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Air India Flight 171 from Ahmedabad to London Gatwick crashes into medical students' hostel: 280+ fatalities

Gollum

By Gollum
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EnterTheVoid Mentor

EnterTheVoid

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

Most of the western media theories and YT experts who come in a pilot’s attire to sound authentic are convinced that the only way the cutoff switches went off is by pilot action which happened in a second. Yes, at this time , we know the cutoff switches is the Why of the crash. How is still in under  investigation, the WSJ report from yesterday is so damning to the senior pilot and they accuse him of committing murder-suicide based on the same speculation of the above conversation you point out to. This is not a saazush against India, but highly suspect of clearing out Boeing

 

If you are referring to the MCAS issue on the Boeing 737 Max, that is a seperate matter entirely.

Boeing put in the MCAS and didn't tell anyone, as they hand to spend money on training/up-skilling the pilots. At that time, Boeing was run by bean-counters that prioritised dollars over design safety.

 

The faulty Angle of Attack sensor told MCAS that the plane was incorrectly pitched up (when it wasn't), hence causing MCAS to pitch the nose down. That's why we got wild pitch oscillations during the climb phase for the Lion Air and the Ethiopian Airways flights before they crashed.

That was a Boeing 737 Max issue. That is why every carrier that flew the 737 Max grounded their entire fleet for months.

 

If this was a 787 issue, than, the 787's would be grounded. Worldwide.

India is still flying it's 787 fleet. So, from everything we have seen, it's not a 787 issue.

Edited by EnterTheVoid
coffee_rules Grand Master

coffee_rules

Posted
Posted
52 minutes ago, EnterTheVoid said:

 

If you are referring to the MCAS issue on the Boeing 737 Max, that is a seperate matter entirely.

Boeing put in the MCAS and didn't tell anyone, as they hand to spend money on training/up-skilling the pilots. At that time, Boeing was run by bean-counters that prioritised dollars over design safety.

 

The faulty Angle of Attack sensor told MCAS that the plane was incorrectly pitched up (when it wasn't), hence causing MCAS to pitch the nose down. That's why we got wild pitch oscillations during the climb phase for the Lion Air and the Ethiopian Airways flights before they crashed.

That was a Boeing 737 Max issue. That is why every carrier that flew the 737 Max grounded their entire fleet for months.

 

If this was a 787 issue, than, the 787's would be grounded. Worldwide.

India is still flying it's 787 fleet. So, from everything we have seen, it's not a 787 issue.

No, I was speaking in general that there is a haste to absolve Boeing by media PR. Even in the LionAir MCAS case. Boeing denied any flaw and blamed the Indian pilot first. After another crash or reported incident. They acknowledged their issue. I know it is specific to 737, but the big corporate has a dubious  track record. 

EnterTheVoid Mentor

EnterTheVoid

Posted
Posted
28 minutes ago, coffee_rules said:

No, I was speaking in general that there is a haste to absolve Boeing by media PR. Even in the LionAir MCAS case. Boeing denied any flaw and blamed the Indian pilot first. After another crash or reported incident. They acknowledged their issue. I know it is specific to 737, but the big corporate has a dubious  track record. 

 

Boeing had a stellar engineering record until the bean counters started running the show.

ash Rising Star

ash

Posted
Posted


What are the chances of this switch turning off automatically, one after the other, in the correct order ( L--R, Engine 1 first and then Engine 2) , and 1 sec apart ..

MechEng Veteran

MechEng

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, EnterTheVoid said:

If there was some pressure activation that is unknown, than, every 787 flying out there is at risk. Dual engines idling on take off is CATASTROPHIC. There is no other word for it.

 

Hence the reason why not all boeing 787 flights were grounded.

rkt.india Grand Master

rkt.india

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, ash said:


What are the chances of this switch turning off automatically, one after the other, in the correct order ( L--R, Engine 1 first and then Engine 2) , and 1 sec apart ..

No chance.

Lord Grand Master

Lord

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, EnterTheVoid said:

Mental health of the pilots is a real issue.

Look no further than Germanwings Flight 9525. The first officer locked the captain out of the cockpit and crashed the plane into a mountain.

 

Read on it. The guy was declared mentally unfit to fly but managed to hide it :((

coffee_rules Grand Master

coffee_rules

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, Lord said:

 

Read on it. The guy was declared mentally unfit to fly but managed to hide it :((

Any link or authentic source?

 

Listen to how even in 787. The fuel switches were cutoff automatically just before landing. It is a flying computer and we know how software written by humans are so buggy. Activations can happen without pilot action

 

 

diga Grand Master

diga

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

Any link or authentic source?

 

Listen to how even in 787. The fuel switches were cutoff automatically just before landing. It is a flying computer and we know how software written by humans are so buggy. Activations can happen without pilot action

 

If software controls the fuel input to Engines, then thats possible.  (1 bit flip in Nvram/flash) can be catastrophic

MK55 Grand Master

MK55

Posted
Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, coffee_rules said:

https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/top-aviation-expert-boeing-dreamliner-software-can-cut-fuel-without-pilot-input-has-happened-twice-485119-2025-07-17
 

Top aviation expert: 'Boeing Dreamliner software can cut fuel without pilot input, has happened twice'

 

 

I wasn’t able / dint read the full article as the link was so full of spam ads on my device.


So the software cut off the fuel but over here, did that software also cause both the spring loaded switches to move mechanically? Especially in a time frame / gap interval which is typically seen when someone simply switches those off intentionally? 


Now the only way this can not be intentional (I think) is if the locking mechanism failed for both the switches during this flight while it was taking off (can’t be before as someone would have reported it) and simultaneously or soon after them failing some very peculiar vibration moved (transitioned) both these switches mechanically one after the other with a gap of 1 second (as if someone just manually switched them intentionally). Now this is still technically possible but looks really really low probability?

 

 

 

 

Edited by MK55
MK55 Grand Master

MK55

Posted
Posted (edited)

I think what they can disclose is (for even more corroborative evidence) 

 

1: Was there any mechanical (physical) defect in the switches - now not sure how badly they r damaged by the fire to even do this reliably.

 

2: Do some forensic deep dive of the voice recorder and track the source of the sound when the switches got moved. Did it also coincide or were preceded by movements by the pilot? Or is it consistent with sounds when a human moves them one after the other? Not sure how sensitive these devices are or if this is even possible. 
 

3: If they’ve got time n huge money - May be try and  (somewhat) partially replicate the unlikely scenario. For ex install switches with broken lock mechanism (technically even this needs to be simulated), build a system that induces vibrations (or something else which can cause them to transition). Do it thousands of time / million and see if u can cause them to move with an interval of 1 second with sounds consistent to what you captured.

Edited by MK55
coffee_rules Grand Master

coffee_rules

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, MK55 said:

I wasn’t able / dint read the full article as the link was so full of spam ads on my device.


So the software cut off the fuel but over here, did that software also cause both the spring loaded switches to move mechanically? Especially in a time frame / gap interval which is typically seen when someone simply switches those off intentionally? 


Now the only way this can not be intentional (I think) is if the locking mechanism failed for both the switches during this flight while it was taking off (can’t be before as someone would have reported it) and simultaneously or soon after them failing some very peculiar vibration moved (transitioned) both these switches mechanically one after the other with a gap of 1 second (as if someone just manually switched them intentionally). Now this is still technically possible but looks really really low probability?

 

 

 

 

It is the same woman b the Barkha Dutt interviewed that Article is talking about. She claims it could be a sw glitch and should be investigated further

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