Wait, what is wrong with Ashwin's record in England ??? Its pretty decent

[Ankit_sharma03]

 

Avg - 28.11 which is pretty decent...ill say good. (among them also 2 test he played with injury on last tour)

We celebrate bhajji who avg 28 in India out of all places

 

• Lyon avg 31 in england
• Bhajji avg almost 50 in england
• Kumble 41
• Yasir shah 38
• Vettori 29.88 

 

His avg is better then all 

 

Now coming to our own bowlers

 

• He beats Shami in S/r, Avg, Eco - All depts 
• He beats everyone in Economy so he has been our most economical bowler in england
• Now comparing him to our best bowler bumrah
  Bumrah avg 26.28 and Ashwin 28.11 (not that far )
  Bumrah s/r 59.5 and Ashwin 66.7 (again not a major difference)
  Ashwin beats him in Economy
   

 

We have given Shami 3 tours (yet his record in england is bad)

Pujara is on his 3rd tour to england and still avg 30 in england (and if you take Aus out of his Overseas record its 27)

Rahane on his 3rd tour , consistently inconsistent on every tour

dhawan also got 2 tours to england , the who after 2 tours still cudnt manage a 50 in england 

Rohit another overseas dud got chances after chances overseas and tried to fit in diff position like 3 and now open

 

Now away conditions are tough but you give players time to learn n adapt which is what is given to other but only if ashwin was backed this much overseas as its very hard spinners also specially indians coz they are so used to SG unlikes lets say someone like Lyon who has bowled with kookabura his whole life. 

 

Never understood the reason that he hasnt been backed as others , if you see his overall record only 2 countries doesnt have good record in 2 places Aus n SA (not the place for finger spinner) among them also he did well in Aus last time and if not for our shoddy catching in last SA tour he wud have had a few more wkts.

 

 

Edited September 1, 2021 by Ankit_sharma03

[Ankit_sharma03]

@Gollum- did u check that his record wasnt bad at all in england as made out to be

[Ankit_sharma03]

13 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

We have given Shami 3 tours (yet his record in england is bad)

Pujara is on his 3rd tour to england and still avg 30 in england (and if you take Aus out of his Overseas record its 27)

Rahane on his 3rd tour , consistently inconsistent on every tour

dhawan also got 2 tours to england , the who after 2 tours still cudnt manage a 50 in england 

Rohit another overseas dud got chances after chances overseas and tried to fit in diff position like 3 and now open

 

To add to this he went to county and performed well, whereas pujara, rahane and vihari all failed in county. Even during teams off he was one guy who went and played a county game . 

If others have been given chances to improve so does he deserve .

 

He may fail but then at least u take a punt on a champion player , its not that this team is doing so well that its tough to get in XI . 

[Gollum]

57 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

@Gollum- did u check that his record wasnt bad at all in england as made out to be

Different standards for different players. Also he has that perception problem due to Southampton test where he was played despite injury, TM's fault. 

Ravi Ashwin aggravated his injury in Southampton, admits Virat Kohli

In fact he was injured in TB itself as Shastri said in PC.

 

Hope there is a redemption story this time. He set up the match in Edgbaston 2018 but batsmen couldn't finish the job, hope we fire as a unit in the next test.

 

Don't expect logical replies here, ICFers are high on phaast bowling hype, first time India has so many quality quicks and what happens when you give a child flashy new toys for the first time? Everybody is on the plaaay 4 phaaast bowlers bandwagon (never mind if that means 4 #11s in an already minnow batting lineup), and seem to think we lost the WTC F cos of 2 spinners 

Edited September 1, 2021 by Gollum

[Ankit_sharma03]

1 minute ago, Gollum said:

Ravi Ashwin aggravated his injury in Southampton, admits Virat Kohli

In fact he was injured in TB itself as Shastri said in PC.

 

yup he played 3rd n 4th test with injury last time

 

3 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Hope there is a redemption story this time. He set up the match in Edgbagston 2018 but batsmen couldn't finish the job, hope we fire as a unit in the next test.

 

while digging his record in england saw he avg 17 in edgebaston even jimmy wud brag about that 

Avg 24 in Oval which is where we play our next test 

 

[Trichromatic]

Ashwin would walk into side in the world except Indian team picked by ICF. 

[Trichromatic]

Player	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	Econ	Ave	SR		Opposition	Ground	Start Date
JJ Bumrah	39.4	6	110	9	2.77	12.22	26.4		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Siraj	40.5	10	126	8	3.08	15.75	30.6		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
I Sharma	34.0	7	82	5	2.41	16.40	40.8		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
R Ashwin	25.0	10	45	4	1.80	11.25	37.5		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
SN Thakur	26.0	4	78	4	3.00	19.50	39.0		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Shami	28.0	8	95	4	3.39	23.75	42.0		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Shami	32.5	3	100	4	3.04	25.00	49.2		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Shami	36.5	11	107	4	2.90	26.75	55.2		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
I Sharma	31.2	11	69	3	2.20	23.00	62.6		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Shami	36.0	8	108	3	3.00	36.00	72.0		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
JJ Bumrah	41.0	9	112	3	2.73	37.33	82.0		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Siraj	37.0	5	132	3	3.56	44.00	74.0		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
JJ Bumrah	27.2	10	59	2	2.15	29.50	82.0		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Siraj	23.0	3	86	2	3.73	43.00	69.0		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
RA Jadeja	32.0	8	88	2	2.75	44.00	96.0		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
RA Jadeja	15.2	3	45	1	2.93	45.00	92.0		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
RA Jadeja	28.0	4	48	0	1.71	-	-		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
RA Jadeja	16.0	3	50	0	3.12	-	-		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
JJ Bumrah	36.4	11	92	0	2.50	-	-		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
I Sharma	22.0	0	92	0	4.18	-	-		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif

 

 

 

4 test so far and only 2 performances which have been better than Ashwin's WTC performance against stronger batting unit.

