Bumrah vs. Cummins in Tests

[Chakdephatte]

These are are the two greatest pacers of this era and by some long shot. But I hate when people say Bumrah is not in the class of Cummins. Dude has given remarkable performances in SA, Eng, and Australia on his first tours to those countries.

 

Let's see how they fare from here.

Edited January 5, 2022 by Chakdephatte

[Chakdephatte]

Points in favor of Bumrah -

• Better in running through sides. Has the same number of fifers in 26 matches that Cummins has in 37 matches.

• Plays with relatively weaker team for SENA conditions.

• Is harder to hit than Cummins. Is usually economical even when he doesn't get wickets.

• Doesn't get to stat-pad as his home country is not great for fast bowlers.

 

Points in favor of Cummins -

• Doesn't go missing like Bumrah in some matches.

• Better on unhelpful tracks.

• Wins series and not just matches. It will take some magic beat his 29 wickets in Ashes.

[Vijy]

The debate is almost as simple as consistency vs. periods of brilliance. Lara vs SRT is the batting analogy. In bowling, I prefer consistency and in batting, I like players who can produce something special.

[Majestic]

Rabada should be included. He has twice more wickets than Bumrah at same age.

[ShoonyaSifar]

Cummins is slightly ahead in tests as Bumrah, despite bowling some of the best match winning spells for us, has lacked consistency since his injury in 2019.

 

Across formats, Bumrah is a better bowler.

[Vijy]

Just now, Majestic said:

Rabada should be included. He has twice more wickets than Bumrah at same age.

I agree he should be in the mix, but SA is even more pacer-friendly than Oz is. so, he's bound to have good stats when one plays roughly 40-50% of tests at home.

 

with regards to wickets, it's largely a function of rabada playing more tests. it's not as though his wkts per match is much higher than cummins/bumrah.

 

if we are looking at players only since boom's debut, shami should be in the mix as well. I bet his record in past 4 yrs or so is excellent as well.

[Chakdephatte]

7 minutes ago, Vijy said:

The debate is almost as simple as consistency vs. periods of brilliance. Lara vs SRT is the batting analogy. In bowling, I prefer consistency and in batting, I like players who can produce something special.

There's no debate in my mind. But I want to track how their careers go from here. Both are 28, so should be in best form of their life, or maybe they peaked too early. Don't think they will be averaging 22 when at 36. If Cummins can do that, he is the GOAT in my book.

[Vijy]

Since Boom's Test debut (in Jan 2018) until now, including day 4 of current test:

 

Shami: 110 wkts in 29 matches at avg of 23.93 (SR: 45.8)

Boom: 107 wkts in 26 matches at avg of 22.98 (SR: 51.8)

Ishant: 85 wkts in 26 matches at avg of 21.37 (SR: 46.7)

Umesh: 57 wkts in 15 matches at avg of 21.26 (SR: 38.3)

 

Listed only pacers with 50+ wkts. If we relax criterion for pacers to 10 wkts, Siraj has avg of 29 (SR of 57), Thakur has avg of 19 (SR of 34), Pandu has avg of 33 (SR of 57), and Boobi has avg of 20 (SR of 40).

 

Bumrah has the leader in terms of wkts per match (partly because he hasn't played much in Ind, which brings down this number) and in terms of econ. rate. However, as we see, the Indian pace quartet have been uniformly excellent.

[Majestic]

5 minutes ago, Vijy said:

I agree he should be in the mix, but SA is even more pacer-friendly than Oz is. so, he's bound to have good stats when one plays roughly 40-50% of tests at home.

 

with regards to wickets, it's largely a function of rabada playing more tests. it's not as though his wkts per match is much higher than cummins/bumrah.

 

if we are looking at players only since boom's debut, shami should be in the mix as well. I bet his record in past 4 yrs or so is excellent as well.

Conditions may have helped him a bit but Rabada has maintained great performance over a long period now.

 

He is younger than both Cummins and Bumrah and yet has over 200 test wickets to his name at similar average. The wickets per match is also similar for them and that's why he deserves to be mentioned alongside the two.

 

Rabada is no Philander. He has genuine pace and has done great in various conditions, maybe not all but still his stats are right up there in pretty much all metrics.

