Modi - The most charismatic indian politician ever?

[ravishingravi]

7 hours ago, Gollum said:

Jinnah too was Gujju. 

 

And aren't we greatful to him. Ofcourse MC caused unbelievable horror but imagine having 25 crore padosis in our home. 

[Gollum]

7 hours ago, mishra said:

He did huge favour to us by cqrving a vassal state which Americans demanded from Brits post WWII

 

17 minutes ago, ravishingravi said:

 

And aren't we greatful to him. Ofcourse MC caused unbelievable horror but imagine having 25 crore padosis in our home. 

I respect/admire Jinnah more than Nehru and Gandhi. At least, he was true to his community/cause. 

Edited January 16, 2025 by Gollum

[bharathh]

Jinnah was a power hungry parasite just like Nehru. He did what he did to be PM of the country. He wanted to be of India and then realized when that was not happening - it would be better to divide the country on the basis of a religion that he didn't even subscribe to. It was just a political tool for him. He was a really bad muslim. 

[kepler37b]

13 hours ago, Gollum said:

Jinnah too was Gujju. 

Then modiji is 4th one. Behind Gandhi/Patel/Jinnah. In that order.

[Vk1]

13 hours ago, mishra said:

Both Modi and Nehuru were attacked by Chinese. Legacy of Neguru would have been a different league and  I see iron lady Indiraji as response to Nehuru failure. For me, Indiraji was best PM, than Modi then PVN. Atalji and Shshtriji were in same league. Rest, including Nehuruji is not worth mentioning. They were failures or mostly useless

 

Indira pushed the economy into a bottomless pit. She is by far the worst PM among the major contenders 

[ravishingravi]

19 minutes ago, Vk1 said:

 

Indira pushed the economy into a bottomless pit. She is by far the worst PM among the major contenders 

 

This is true. On economy she is screwed us big time. She had some redeeming features though. 

[AuxiliA]

6 hours ago, Gollum said:

 

I respect/admire Jinnah more than Nehru and Gandhi. At least, he was true to his community/cause. 

 

 

This. Gandhi and especially Nehru are bigger historical villians for Hindus than even Ghori and Ghazni.

 

We had a golden opportunity in 1947 to have a fresh start. Even a critic of Hinduism like Ambedkar was completely in favour of a population swap with Pakistan as he  understood the perils of Islamic Jihad very well. But Gandhi, who did absolutely nothing to secure the lives of Non-Muslims in Pakistan, vetoed this plan totally and Nehru went steps further & gave us the draconian WAQF board among several other sharia concessions. 

 

Ambedkar also wanted Sanskrit (despite himself never have learned it) to be the link Indian language for Official work as it had been historically for centuries but Gandhi chose Hindi which made no sense at all and set the stage for future linguistic conflicts. 

 

 

 

[mishra]

3 hours ago, Vk1 said:

 

Indira pushed the economy into a bottomless pit. She is by far the worst PM among the major contenders 

Anyone who undertands Global economics knows that US can eff up any country.

 

She took head on US and its interest by breaking up Pakistan. This resulted in US fuelled separtism in Punjab(there is Direct US Hand, Bangldeshis think we havent paid for their freedom, we have paid for decades and still paying the cost of their freedom). Kashmir was already there (there was a incident mentioned that Kashmiri Muslims were flashing their penis in Indirajis rally in Kashmir).

Our Me Lords (I attribute that judgement to US Deep State where Parliamentary Membership of Indiraji was cancelled by a Court aka she was tevchnically NOT PM)   managed to get her enforce emergency.

 

She was told to Not have Sikhs as part of her Security. She was not ready to accept that and gave her life.

Edited January 16, 2025 by mishra

[mishra]

2 hours ago, AuxiliA said:

 

 

This. Gandhi and especially Nehru are bigger historical villians for Hindus than even Ghori and Ghazni.

 

We had a golden opportunity in 1947 to have a fresh start. Even a critic of Hinduism like Ambedkar was completely in favour of a population swap with Pakistan as he  understood the perils of Islamic Jihad very well. But Gandhi, who did absolutely nothing to secure the lives of Non-Muslims in Pakistan, vetoed this plan totally and Nehru went steps further & gave us the draconian WAQF board among several other sharia concessions. 