 

Any player wouldn't have lost his place from side after bowling 4-45 in the match.

 

[Trichromatic]

Last time Ashwin went wicketless in an overseas test was in 2018 at Lords against England.

 

Both Ishant and Bumrah have went wicketless in 1 test each.

 

Ashwin comfortably outbowled Bumrah and Shami in - WTC final and Adelaide test v Aus. All sucked in Sydney test.

[Majestic]

Stokes has taken a mental health break. Hence, out Kaptaan is doing a favour to England by dropping Ashwin so that when England could say they missed Stokes, India would say, they missed Ashwin.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Majestic

[Gollum]

44 minutes ago, MultiB48 said:

16 of his 18 wkts are left-handers.

Half of them must be Cook and Stokes. 

[adi B]

He can be our Trump card in the last 2 tests  but needs all the confidence from the captain. 

He doesn't need a jadeja from the other end tbh 

[Serpico]

1 hour ago, MultiB48 said:

16 of his 18 wkts are left-handers.

England have 4 lefties in their top 8. Getting burns and malan early will be big help

[rkt.india]

You included NZ match too. They were not home team. This is against England, 14 wickets in 6 tests at 32. This is okay but just not match winning. Only fast bowlers will win you tests in England.

 

Edited September 1, 2021 by rkt.india

[rkt.india]

2 hours ago, Trichromatic said:

Player	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	Econ	Ave	SR		Opposition	Ground	Start Date
JJ Bumrah	39.4	6	110	9	2.77	12.22	26.4		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Siraj	40.5	10	126	8	3.08	15.75	30.6		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
I Sharma	34.0	7	82	5	2.41	16.40	40.8		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
R Ashwin	25.0	10	45	4	1.80	11.25	37.5		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
SN Thakur	26.0	4	78	4	3.00	19.50	39.0		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Shami	28.0	8	95	4	3.39	23.75	42.0		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Shami	32.5	3	100	4	3.04	25.00	49.2		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Shami	36.5	11	107	4	2.90	26.75	55.2		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
I Sharma	31.2	11	69	3	2.20	23.00	62.6		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Shami	36.0	8	108	3	3.00	36.00	72.0		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
JJ Bumrah	41.0	9	112	3	2.73	37.33	82.0		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Siraj	37.0	5	132	3	3.56	44.00	74.0		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
JJ Bumrah	27.2	10	59	2	2.15	29.50	82.0		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
Mohammed Siraj	23.0	3	86	2	3.73	43.00	69.0		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
RA Jadeja	32.0	8	88	2	2.75	44.00	96.0		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
RA Jadeja	15.2	3	45	1	2.93	45.00	92.0		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
RA Jadeja	28.0	4	48	0	1.71	-	-		v England	Lord's	12 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
RA Jadeja	16.0	3	50	0	3.12	-	-		v England	Nottingham	4 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
JJ Bumrah	36.4	11	92	0	2.50	-	-		v New Zealand	Southampton	18 Jun 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif
I Sharma	22.0	0	92	0	4.18	-	-		v England	Leeds	25 Aug 2021	http://i.imgci.com/espncricinfo/guruInvestigate.gif

 

 

 

4 test so far and only 2 performances which have been better than Ashwin's WTC performance against stronger batting unit.

 

Any player wouldn't have lost his place from side after bowling 4-45 in the match.

 

WTC is misleading because NZ wasn't a home team.

Edited September 1, 2021 by rkt.india

[rkt.india]

Even 18 wickets in 7 tests is pretty below average. It means 2.5 wickets. It's not going to win you anything. You need bowlers who can take 5-fers to win tests and in these conditions, spinners aren't those.

[Gollum]

3 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Even 18 wickets in 7 tests is pretty below average. It means 2.5 wickets. It's not going to win you anything. You need bowlers who can take 5-fers to win tests and in these conditions, spinners aren't those.

Out of 7 tests there were 2-3 innings defeats. 

[Trichromatic]

55 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Even 18 wickets in 7 tests is pretty below average. It means 2.5 wickets. It's not going to win you anything. You need bowlers who can take 5-fers to win tests and in these conditions, spinners aren't those.

 

Again go back to performances of pacers. There has been just 2 performance better than Ashwin's WTC performance.

 

Adelaide test and WTC final -- both matches he outbowled Bumrah and Shami.

[Trichromatic]

1 hour ago, rkt.india said:

Even 18 wickets in 7 tests is pretty below average. It means 2.5 wickets. It's not going to win you anything. You need bowlers who can take 5-fers to win tests and in these conditions, spinners aren't those.

 

Shami has 36  wickets in 21 innings at avg of 39 with 0 5-fers.

 

Ashwin has 18 wickets in 11 innings. Give him more innings, he will outbowl both Shami and Ishant.

 

None of Shami/Ishant look like match winners in these conditions.

 

Bumrah did well in 1 match and consistently struggles to pick wickets with new ball.

 

[Trichromatic]

1 hour ago, rkt.india said:

WTC is misleading because NZ wasn't a home team.

 

NZ has best batting line up in world.

[Trichromatic]

56 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Out of 7 tests there were 2-3 innings defeats. 

 

And there is no evidence to support that Indian pacers are better match winners in such conditions.

 

As a member, it is evident that Ashwin is performing better than at least 2 pacers overseas in last few years.