India tour of South Africa - 4 Tests. My analysis

[SecondSlip]

 Hi everyone, I would just like to share my thoughts and opinions on our next overseas test series and what we need to do to compete and hopefully win! I believe that a team like this can compete in SA: 

Vijay 
Rahul 
Pujara 
Kohli (C)
Rahane 
Pandya 
Pant (WK)
Ashwin 
Bhuvi 
Shami 
Ishant 

Our top 5 will enjoy the ball coming onto the bat in South Africa. Pujara and Kohli already have centuries there, even Vijay and Rahane have scored 96 & 97 respectively. KL Rahul has a century in Australia, he will also like playing in SA. With all these guys being more experienced than our 2013 series, I believe that they will do really well in South Africa. 

I believe that Hardik Pandya is the fast bowling allrounder that we are looking for, He is a much better package than Stuart Binny and I would like to see him bat at #6 in South Africa. The bouncy pitches in SA will suit his bowling style and he can play a dominant innings with the bat as well in the lower order. He can play a similar role to what Stokes plays for England, an attacking batting allrounder who can win the match with both bat and ball at #6.

In SA, Saha with the bat will be a comedy show. He can't even score in India, I just stutter to imagine what he will do against Rabada, Morkel, Philander etc in their home conditions. In July & August, India "A" will play First Class matches in South Africa against SA "A". 
Rishab Pant should be the wicketkeeper for this "A" series, I am very confident that he will do well and impress Dravid, which will then eventually translate to a Team India call up into the test squad. Pant can play a similar role to what De Kock plays for SA, an attacking match winning WK-Batsman at #7. 

Ashwin should be the lone spinner in the XI, because 2 spinners isn't going to work in SA for sure unless we play at Durban but even then it will be a risk. I believe Ashwin will do better than what he did in 2013, he has matured a lot and he's a match winning cricketer. He is a superior bowler to Jadeja as well. His batting will also be needed in SA just in case we have a collapse. Ashwin at #8 gives us a lot of batting depth and can help us post decent totals. 

I would like Bhuvi, Shami and Ishant to be the 3 leading pacers in SA. Bhuvi will be very dangerous with the new ball and I expect him to have a decent series on those SA pitches. Shami is Shami, he will be the first name on the team sheet for me and a lot of people in this group, no questions asked. Regarding Ishant, he is the spearhead of this team. He should play ahead of Yadav and most probably will. 

This is going to be an exciting series!  

[fineleg]

Given the fitness/injury scenario of our players, we need very backups to be solid choices in the squad. Since our "first choice 11" may or may not be available.

[G_B_]

hmm a bit cruel to throw Pant in at the deep end on the tour of SA?

[maniac]

Just now, fineleg said:

Given the fitness/injury scenario of our players, we need very backups to be solid choices in the squad. Since our "first choice 11" may or may not be available.

Look at our bench-players who haven't played the last test....just look at the names...... Ishant,Rohit,Shami,Rahane,Pandya,Pant(potential shot in the future)-6 match winners right there+Saha

 

Then add Kuldeep Yadav,Iyer,Dhawan,Aaron and Shardul

 

That X1 alone can decimate teams

 

 

[SecondSlip]

Just now, G_B_ said:

hmm a bit cruel to throw Pant in at the deep end on the tour of SA?

We have a test against BD, 4 against Aus and then 3 against SL in SL before we tour South Africa. 
Ideally Pant should play in some of these matches but let's see what happens. 

I think that we shouldn't waste anymore time on Pappu once the Chennai test is over. He has done his job and it's now time to groom a young WK like Pant very soon. 

[maniac]

Just now, SecondSlip said:

We have a test against BD, 4 against Aus and then 3 against SL in SL before we tour South Africa. 
Ideally Pant should play in some of these matches but let's see what happens. 

I think that we shouldn't waste anymore time on Pappu once the Chennai test is over. He has done his job and it's now time to groom a young WK like Pant very soon. 

We are touring lanka again?

[SecondSlip]

Just now, maniac said:

We are touring lanka again?

Yep.
3 tests, 5 ODIs & 1 T20 in August 
http://icc-live.s3.amazonaws.com/cms/media/about_docs/547c2a4d42a86-Copy of Copy of FTP 2015 to 2019 as at Nov 2014.pdf

[sandeep]

Lanka tour might be a good time to unleash the "panth".