 

Ambedkar also wanted Sanskrit (despite himself never have learned it) to be the link Indian language for Official work as it had been historically for centuries but Gandhi chose Hindi which made no sense at all and set the stage for future linguistic conflicts. 

 

 

 

I think Nehuru is given less credit than he deserves at time of Partition. Seeds of partion were Sown after 1857 experience of British where Last Mughal on Delhi throne Jafar Shah called upon the rulers of India to Fight Brits despite knowing he was weak and his children will be killed and Mughal Sultanate bloodline will come to end for good.

Fastfwd 50 years later, Agha Khan in Brngal demanded separate elctorate.

Jinnah joined the Separatist ideology lot later. As per Cabinet Mission plan, There was no division of India to happen. But there was a catch. Ambedkar Nehuru Patel Tagore and many leaders of at time were convinced fine prints of the Cabinet Mission plan had one and only one outcome. Complete Islamisation of British India. So they asked to change the fine prints.

 

If it was upto Gandhi, He would have accepted the Cabinet Mission plan as well as Jinnah as first PM of India. Nehuru, Patel and other saw it opposed it. They said they wont accept Cabinet Mission plan unless fine prints are changed. So credit where due. If Patel made the Nation India by building consensus among various rulers of India, Nehuru stood his ground and protected India from impractical utopian Gandhi 's India.

[randomGuy]

2 hours ago, AuxiliA said:

 

 

This. Gandhi and especially Nehru are bigger historical villians for Hindus than even Ghori and Ghazni.

 

We had a golden opportunity in 1947 to have a fresh start. Even a critic of Hinduism like Ambedkar was completely in favour of a population swap with Pakistan as he  understood the perils of Islamic Jihad very well. But Gandhi, who did absolutely nothing to secure the lives of Non-Muslims in Pakistan, vetoed this plan totally and Nehru went steps further & gave us the draconian WAQF board among several other sharia concessions. 

 

Ambedkar also wanted Sanskrit (despite himself never have learned it) to be the link Indian language for Official work as it had been historically for centuries but Gandhi chose Hindi which made no sense at all and set the stage for future linguistic conflicts. 

 

 

 

I have huge respect for ambedkar, mayawati and dalit/sc/st community... Caste reservations for sc/st is a good policy and very much needed. 

 

Pushpendra kulshrestha considers them the biggest Hindus, their forefathers endured discrimination for centuries and yet remained Hindus. I agree with him. 

 

 

[mishra]

37 minutes ago, randomGuy said:

I have huge respect for ambedkar, mayawati and dalit/sc/st community... Caste reservations for sc/st is a good policy and very much needed. 

 

Pushpendra kulshrestha considers them the biggest Hindus, their forefathers endured discrimination for centuries and yet remained Hindus. I agree with him. 

 

 

I believe, in Indian Society job was divided into 4 parts.

SC ST were supposed to do complete local Administration,Skills job

Security/Geo politics related stuff guys became Kshatriya.

Business class is Baniya

Higher education /research people became Brahmins

 

Over time, People Stratified in jobs they were doing. And Since jobs in a particular class (Specially last part became less or was not rewarding enough, Most Brahmins ended up Sudama Life) , Local Administration jobs started going away from SC ST  and others took them depending upon how rewarding they were

Edited January 16, 2025 by mishra

[randomGuy]

56 minutes ago, mishra said:

I believe, in Indian Society job was divided into 4 parts.

SC ST were supposed to do complete local Administration,Skills job

Security/Geo politics related stuff guys became Kshatriya.

Business class is Baniya

Higher education /research people became Brahmins

 

Over time, People Stratified in jobs they were doing. And Since jobs in a particular class (Specially last part became less or was not rewarding enough, Most Brahmins ended up Sudama Life) , Local Administration jobs started going away from SC ST  and others took them depending upon how rewarding they were

Brahmin role was probably of a priest. Not in research. At that time, no substantial research was going on.

