Anti-Selector Squad - Put your selectors hat and pick World Cup squad for India if you are very unhappy with selected Squad

[singhvivek141]

18 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

see if selectors are resorting to guys they didnt wanted means its situation where options arent avl  so now its a lottery situation

Lets not go on what ICF was vouching- most ICF even vouched kohli is done n dusted . Avesh came onback of 3 solid IPL seasons so he had merit in his selection 

 

kuldeep- umran numbers tell the story why its tough to take a punt on them........aapki apni ICF ki bhi himmat nhin unpe punt leni ki

Himmat ki baat nahi hai, sabko malum hai ki Kuldeep-Umran were never in scheme of things for T20 WC.
Now sending them suddenly as a mystery is something which hasn't worked for us in past (Varun C ka saamne hai example).
Avesh was backed over the hill, due to his 2 IPL seasons...out of which in 1 he had solid advantage of Nortje and Rabada bowling alongside (and it's a big impact which stats won't show), and that was his best season.

[zen]

18 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Umran doesnt compete with harshal 

 

That is a random theory as it can be argued that Umran can bowl well in the middle overs and at the death too ... Took 4 wkts in the 20th over verus PK; recall GT having to play out his spell of 5/25 to beat SRH; defended against Ireland at Ireland's home; & was fantastic in the warm up game in Eng where batsmen struggled against his pace

 

 

Edited October 7, 2022 by zen

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

Himmat ki baat nahi hai, sabko malum hai ki Kuldeep-Umran were never in scheme of things for T20 WC.

 

 

Umran was given a chance so he was , his limitation was found out 

kuldeep was dropped from his own ipl side so how wud he ??

 

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

Now sending them suddenly as a mystery is something which hasn't worked for us in past (Varun C ka saamne hai example).

 

Varun example is wrong coz he cudnt have done anything in those situation

 

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

 

Avesh was backed over the hill, due to his 2 IPL seasons...out of which in 1 he had solid advantage of Nortje and Rabada bowling alongside (and it's a big impact which stats won't show), and that was his best season.

that an easy way to dismiss someone one, even if u say he got wkts due to others pressure .....his eco was also very good for tht he has to bowl well 

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, zen said:

 

That is a random theory as it can be argued that Umran can bowl well at death too ... Took 3-4 wkts at the death in one of the games in IPL, defended against Ireland at Ireland's home, was fantastic, where batsmen struggled against his pace, in the warm up game in Eng

 

 

yet his international t20 eco is 13.50 at death

even harshal has bowled good overs in last 3-4 games which were quite disaster games for him 

 

harshal has come after performing 2 seasons for his side at death 

Edited October 7, 2022 by Ankit_sharma03

[Lone Wolf]

2 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

yet his international t20 eco is 13.50 at death

even harshal has bowled good overs in last 3-4 games which were quite disaster games for him 

In Trent Bridge every one except Bishnoi got tonked...  Eve the opposition bowlers 

Probably would have done lot better in India & WI. 

[coffee_rules]

1 hour ago, express bowling said:

 

Sports journalists said that Pujara and Shaw will be in the ODI squad vs SA. You may believe everything they say, I dont have to. 

 

Mohsin may be injured or may not be injured. I won't know until I get some official confirmation.

 

And that is the right approach regarding any player's injury. 

 

One of those reports was dated May and @zen clearly showed that Mohsin played after that.

 

 

 

 

Why would they give any official detail on somebody who was not even considered for national selection? It’s only fans that are jumping up and down for his inclusion  Every year IPL churns put so many performers, India can’t consider all of them, abhi they are still working on Ipl stars of 2/3 years ago. Mohsin abhi naya flavor of the season hain

[express bowling]

1 hour ago, zen said:

 

 

Numbers need much deeper analysis than just posting overall #s including understanding conditions 

 

 

 

Very true !

 

There are and have been lots of players who know how to play overall stats to their advantage. Casually referred to as stats padders.

 

Required SR in a game is 200, first stats padder comes in and scores at 140 and gets out. Now the needed SR maybe 220. 2nd stats padder comes snd scores at 165. We win the match as a low profile guy plays at 280 SR and makes up for his slow innings in the conttext of the game.. But the safe stats padder enhances his overall stats. And after a few years, he is the one who is preferred because of his impressive average and passable SR enhanced by those still slow innings in high scoring matches. 

 

Or a bowler goes for runs in critical games and does not pick wickets either. But whenever a weak opposition or low profile games come,  he picks loads of wickets and stops runs. 

 

After a few months or years, the context of the games are forgotten and  " Analysts " come up with these impressive stats to sideline low profile players and newbies. 

Edited October 7, 2022 by express bowling

[singhvivek141]

1 minute ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

Umran was given a chance so he was , his limitation was found out 

kuldeep was dropped from his own ipl side so how wud he ??