[Vijy]

2 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

There's no debate in my mind. But I want to track how their careers go from here. Both are 28, so should be in best form of their life, or maybe they peaked too early. Don't think they will be averaging 22 when at 36. If Cummins can do that, he is the GOAT in my book.

Bumrah will probably retire in Tests by 32; I cannot see him sustaining pace/fitness longer. Cummins may play till 34-35.

[Vijy]

Just now, Majestic said:

Conditions may have helped him a bit but Rabada has maintained great performance over a long period now.

 

He is younger than both Cummins and Bumrah and yet has over 200 test wickets to his name at similar average. The wickets per match is also similar for them and that's why he deserves to be mentioned alongside the two.

 

Rabada is no Philander. He has genuine pace and has done great in various conditions, maybe not all but still his stats are right up there in pretty much all metrics.

that is correct. he has played consistently since 2015, so he's had a longer career. cummins was out of team for several yrs. and bumrah made his test debut a bit late. the fact that he has more wkts is due to his longer career.

[Majestic]

3 minutes ago, Vijy said:

Since Boom's Test debut (in Jan 2018) until now, including day 4 of current test:

 

Shami: 110 wkts in 29 matches at avg of 23.93 (SR: 45.8)

Boom: 107 wkts in 26 matches at avg of 22.98 (SR: 51.8)

Ishant: 85 wkts in 26 matches at avg of 21.37 (SR: 46.7)

Umesh: 57 wkts in 15 matches at avg of 21.26 (SR: 38.3)

 

Listed only pacers with 50+ wkts. If we relax criterion for pacers to 10 wkts, Siraj has avg of 29 (SR of 57), Thakur has avg of 19 (SR of 34), Pandu has avg of 33 (SR of 57), and Boobi has avg of 20 (SR of 40).

 

Bumrah has the leader in terms of wkts per match (partly because he hasn't played much in Ind, which brings down this number) and in terms of econ. rate. However, as we see, the Indian pace quartet have been uniformly excellent.

Shami has been excellent in last 4 years no questions whatsoever. But his problem is his stats in first few years of his career and also unlike Kapil, he doesn't have 300-400 wickets to his name already so longevity is also lacking a bit.

Edited January 5, 2022 by Majestic

[Chakdephatte]

21 minutes ago, Majestic said:

Rabada should be included. He has twice more wickets than Bumrah at same age.

Changed the title for you. Now it's just about these two.

[Lone Wolf]

Rabada in his prime was superior to both by some margin.  Even now he is at its lowest & still delivering occasional brilliance Today's spell was just sensational. 

Tbh Cummins at this bowling friendly track would get few of SA batters fending for their lives.  Guy has ability to hit one spot consistently with relentless accuracy..  And incredible stamina. 

[Vijy]

Just now, Lone Wolf said:

Rabada in his prime was superior to both by some margin.  Even now he is at its lowest & still delivering occasional brilliance Today's spell was just sensational. 

Tbh Cummins at this bowling friendly track would get few of SA batters fending for their lives.  Guy has ability to hit one spot consistently with relentless accuracy..  And incredible stamina. 

and an excellent temperament as well.

[kohli]

Rabada is home track bully 

[vvvslaxman]

POllack said Rabada is a rhythm bowler. Bumrah is also like him. When they are in rhythm. they create chances at will.

[zen]

If in SA and that too against an inexperienced line up, if Bunrah is going to struggle, where will he do well

 

[Chakdephatte]

19 minutes ago, zen said:

If in SA and that too against an inexperienced line up, if Bunrah is going to struggle, where will he do well

Forgot Lords, Trent Bridge, Ollie Robinson? He was a man of the series contender in England.

Edited January 6, 2022 by Chakdephatte

[Frustrated]

Bumrah has struggled since the start of 2020 (NZ tour).  It has been 2 yrs.  Yes, he looked good against Eng in Eng. Coz Eng batting is the worst in the world.   We lost WTC final mainly due to our poor batting and Bumrah's leaking of runs at 5g speed plus his wicketless spells.        Cummins is way better and a more complete bowler.  There is no comparison based on current form.  

Edited January 6, 2022 by Frustrated