CAB is not 'anti-muslim' but NRC is a problem and worthy of protesting against.

[coffee_rules]

Muslims are not included that is the protest for? Do they want persecuted Muslims back now? How about seculars in Pakistan? People like lame rod? Alleged atheists, ex-Muslims, blasphemy law victims? 

[Gollum]

38 minutes ago, speedheat said:

Ok that means ye hootiye Jamia ke students faltu mein timepass kar re hai.

Police should shoot those jihadis next time.

Not all Jamia students (not all are political by nature but can get easily swayed, hot blood and all that) but some are fighting for Calpihate aided by extrenal support (SDPI, PFI, various Jamaats, remnants of SIMI), saw their leaders and graffiti? In Urban Naxals, Tukde Tukde gang, Lemurians, Libbus, Rawalpindi etc they have found trustworthy allies...all Breaking India forces have joined hands to create chaos. 

Edited December 19, 2019 by Gollum

[sandeep]

1 hour ago, LordPrabhzy said:

Well if the general public like you and me and probably the rest of the parliament are clueless as to what exactly are provisions and exclusions in the nationwide NRC bill ( not the Assam one) how are violent protests taking place against the bill??

 

This is not a democratic protest against a government decision, its a violent instigation of a particular community by spreading lies and false propaganda which the opposition parties want to use to oust BJP in upcoming state elections and even in 2024. They couldnt win an election democratically but they are ready to sacrifice the harmony in the country for their political gain.

You are free to make assumptions and stereotype about a "particular community's" motives. Just as they are free to draw their conclusions based on numerous public statements made by Amit Shah and Modi during election rallies - where they spell out how they are going to use CAB in combination with NRC to identify and deport "termites".  

 

 

[sandeep]

46 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Are bhai, chinta mat kar. Nothing has been specified about pan-India NRC. When/if such an announcement comes we can discuss. 

 

NRC bas Assam mein laagoo hua tha, as per Assam accord (1985), Rajiv Gandhi had accepted NRC demand 35 years back and it was a burning political issue in that state for many decades. Nothing will happen without adequate planning and safeguards. More than one party will be involved there, state govts, judiciary (SC monitored Assam NRC), civil society etc. 

yeah don't worry, "trust the politicians".  

[sandeep]

1 minute ago, Gollum said:

Not all Jamia students but some are fighting for Calpihate aided by extrenal support (SDPI, PFI, various Jamaats, remnants of SIMI), saw their leaders and graffiti? In Urban Naxals, Tukde Tukde gang, Lemurians, Libbus, Rawalpindi etc they have found trustworthy allies...all Breaking India forces have joined hands to create chaos. 

Not all Hindus, but some are fighting for Hindu Rashtra aided by fanatical support, did you hear the words out of elected MP Pragya Thakur's mouth?  All these crazy fundoos are gathering strengths to unleash chaos.

 

See how cherry-picking can lead to silly logic justifying hatred?  

[Gollum]

10 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Not all Hindus, but some are fighting for Hindu Rashtra aided by fanatical support, did you hear the words out of elected MP Pragya Thakur's mouth?  All these crazy fundoos are gathering strengths to unleash chaos.

 

See how cherry-picking can lead to silly logic justifying hatred?  

LOL touched a raw nerve did I? Show me one post here where I have supported Pragya Thakur...if her likes unleash unprovoked riots I will have harsh things to say about them as well. Anyway world of difference between Hindutva and Islamic extremists, what will it take to make you see that? The most extremist minded Hindutva regime will still be more liberal/tolerant than the most liberal Islamic one. If your motive here is to discuss other posters rather than events, carry on. 

Edited December 19, 2019 by Gollum

[sandeep]

4 minutes ago, Gollum said:

LOL touched a raw nerve did I? Show me one post here where I have supported Pragya Thakur...if her likes unleash unprovoked riots I will have harsh things to say about them as well. Anyway world of difference between Hindutva and Islamic extremists, what will it take to make you see that? The most extremist minded Hindutva regime will still be more liberal/tolerant than the most liberal Islamic one. If your motive here is to discuss other posters rather than events, carry on. 

I'm not saying you are supporting that idiot.  I'm saying extreme outliers should not be used to represent entire communities.  That's the point I'm making - wasn't directed at you or any other individual poster.

[Gollum]

14 minutes ago, sandeep said:

yeah don't worry, "trust the politicians".  

An imperfect/farcical pan-India NRC exercise will anihilate BJP for eternity...it won't be Muslims vs rest, more like lower class vs privileged lot and without lower class support no political party can win a municipal poll. If they intend to do it, they will take all precautions and try not to piss off aam junta, their political future will be at stake once the green signal is given and methinks it will be "innocent until proven guilty" with multiple avenues to pass the test. If they manage to do it successfully, good. If they fail Congress will be voted in and they will undo everything, either way I don't see the point of fearmongering right now.

 

Besides things move at snail's pace here, Assam NRC which was conceptualized in the early 80s became reality last year, you know how stalling works in our govts/bureaucracy/judiciary. Lastly without support of state govts, NRC will be impossible...Kerala, Bengal and Punjab have said NO, BJP partner in Bihar (JDU) said NO, CAA should be the focus atm....at least to my simple mind this all India NRC idea seems almost as far-fetched as taking back POK, Shah will obviously be bombastic about these issues but we all know why he does that, why any politician goes overboard->theatricality. For instance irrespective of what he says about sending the Bangladeshis and Rohingyas back to their countries we all know no such thing will happen, that isn't how the world functions in 21st century. 

[LordPrabhzy]

30 minutes ago, sandeep said:

You are free to make assumptions and stereotype about a "particular community's" motives. Just as they are free to draw their conclusions based on numerous public statements made by Amit Shah and Modi during election rallies - where they spell out how they are going to use CAB in combination with NRC to identify and deport "termites".  