 

 

Varun example is wrong coz he cudnt have done anything in those situation

 

that an easy way to dismiss someone one, even if u say he got wkts due to others pressure .....his eco was also very good for tht he has to bowl well 

Bhai 3 T20 me sab malum ho gya...Avesh to 2017-2020 tak IPL me flop ho raha tha. His performance reached his peak in 2021 and this IPL again it went down, in comparison Umran bowled much better than Avesh (economy thodi upar gayi but wickets column is way better).
Again it's a question of fair chance, Avesh got backing to prove him in 2021. Umran got this year and he performed better than Avesh. 

and believe it or not impact hota hai, you only told in other thread that due to presence of bigger bowlers batter go against medium ones where they can get wickets. Here he was bowling alongside Rabada and Nortje, and Nortje's 2021 season was splendid as well.

[zen]

4 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

yet his international t20 eco is 13.50 at death

even harshal has bowled good overs in last 3-4 games which were quite disaster games for him 

 

harshal has come after performing 2 seasons for his side at death 

 

Umran has only played a handful of T20Is 

 

Harshal is usually successful where the ball grips. He himself (or his team mates when asked about him) has spoken about ball not gripping when he has not done well.  

 

"Prefer slow pitches rather than flat tracks like Delhi, which can hamper confidence, says Harshal Patel" - Link

[zen]

4 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

 

Very true !

 

There are and have been lots of players who know how to play overall stats to their advantage. Casually referred to as stats padders.

 

Required SR in a game is 200, first stats padder comes in and scores at 140 and gets out. Now the needed SR maybe 220. 2nd stats padder comes snd scores at 165. We win the match as a low profile guy plays at 280 SR and makes up for his slow innings in the conttext of the game.. But the safe stats padder enhances his overall stats. And after a few years, he is the one who is preferred because of his impressive average and passable SR enhanced by those still slow innings in high scoring matches. 

 

Or a bowler goes for runs in critical games and does not pick wickets either. But whenever a weak opposition or low profile games come,  he picks load of wickets and stops runs. 

 

After a few months or years, the context of the games are forgotten and  " Analysts " come up with these impressive stats to sideline low profile players and newbies. 

 

Stats are usually more useful when discussing retired players where you can say this or that was better ... even useful for experienced players where you have noticed a trend while having info on strengths and weaknesses ... Youngsters are constantly evolving and creating #s (many folks who use stats on forums can be like "neem hakeem khatra jaan")

 

And like you said, there are issues with stats padders as well 

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, Lone Wolf said:

In Trent Bridge every one except Bishnoi got tonked...  Eve the opposition bowlers 

Probably would have done lot better in India & WI. 

yaar wo to abhi Ind-Aus ki series men bhi dono side ke sabhi fast bowler pette hai wo sympathy bhi sabko dikhao

 

He wasnt dropped for that , it was his limitation n down side . We dont have the luxury to afford umran as lets a side like england can have who have so many bowling options. 

I hve already shown u his numbers in PP where if i remeber it was 15-17 eco and death also he is going at 13.50 , lack of experience is another big factor . 

 

Wo to merko bh feeling hai umran can do very well at place like MCG , but if u think in terms of TM thats a big gamble 

WI he may have done well since WI batsman dont like pace

but doubt in India (last 2 series extreme flat wkts and Aus-SA batsman love pace) 

[rkt.india]

1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

if he was selected that means he selectors dont have anything against him , also he was a net bowler 

Those selectors were different though. 

[BacktoCricaddict]

1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

Kohli is out form ??

kohli since asia cup is avg 57 with a s/r of 141

 

Regd shaw - i have question do u wanna take him to Aus 

 

 

iske baad 4-5 shaw uss short length pe fir out hua tha 

 

 

I am guessing you are in agreement with the rest of my team!  So, pass ho gayaa main!

 

As for VK, I am not sure why I am getting different numbers.

 

Asia cup ended 10th Sep.  From 12 Sep to today, VK's scores in T20Is: 

2 (7)    11 (6)     63 (48) - great series winning knock :tipofhat:  3 (9)  49* (28) - excellent knock!

 

128 (118), 1 not out.

Average = 32.  SR = 130.6

 

Regardless, while your numbers may be a bit off, overall you have a good point - he has played well including 2 clutch knocks, and should not be dropped now.

 

So, I'd open with Shaw and Pant, put VK at #3, and make Pandya the captain and Pant the VC :-)

 

 

Edited October 7, 2022 by BacktoCricaddict

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

Bhai 3 T20 me sab malum ho gya...Avesh to 2017-2020 tak IPL me flop ho raha tha

 

so was he selected when he wasnt performing or when he was performing ?

 

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

His performance reached his peak in 2021 and this IPL again it went down, in comparison Umran bowled much better than Avesh (economy thodi upar gayi but wickets column is way better).
Again it's a question of fair chance, Avesh got backing to prove him in 2021. Umran got this year and he performed better than Avesh. 

