Selecting Kohli in 2008 cost me my job - Vengsarkar

[vvvslaxman]

Vengy is losing his mind i have to agree. This is a stretch. If we go back to our own forum. we probably had lot of people rooting for Badrinath in old threads as he was extremely consistent in the domestic.

[Trichromatic]

I guess ICF believes that since Badrinath was CSK player, he didn't deserve to play any match even after being best performer for 4-5 years. 

 

Those must have been good times, where nepotism and influence could get a proven perfomer couple of matches unlike current times where proven perfomers are dropped for flimsy reasons and failures are backed for being unknown reasons.

[vvvslaxman]

Vengy thought since it is about Kohli he might have some backing for this bizarre, illogical claim. But sad to see him pitting Dhoni against Kohli as the later completely trusts Dhoni while throwing Badri under the bus.  Not sure if he wants Kohli to get rid of Dhoni. 

[The Dark Horse]

56 minutes ago, Trichromatic said:

Yeah and he was just an average perfomer during that time. 

 

Season		Matches	Inns	Not Out	Runs	HS	Ave	100	50	Ct	St
2005-06	(India)	8	11	2	636	206*	70.66	2	3	6
2006	(Australia)	2	3	1	184	70*	92.00	0	3	4
2006-07	(India)	9	13	1	671	136	55.91	1	5	8
2007-08	(India)	12	17	2	990	200*	66.00	4	3	4
2007-08	(Kenya)	2	2	2	293	160*		2	0	1
2007-08	(Zimbabwe)	2	2	1	165	103*	165.00	1	1	0
2008-09	(India)	12	16	2	876	200	62.57	4	3	10
2009-10	(India)	10	14	0	800	250	57.14	3	4	7
2010-11	(India)	12	15	4	1226	195	111.45	5	5	16

 

5741 runs at avg of 73.6 in FC cricket. Number of tests played during this time - 2, scored 56 in 1 match where Steyn ripped apart Indian batting.

 

Nepotism can't be worse than this.

 

Let's ignore all this and ride the Dhoni bashing train.

 

But but he was from CSK

[Trichromatic]

58 minutes ago, The Dark Horse said:

But but he was from CSK

Thing is when everyone in Indian FC cricket is averaging 120+, just asking questions (and not forcing him to be selected) about someone who averaged 73 has to raise eyebrows.

[NameGoesHere]

Most cricket debates get interesting when there is conflict between statistics and selectors/ captain's judgment.   I think this is right up there in those terms. 

 

Badri had great stats and was making runs for fun in the domestic.  However, I saw him play both his Tests against SA, and while he made that 56, I have to say he wasn't convincing.  For one he had that habit of jumping out and prodding at balls, looked most clumsy.  Granted that it was against peak Steyn & co, though.

 

Should he have been given more chances?  I would say, yes.  But at the same time, based on the little I saw, I would question whether he'd set the cricket world on fire.

[Ankit_sharma03]

What was the need for this statement when rarely u see a captain n x-captain having great relationship in Indian cricket. Limelight missing thi....

Their will always be debate if x is better or y and noone knws who will turn out to be better. I myself never thought kohli will become this beast....its logical any capatin will trust a player who he has seen rather the unseen one and then badri had great FC stats.

Same ICF is crying why mayank is not selected after such a FC season. 

 

What matters is when dhoni knew he is my key player he backed him, selectors wanted to drop kohli from 3rd test and sehwag has made open statement how he n dhoni saved kohli's place. IF i remeber amarnath was the on tour selector and it was his idea to drop kohli ......and then he wanted to make the same guy captain in Odi series. 

 

N good vengsarkar went away he started to back mumbai player way more then needed, i remeber a certain jaffer getting many games then he deserved. 

[gakgupta]

Dilip was one of the best selectors we had from last 20 years....Wonderful talents were noticed and given a go at that time....

His selection was not about numbers and statistics...

He looked at personalities....

Anyone who watched the recent Duleep trophy knows that KK Ahmed has better chance to succeed than S. Kaul......But i am sure, Kaul will be given a go ...as he is in line

[sandeep]

11 hours ago, Vilander said:

what is bonda man - is that some derog for kannadiga. ? i dont care man.  i just have an intense dislike for politicking piece of craps..from anywhere, it suboptimises a system. What does this statement from chewt$%akar has as an outcome, Kohli and BCCI officials feel wronged by Dhoni ? and do what ? What could be the possible outcome for Srini he is already out of the picture. Its just a news grabber for chew#$Akar here  he is getting back at Srini for back room politics ? why mess around with Dhoni as well ?