 

Roles would be divided in any society, where we failed was the discrimination based on that. One view from acharya prashant 

 

 

 

[raki05]

20 hours ago, mishra said:

Both Modi and Nehuru were attacked by Chinese. Legacy of Neguru would have been a different league and  I see iron lady Indiraji as response to Nehuru failure. For me, Indiraji was best PM, than Modi then PVN. Atalji and Shshtriji were in same league. Rest, including Nehuruji is not worth mentioning. They were failures or mostly useless

Though Indira gandhi was female but she had the balls!!!

[kepler37b]

1 hour ago, raki05 said:

Though Indira gandhi was female but she had the balls!!!

TBF, the country was not this chaotic during her rule. Not so many regional parties. Not so many states. The opposition was actually shyte then.

[mishra]

14 minutes ago, kepler37b said:

TBF, the country was not this chaotic during her rule. Not so many regional parties. Not so many states. The opposition was actually shyte then.

Chk the episodes to runup to emergency. We were doing what even Pakistani Judiciary hasn’t done. Dissmising a PM on technical grounds 

Edited January 16, 2025 by mishra

[mishra]

3 hours ago, randomGuy said:

Brahmin role was probably of a priest. Not in research. At that time, no substantial research was going on.

 

Roles would be divided in any society, where we failed was the discrimination based on that. One view from acharya prashant 

 

 

 

Think I disagree with it. In Ramayana and Mahabharat art of war and weapon System was taught by Brahmins in Gurkul aka education and research. Karna was accepted by society as Angraj. Even parashuram took him as student. Ravan became king despite being a Brahmin

Edited January 16, 2025 by mishra

[randomGuy]

12 minutes ago, mishra said:

Think I disagree with it. In Ramayana and Mahabharat art of war and weapon System was taught by Brahmins in Gurkul aka education and research. Karna was accepted by society as Angraj. Even parashuram took him as student. Ravan became king despite being a Brahmin

Yar I am not too impressed by the works of Brahminical system and its outcomes. Neither was the research too strong nor was the society (caste discrimination). I can elaborate but it will become controversial.

 

Edit: Our strength has been spirituality and culture, not science . Few unbelievably exceptional mathematicians here and there but nothing systemic.

Edited January 16, 2025 by randomGuy

[mishra]

34 minutes ago, randomGuy said:

Yar I am not too impressed by the works of Brahminical system and its outcomes. Neither was the research too strong nor was the society (caste discrimination). I can elaborate but it will become controversial.

 

Edit: Our strength has been spirituality and culture, not science . Few unbelievably exceptional mathematicians here and there but nothing systemic.

Yes, this is a deep discussion. Its not easy to write or discuss over forum as its difficult to put the point correct specially if we are not from literary background. Hope someone does some podcast and touches issue and aspects.

 

If it makes pain any less, Some European thinker said,  every civilisation has only 400 years of peak irrespective of which part they are from.

[Muloghonto]

1 hour ago, randomGuy said:

Yar I am not too impressed by the works of Brahminical system and its outcomes. Neither was the research too strong nor was the society (caste discrimination). I can elaborate but it will become controversial.

 

Edit: Our strength has been spirituality and culture, not science . Few unbelievably exceptional mathematicians here and there but nothing systemic.

False. 

India has been by far the biggest producer of science prior to the 1500s. 

We discovered scientific process, calculus, etc. 

Our scientific output has been so systematic that mendeleev literally organized the periodic table on the same scientific principle our alphabet in India is organized. 

[coffee_rules]

1 hour ago, randomGuy said:

Yar I am not too impressed by the works of Brahminical system and its outcomes. Neither was the research too strong nor was the society (caste discrimination). I can elaborate but it will become controversial.

 

Edit: Our strength has been spirituality and culture, not science . Few unbelievably exceptional mathematicians here and there but nothing systemic.

There is nothing Brahminical about the system. That is the narrative pushed by Marxist historians. You have not aware of many advances made by the Indian civilization starting from Vedic and SSVC.  This is not some WAU stuff. Read about how much we knew before the west. Astronomy, Medicine, Yoga, Ayurveda, Language (literature, grammarians like Panini) , Darahanas, Industries like textiles, metallurgy (esp zinc and copper) . Indian products have been found in many ancient archeological sites in Greece, Rome etc.  No wonder the west was so interested to find a sea route to India - sone ki chidhia. 
 

Archarya Pramod is an authority on many things esp to talk about Manusmriti. Need to talk in different topic.