 

so they selected him but felt he wasnt ready which he wasnt 

avesh got chanced - he failed he was dropped too 

 

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

and believe it or not impact hota hai, you only told in other thread that due to presence of bigger bowlers batter go against medium ones where they can get wickets. Here he was bowling alongside Rabada and Nortje, and Nortje's 2021 season was splendid as well.

 

u shud have read niche ka bhi comment where i said but when others are not bowling well even bumrah cant do anything

at the end u need bowl urself well. I clearly mentioned in current situation where  bhuvi-chahal-harshal-hardik is struggling with form even bumrah cant do anything. Basic same hai at the end u need to bowl well urself , other can help create pressure but if u dont bowl urself well koi faida nahin uss pressure ka

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, rkt.india said:

Those selectors were different though. 

and coaching staff to but team to wahi hai , point ye hai ki koi dushmani to hai nahin selectors ki usse as everyone says they dont like who bowl fast

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

So, I'd open with Shaw and Pant, put VK at #3, and make Pandya the captain and Pant the VC :-)

why drop rohit ?? his s/r post captaincy has been phenomenal which is the only good point regd shaw .......................as far consistency goes thats never been shaw's forte . Rohit obv is miles better player of pace n bounce

As much as i love pant and back him , i also know i have no numbers to back him in t20 format

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

As for VK, I am not sure why our filters are different, but Asia cup ended 10th Sep.

 

From 12 Sep to today, VK's scores in T20Is: 

2 (7)

11 (6)

63 (48) - great series winning knock :tipofhat:

3 (9)

49* (28) - good knock!

 

Average = 32.  SR = 130.6

sorry i meant from asia cup 

i used since rather then from 

[express bowling]

26 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

Why would they give any official detail on somebody who was not even considered for national selection?

 

 

BCCI wouldn't 

 

But sometimes the player himself does on Twitter or Insta.

 

Or some media reports give extensive details of the nature of injury, where he is getting treated and the expected recovery time. (  Not something like dodgy hammy )

 

 

26 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

 

It’s only fans that are jumping up and down for his inclusion  Every year IPL churns put so many performers, India can’t consider all of them, abhi they are still working on Ipl stars of 2/3 years ago. Mohsin abhi naya flavor of the season hain

 

 

We fans maybe fickle. And Mohsin maybe the flavour of the season. But this case is a bit different. 

 

The reason why he is being asked for is because, apart from Bumrah, we don't have any established Team India T20I pacer who is both quick and has white bsll skills. 

 

Even the Team management is SOSing poor T20I bowlers like Umesh to have some pace in the attack. Mohsin has atleast performed somewhere in the recent past.

 

But now is not the time to include Mohsin even if he is fit. We have to go with either Siraj or Shami.  These are all theoretical discussions regarding how we could have prepared in the last 4 months. 

 

 

Edited October 7, 2022 by express bowling

[singhvivek141]

5 minutes ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

u shud have read niche ka bhi comment where i said but when others are not bowling well even bumrah cant do anything

at the end u need bowl urself well. I clearly mentioned in current situation where  bhuvi-chahal-harshal-hardik is struggling with form even bumrah cant do anything. Basic same hai at the end u need to bowl well urself , other can help create pressure but if u dont bowl urself well koi faida nahin uss pressure ka

I read that, but I don't think that has any relation with Avesh's performance. Nortje and Rabada were bowling well, that gives an opportunity to the new bowler to pickup wickets.

Agree, that bowler has to take care of his own overs, but again, it all boils down to consistency with which he was backed (so did Umran after his failures in first couple of matches and later terrorized many batters). Tyagi didn't get that leverage, Kuldeep got some and he did bowled well in one match and in other when he has to bowl final over against Stoinis (stats might show that he went for runs but they don't tell that he sealed the deal for RR within first 2 bowls itself).
 

[Ankit_sharma03]

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

I read that, but I don't think that has any relation with Avesh's performance. Nortje and Rabada were bowling well, that gives an opportunity to the new bowler to pickup wickets.

Agree, that bowler has to take care of his own overs, but again, it all boils down to consistency with which he was backed (so did Umran after his failures in first couple of matches and later

terrorized many batters).

Im not denying umran great season in IPL but when it comes to national side it tough. Despite his best season he had some match loosing games

A team cannot afford a guy who has so much extreme for just one phase value 

 

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

 

Tyagi didn't get that leverage,

 

tyagi has no numbers going on for him 

 

9 hours ago, singhvivek141 said:

Kuldeep got some and he did bowled well in one match and in other when he has to bowl final over against Stoinis (stats might show that he went for runs but they don't tell that he sealed the deal for RR within first 2 bowls itself).
 

yet he leaked runs also at the end team will look at larger pictures

kuldeep leaked at 13.62 at death when mccoy came he gave them 8.54 at death 

will u blame team for going for latter , the diff is huge 

 

I can show u even harshal good overs in last few terrible games he had , wud u cut him slack for those 1-1 overs