If you have a problem for politics, why are you defending Srini Mama interfering with selection?  Its not even about the merits of a Kohli vs Badri, who was by your own admission, a limited player.  Its about Srini pushing for selection of a particular player, and making changes to the selection committee when he didn't get what he wanted.  That my friend, is politicking of the lowest order.  Which you claim to "dislike" but are in the odd position of defending loudly on this thread.

 

And I'm not of Marathi background, but your constant usage of 'kar' as some kind of epithet is not on.   You are better than that.  Let's keep the standards of the forum higher.   

[sandeep]

27 minutes ago, gakgupta said:

Dilip was one of the best selectors we had from last 20 years....Wonderful talents were noticed and given a go at that time....

His selection was not about numbers and statistics...

He looked at personalities....

Anyone who watched the recent Duleep trophy knows that KK Ahmed has better chance to succeed than S. Kaul......But i am sure, Kaul will be given a go ...as he is in line

IIRC, I read somewhere that Vengy was instrumental in pushing for a young Sachin Tendulkar to get opportunities with the Mumbai Ranji team as well.  

 

That's the difference between an MSK Prasad and a Vengy - former is dead set focused on making sure that "fair treatment" is given to Ranji stats accumulators and older players.  Which by itself is not a terrible approach.  

[G_B_]

nepotism....

 

 

[Number]

On a side note, I think not many chief selectors have traveled to watch emerging players tournament to get a better look on player's temperament, technique and playing style.

Edited March 9, 2018 by Number

[vvvslaxman]

Apart from Tendulkar all the other "kars" always bring up conspiracy theories lol  Manjrekar, Gavaskar, Vengsarkar (excluding Urmila matondkar)

[putrevus]

It is all about thinking, giving a upcoming and talented youngster over a proven domestic performer is one way of thinking and other way of thinking is letting youngster play one of two seasons on domestic cricket then selecting him while rewarding top performers in domestic cricket.Aussies did later especially when they were at their strongest.

 

There are downsides and upsides to both, Pant is prime example he was given debut a season too late in my book. Guys like Robin Singh who resurrected his career late . But I always prefer giving talented youngster a chance before a proven domestic performer.

[Vilander]

3 hours ago, sandeep said:

If you have a problem for politics, why are you defending Srini Mama interfering with selection?  Its not even about the merits of a Kohli vs Badri, who was by your own admission, a limited player.  Its about Srini pushing for selection of a particular player, and making changes to the selection committee when he didn't get what he wanted.  That my friend, is politicking of the lowest order.  Which you claim to "dislike" but are in the odd position of defending loudly on this thread.

 

And I'm not of Marathi background, but your constant usage of 'kar' as some kind of epithet is not on.   You are better than that.  Let's keep the standards of the forum higher.   

you should read my comments again, Srini is not being defended here. if Badri was averaging 75 in FC when he got selected and Kohli won the u19 world cup, is Dhoni to be blamed for selecting Badri over Kohli ? at that point in time ?

Do you think enabling a deserving player being selected is nepotism ? i say vengsarkar that gave this interview had malicious intentions when he kept Badri out of the 11. He was let go fairly and incidentally on different grounds,but now he just latched on to srini hate bandwagon to look like a hero. He has even gone to the extent of attempting to plant hate between Kohli/Dhoni for some personal gain. Calling Badri's selection based on his involvement in CSK and not based on his 75 avg in Indian FC gives a clear picture of how incompetent vengsarkar was as a selector and how malicious his mindset is, no wonder he lost that job may be he was very good with mumbai cricket so kept that job.

Anyways i dont think Srini was all bad to Indian cricket, atleast not as much as the other b# sashank manohar. Makes one wonder why do these Ch#$5s do all they do even if they have to sellout India, for position power ? how pathetic. Mumbai cricket community is not ok with any other region or state being at the helm of cricket they would create all this controversy even after the fact, its pretty evident a good weasel ecosystem, some of them wont mind harming India for personal gains.

Edited March 9, 2018 by Vilander

[Vilander]

3 hours ago, sandeep said:

a limited player

how was he a limited player averaging 75 in FC ? he was not found not to add value to Indian side and let go thats not to say he was not selected fairly, hell he even had a good inning in his first test. Some would say he was treated harshly. This is what i am point out ,  vengkar does not mind throwing Badri under the bus never looking at his record in that point in time. 

[Vilander]

4 hours ago, NameGoesHere said:

Most cricket debates get interesting when there is conflict between statistics and selectors/ captain's judgment.   I think this is right up there in those terms. 

