmental and pollution aspects.  This was one of the reasons why US and developed countries moved out of manufacturing, but can India afford? 

 

 

Ind (or any country) can afford to lose $$$ if environment (which is priceless) and communities are being impacted negatively ... Would we prefer if 100 years ago people turned the planet into a mess for $$$  (citing the need for $$$, development, and so on) with us (or future generations) having to rebuild? It is always good to keep environment first, which stays. While people come and go (100 years ago, 100 years later) 

 

 

 

Quote

 

Such friction is a hot bed for activists and NGOs to get involved and create anarchy. There were many sources that showed how the protests led sudden surge of people and got involved in riots, public property damage and life threatening to police. Similar to Red Fort riot, but TN police didn’t hesitate to open fire.

 

 

 

I am focused on the long term strategy and big picture ... Where people are involved, there can be politics (from all sides)

 

 

 

Quote

 

This is a balanced report on the two court decisions, one by SC under UPA in 3013 that made the factory function, while apex court in 2018 reversed the order. 
 

https://swarajyamag.com/business/thoothukudi-sterlite-copper-plant-what-made-madras-high-court-to-rule-against-its-opening

 

 

 

 

The best way forward is to modernize the plant for it to continue ... The plant, along w/ some others listed below, has been acknowledged as being among the noted examples such problems:

 

La Oroya, Peru
Elbassan, Albania
Tuticorin, Tamil Nadu, India
Rudnaya Valley, Russia
Zlanta, Romania

 

 

 

Edited March 7, 2021 by zen

[coffee_rules]

2 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

Is that a balanced report Anything that favors a certain viewpoint cannot be balanced no matter how hard they try.

Back to the topic, India cannot afford to move out of manufacturing. But we can find a way to extract copper and save locals from health hazards as well. The left wants to use this hazard excuse to stop all activity. The right wants to do its thing without any concern for the public health and minimize costs as much as possible. Indian govt and TN govt must weigh in on the cost of importing from China and the cost increase if a solution is reached and make a decision.

Did you read the report or just commenting looking at the source? The rest is what even I am saying

[Real McCoy]

11 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

Did you read the report or just commenting looking at the source? The rest is what even I am saying

I thought it was behind a paywall. Just read it. Was a balanced article but I was shortsighted by its pro bjp articles. Such a shame that this company is called Vedanta while acting unVedanta like.

[G_B_]

Vendanta is listed in the uk on the stock exchange. 

 

So they are not a small company.  Imo they should have seen this coming. A lot of this could have been avoided.

 

One thing i will say in general, i could be wrong in my perception but these leftists have hijacked many projects. In Tn itself for eg it was a huge battle to get the salem chennai expressway.  Bangalore Chennai expressway same thing. After 3 years of delay finally cg got the nod from sc.

 

If every big ticket project goes to sc, nothing will be done.

 

 

[kepler37b]

3 hours ago, zen said:

 

Ind (or any country) can afford to lose $$$ if environment (which is priceless) and communities are being impacted negatively ... Would we prefer if 100 years ago people turned the planet into a mess for $$$  (citing the need for $$$, development, and so on) with us (or future generations) having to rebuild? It is always good to keep environment first, which stays. While people come and go (100 years ago, 100 years later) 

 

 

 

 

++++++

 

Long term priorities over short term benefits. Anyday.

[diga]

10 hours ago, sandeep said:

I am not informed on the details of this copper plant, pollution etc - what's the deal here?  Would love some quality long reads if you have links?

 

 

 

This thread can be a start

 

https://www.indiancricketfans.com/topic/106999-sterlite-protests/

[Real McCoy]

13 hours ago, G_B_ said:

Vendanta is listed in the uk on the stock exchange. 

 

So they are not a small company.  Imo they should have seen this coming. A lot of this could have been avoided.

 

One thing i will say in general, i could be wrong in my perception but these leftists have hijacked many projects. In Tn itself for eg it was a huge battle to get the salem chennai expressway.  Bangalore Chennai expressway same thing. After 3 years of delay finally cg got the nod from sc.

 

If every big ticket project goes to sc, nothing will be done.

 

 

Left has tried to hijack a lot of things. Salem-Chennai expressway was very much blocked by leftists. some of the land were used for agriculture, some used for irrigation and a lot of it was unused land. A lot of ordinary people were misinformed by opportunistic parties trying to improve their image and unemployed people were fooled and some even paid to protest. If JJ was there, this would be done without any problems. EPS has done well but is not perceived as a tough leader like JJ was. The sterlite protests were a fault of both sides.

[Khota]

These things are not so staright forward. Folks living nest to it will be concerned about environment and rightly so. Net import is not a positive thing either. No good answers here.

[coffee_rules]

How can they let the Parochial Church personnel organize such agitations against development? Only in India. Sterlite redux. 
 

 

[ravishingravi]

TN is land of lost opportunities. The state could potentially have been financial and tech capital. But too many mediocre folks left in the state whose only goal in life is activism.