 

 

if by termites they mean ILLEGAL economic immigrants from ANY country REGARDLESS of their religion  and if they face no religious persecution then yes I fully support the NRC motive. Each country needs to have a strict and controlled immigration policy with a legal recourse for immigrants to apply for residency and citizenship, the judge of that is their skills and purpose rather than religion. You are trying to lump CAB with NRC but what you are failing to comprehend that if an illegal Bangladeshi immigrant is found and they are Hindu, and IF they cannot prove they and their family is being persecuted or killed ( because of their minority status) they WILL be deported  back to Bangladesh as much as a muslim illegal immigrant from there. The CAA is for any ethnic minorities from  3 Muslim majority countries who were persecuted and came to India BEFORE 2014.

 

Anyone is able to spell out anything in a rally.. so using this logic we should shut down AMU because they are chanting ' Hindutva ki kabr banegi' in their rallies as  that could be seen as inflammatory speech. But we live in a democracy, the reaction should be based on an official final policy/bill in parliament which has the final details of a law.. rather than what was said 6 months ago in a random rally. You cant go around rioting and damaging public property based on false information- i fully support shoot on sight in instances like this, regardless if they are a hindu or muslim rioter. (INB4 you call me a bigot)

[sandeep]

2 minutes ago, LordPrabhzy said:

if by termites they mean ILLEGAL economic immigrants from ANY country REGARDLESS of their religion  and if they face no religious persecution then yes I fully support the NRC motive

Sure.  NRC targets all illegals regardless of religions, but all illegals other than muslims are given CAA safety net.  See how that works?    

 

3 minutes ago, LordPrabhzy said:

Anyone is able to spell out anything in a rally.. so using this logic we should shut down AMU because they are chanting ' Hindutva ki kabr banegi' in their rallies as  that could be seen as inflammatory speech.

Firstly anyone saying inflammatory trash deserves to be called out and condemned.  Second - there is a whole lot of difference between protestors chanting, and the f*&^(king Home Minister of the Central Government of India saying things in a public rally.  The latter has the power to make those words count - his words carry a lot more weight and meaning.  You cannot equate the 2.  

 

5 minutes ago, LordPrabhzy said:

You cant go around rioting and damaging public property based on false information-

Fully agree.  BUT, in a democracy, right to protest ought to be respected.   BJP has rolled out Section 144 to ban protests all over the country - Ram Guha was just arrested - did he burn buses?  

[LordPrabhzy]

5 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Sure.  NRC targets all illegals regardless of religions, but all illegals other than muslims are given CAA safety net.  See how that works?    

 

Firstly anyone saying inflammatory trash deserves to be called out and condemned.  Second - there is a whole lot of difference between protestors chanting, and the f*&^(king Home Minister of the Central Government of India saying things in a public rally.  The latter has the power to make those words count - his words carry a lot more weight and meaning.  You cannot equate the 2.  

 

Fully agree.  BUT, in a democracy, right to protest ought to be respected.   BJP has rolled out Section 144 to ban protests all over the country - Ram Guha was just arrested - did he burn buses?  

No it automatically doesnt.. did you not read the rest of the paragraph?? Pick and chose bits is all what you can do seems like it. This statement is the false propaganda being used to fuel violence and you are propagating it.

 

Yes and I fully support the right to a PEACEFUL protest in a democracy. Section 144 has been put in place because criminal rioter elements have hijacked this democratic protest and have started to create chaos.. so to restore normalcy, certain rights have to be temporarily stopped for the time being. The SC has also said, they will not debate the plea on this Bill till the violence stops. Now if certain groups do not want to make use of the democracy and judiciary to listen to their voices, then im sorry, a firm hand is now what is needed.

[coffee_rules]

Listen to the three tweets and there is so much clarity. It a bawal macha rahe hain, khundak mein  because of 370 and Ram Mandir.

 

 

 

[mishra]

Sandeepji! Can you olease share link about pan India NRC principles and documentary evidence list?

Edited December 19, 2019 by mishra

[Vilander]

11 hours ago, Gollum said:

LOL touched a raw nerve did I? Show me one post here where I have supported Pragya Thakur...if her likes unleash unprovoked riots I will have harsh things to say about them as well. Anyway world of difference between Hindutva and Islamic extremists, what will it take to make you see that? The most extremist minded Hindutva regime will still be more liberal/tolerant than the most liberal Islamic one. If your motive here is to discuss other posters rather than events, carry on. 

I dislike any form of extremism. Bjp needs to tone down extremist elements.

[cowboysfan]

wTF is going on.both sides have lost their  mind.there is a thing called peaceful protests but we have forgotten  about it but the government  has gone overboard with their  response. people  will never forgive  BJP for this high handedness. killing people  for protesting is worse than even what China  is doing  I  Hong Kong. 

[coffee_rules]

9 minutes ago, cowboysfan said:

wTF is going on.both sides have lost their  mind.there is a thing called peaceful protests but we have forgotten  about it but the government  has gone overboard with their  response. people  will never forgive  BJP for this high handedness. killing people  for protesting is worse than even what China  is doing  I  Hong Kong. 

You have clearly missed these videos how rioters are targeting police. You expect police not to fire back in self defense?

 

 

 

[coffee_rules]

To all complaining about police brutality in Jamia or Lakhnav

 

 

 

[coffee_rules]

 

 

real images used here.

[cowboysfan]

this is *ed up beyond repair,why are they even violent protests? they cant achieve anything with burning down property and attacking police,Gandhi would be appalled by these kind of protests.

[sergio04]