[Cricketics]

Good thread. Even though bit early, but we have to get things started for overseas.

 

To me, I have some concern about Pandya's selection. I rather give chance to somone like Dhawal Kulkarni who can hold a bat and could be a better 4th seamer also in the team.

 

And Also I would like to keep Varun Aaron in reserves for South Africa if he is fit around that time. 

 

I must mention that for a tour like South Africa, we are better of playing 4 seamers-1 spinner combo or 3 pacers-2 spinners(jadeja/Ash) instead of trying a makeshift player like Pandya who might bowl much and also might not score much. We need batting over there in South Africa to click. Lot of games are low scoring. You can score 300 in the first innigs and still easily win by big margins. Hence, it is important to keep batting strong there. Adding Pandya will not help us. 

 

[mancalledsting]

How's has Hardik pandyas bowling been in first class this season? Also I'm not sure whether he's able to bat at test level. Maybe we should play him in Chennai and find out

[sandeep]

1 minute ago, Cricketics said:

Good thread. Even though bit early, but we have to get things started for overseas.

 

To me, I have some concern about Pandya's selection. I rather give chance to somone like Dhawal Kulkarni who can hold a bat and could be a better 4th seamer also in the team.

 

And Also I would like to keep Varun Aaron in reserves for South Africa if he is fit around that time. 

 

I must mention that for a tour like South Africa, we are better of playing 4 seamers-1 spinner combo or 3 pacers-2 spinners(jadeja/Ash) instead of trying a makeshift player like Pandya who might bowl much and also might not score much. We need batting over there in South Africa to click. Lot of games are low scoring. You can score 300 in the first innigs and still easily win by big margins. Hence, it is important to keep batting strong there. Adding Pandya will not help us. 

 

Agreed about Pandya's batting being unproven and a potential weak link.  But I struggle to understand your love of the Dhawal.  And that too in test cricket.  Don't know what you see in him.  

[Vilander]

Pandya has a shoulder fracture...yikes..thats gotta slow him down. 

[sandeep]

Just now, Vilander said:

Pandya has a shoulder fracture...yikes..thats gotta slow him down. 

Given his build, he can easily run into over-use injuries in the future if he starts working hard on bowling long spells.  Yeah, he works very hard on fitness, but that doesn't automatically translate into endurance.  Especially if he doesn't have the right guidance.  And its very easy to prioritize strength training over endurance.  

 

Gujju Lukdya has a long way to go before he turns into a legit test selection candidate.  But If he does, and does well - not much will stop Team India from bulldozing teams overseas.  

[Cricketics]

6 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Agreed about Pandya's batting being unproven and a potential weak link.  But I struggle to understand your love of the Dhawal.  And that too in test cricket.  Don't know what you see in him.  

No love for Dhawal man. I won't even pick him in my ODI team but for a tour like South Africa, if a team needs someone to bat,I don't trust Pandya at all. He will be able to negotiate Steyn because Steyn will be untouchable with his swing and then one bounce from Philander or Abbott or Morkel will send him back. And we will call for his head.

 

I have seen Dhawal bat and he can hold and form p'ships. But seriously, I won't have either of them in my team. I rather have two spinners(Jadeja/Ashwin) all tour who can bat well. 

[sandeep]

^ I hear you on the question marks around Pandya in red ball cricket.  Right now he's an option on paper alone.  But worth the investment at least.  Doesn't mean he's an automatic pick.  I wonder if there are going to be any 'A' tour opportunities for him before the SA tour...

[Cricketics]

18 minutes ago, sandeep said:

^ I hear you on the question marks around Pandya in red ball cricket.  Right now he's an option on paper alone.  But worth the investment at least.  Doesn't mean he's an automatic pick.  I wonder if there are going to be any 'A' tour opportunities for him before the SA tour...

Hopefully they send him if they are thinking of using an all rounder on the south african test tour. If they are not thinking of using an all rounder then rather send a batsman or a bowler on A tour. 

I honestly would like to see both Ojha and Pant go on this A tour. Both Ojha and Pant can be part of our eventual South Africa tour. Pant can actually play as a batsman and Ojha as just keeper if both are impressive on A tour.