 

Badri had great stats and was making runs for fun in the domestic.  However, I saw him play both his Tests against SA, and while he made that 56, I have to say he wasn't convincing.  For one he had that habit of jumping out and prodding at balls, looked most clumsy.  Granted that it was against peak Steyn & co, though.

 

Should he have been given more chances?  I would say, yes.  But at the same time, based on the little I saw, I would question whether he'd set the cricket world on fire.

He was selected fairly  and probably did ok to play a few more tests at the least, judgement call and did not play..well too bad for him but happens. 

 

But is it good enough to call his selection to the 11 based on CSK ? be straightforward.

[NameGoesHere]

14 minutes ago, Vilander said:

He was selected fairly  and probably did ok to play a few more tests at the least, judgement call and did not play..well too bad for him but happens. 

 

But is it good enough to call his selection to the 11 based on CSK ? be straightforward.

Generally my eyes glaze over at IPL based debates.  Frankly I even missed this part of the argument until you brought it up

 

One, I really don't really know (or care), because, Two, his stats clearly suggest he deserved a call up.

 

Edit: And if memory serves right I was eager to see him play because of reports of his outstanding domestic performances.

Edited March 9, 2018 by NameGoesHere

[sandeep]

27 minutes ago, Vilander said:

how was he a limited player averaging 75 in FC ? he was not found not to add value to Indian side and let go thats not to say he was not selected fairly, hell he even had a good inning in his first test. Some would say he was treated harshly. This is what i am point out ,  vengkar does not mind throwing Badri under the bus never looking at his record in that point in time. 

 

35 minutes ago, Vilander said:

you should read my comments again, Srini is not being defended here. if Badri was averaging 75 in FC when he got selected and Kohli won the u19 world cup, is Dhoni to be blamed for selecting Badri over Kohli ? at that point in time ?

Do you think enabling a deserving player being selected is nepotism ? i say vengsarkar that gave this interview had malicious intentions when he kept Badri out of the 11. He was let go fairly and incidentally on different grounds,but now he just latched on to srini hate bandwagon to look like a hero. He has even gone to the extent of attempting to plant hate between Kohli/Dhoni for some personal gain. Calling Badri's selection based on his involvement in CSK and not based on his 75 avg in Indian FC gives a clear picture of how incompetent vengsarkar was as a selector and how malicious his mindset is, no wonder he lost that job may be he was very good with mumbai cricket so kept that job.

Anyways i dont think Srini was all bad to Indian cricket, atleast not as much as the other b# sashank manohar. Makes one wonder why do these Ch#$5s do all they do even if they have to sellout India, for position power ? how pathetic. Mumbai cricket community is not ok with any other region or state being at the helm of cricket they would create all this controversy even after the fact, its pretty evident a good weasel ecosystem, some of them wont mind harming India for personal gains.

 

The question at hand is not even the merits of Kohli or Badri.  The question is, why should a BCCI official interfere in team selection, and replace selectors if he doesn't like the team selected?   

 

Everybody trumpeting domestic stats while making the case for Badri - there is a reason why Priyank Panchal with his domestic stats, is not rated higher than a Prithvi Shaw.  If selectors have to simply pick the players with the best stats, that's what they would do all the time.  But they don't.  And with good reason. 

 

And again, bottomline - issue is not about Badri or Kohli.  Its about a blatant violation by Srini in interfering in selection.  That is simply black and white.  And indefensible.   Attempting to indulge in whataboutism by dragging traitors like Manohar is Lahori logic.   You start by saying not defending Srini, and then go on to do exactly that.  I think you need to make up your mind on which one of those 2 you are trying to do here.

[Vilander]

18 minutes ago, sandeep said:

 

 

The question at hand is not even the merits of Kohli or Badri.  The question is, why should a BCCI official interfere in team selection, and replace selectors if he doesn't like the team selected?   

 

Everybody trumpeting domestic stats while making the case for Badri - there is a reason why Priyank Panchal with his domestic stats, is not rated higher than a Prithvi Shaw.  If selectors have to simply pick the players with the best stats, that's what they would do all the time.  But they don't.  And with good reason. 

 

And again, bottomline - issue is not about Badri or Kohli.  Its about a blatant violation by Srini in interfering in selection.  That is simply black and white.  And indefensible.   Attempting to indulge in whataboutism by dragging traitors like Manohar is Lahori logic.   You start by saying not defending Srini, and then go on to do exactly that.  I think you need to make up your mind on which one of those 2 you are trying to do here.

what is needed is you need to make up your mind about defending vengsarkar and his weaseling ways here. its not about badri, not about Kohli not about Dhoni not about srini..its definitely about che@#$ vengsarkar for sure.