 

I hope selectors put some sense and select both of them for the A tour. 

[Riju23]

Isn't it time for SL to tour Ind? I feel like our most recent series with them was also in SL

 

I'm hoping we will unearth at least one new fast bowling prospect by the time we tour SA 

[Cricketics]

51 minutes ago, maniac said:

We are touring lanka again?

 

37 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Lanka tour might be a good time to unleash the "panth".

 

50 minutes ago, SecondSlip said:

Yep.
3 tests, 5 ODIs & 1 T20 in August 
http://icc-live.s3.amazonaws.com/cms/media/about_docs/547c2a4d42a86-Copy of Copy of FTP 2015 to 2019 as at Nov 2014.pdf

I think that ICC FTP schedule has some minor changes and errors. If you check India's schedule of 2015, it will show that India hosted Lanka in 2015 for 3 tests, but actually we toured them for 3 tests in the month of August, 2015. So this Sri Lankan series should actually be a home series as I think BCCI and Lankan board swapped the series I think. 

 

Also, another error it shows that England are playing 5 ODI's and 1 twenty20. In fact they are playing 3 ODI's and 3T20s next month. 

[ShebbySB]

2 hours ago, SecondSlip said:

 Hi everyone, I would just like to share my thoughts and opinions on our next overseas test series and what we need to do to compete and hopefully win! I believe that a team like this can compete in SA: 

Vijay 
Rahul 
Pujara 
Kohli (C)
Rahane 
Pandya 
Pant (WK)
Ashwin 
Bhuvi 
Shami 
Ishant 

Our top 5 will enjoy the ball coming onto the bat in South Africa. Pujara and Kohli already have centuries there, even Vijay and Rahane have scored 96 & 97 respectively. KL Rahul has a century in Australia, he will also like playing in SA. With all these guys being more experienced than our 2013 series, I believe that they will do really well in South Africa. 

I believe that Hardik Pandya is the fast bowling allrounder that we are looking for, He is a much better package than Stuart Binny and I would like to see him bat at #6 in South Africa. The bouncy pitches in SA will suit his bowling style and he can play a dominant innings with the bat as well in the lower order. He can play a similar role to what Stokes plays for England, an attacking batting allrounder who can win the match with both bat and ball at #6.

In SA, Saha with the bat will be a comedy show. He can't even score in India, I just stutter to imagine what he will do against Rabada, Morkel, Philander etc in their home conditions. In July & August, India "A" will play First Class matches in South Africa against SA "A". 
Rishab Pant should be the wicketkeeper for this "A" series, I am very confident that he will do well and impress Dravid, which will then eventually translate to a Team India call up into the test squad. Pant can play a similar role to what De Kock plays for SA, an attacking match winning WK-Batsman at #7. 

Ashwin should be the lone spinner in the XI, because 2 spinners isn't going to work in SA for sure unless we play at Durban but even then it will be a risk. I believe Ashwin will do better than what he did in 2013, he has matured a lot and he's a match winning cricketer. He is a superior bowler to Jadeja as well. His batting will also be needed in SA just in case we have a collapse. Ashwin at #8 gives us a lot of batting depth and can help us post decent totals. 

I would like Bhuvi, Shami and Ishant to be the 3 leading pacers in SA. Bhuvi will be very dangerous with the new ball and I expect him to have a decent series on those SA pitches. Shami is Shami, he will be the first name on the team sheet for me and a lot of people in this group, no questions asked. Regarding Ishant, he is the spearhead of this team. He should play ahead of Yadav and most probably will. 

This is going to be an exciting series!  

Agree to disagree..Umesh should play along with Shami,choice is b/w Ishant and Bk for the 4th seamer spot.

[moniker]

Pant vs Saha shouldn't be about the batting. No amount of exciting hard hitting batting prowess should get you in the test team as a keeper if you aren't good behind the stumps.

In most of our previous away tours the sore point was keeping to the swinging and bouncing deliveries and catches being let off between the keeper and first slip. Saha seems to be a strange case where his keeping to fast bowlers seems to be better than keeping to spinners.

Unless there is evidence of Pant being a decent keeper he shouldn't be hurriedly thrust into an important away tour.