IMO, the greatest pace bowler of all time

[MechEng]

8 hours ago, Gollum said:

Imagine McGrath vs Kohli, like 2014 Eng on loop. 

This is the gold standard of pace bowling. No pace, late swing or huge lateral movement, just subtle changes in line and length:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKpThWWgoM8

[Deleted_User_1]

My original comment was regarding test matches although Mcgrath had a fine record in ODI with some big performances on world's greatest stages. I do not give a phuck about tontee-tontee.

 

The only other choice in the replies I would entertain is Malcolm Marshall. I saw him as a kid at Eden Gardens in 78-79 India tour when he was raw (also me being so young (barely out of infancy , I do not even remember much). Then I saw him on TV and live in Eden Gardens during 83-84 tour and remember the havoc he created among Indian batsmen. In the first test at Kanpur, he basically manhandled the Indian line-up by generating steep bounce from just short of good length at pace. I wish there was clear video footage available so folks could understand what I am talking about. He embarrassed Gavaskar in the second innings who got out fending a rising delivery and the bat flew out of his hand to square leg. He had to fetch it on his way to the pavilion. The whole Indian team was scared of him. He forced Gavaskar to change his batting style to be more aggressive and bring on the hook and pull in the Delhi test (where he scored a century). I remember being in the stands for the Eden test when Gavaskar was out the first ball of the match. My Dad had to console a crying kid.  In fact, besides Gavaskar, no other Indian batsman was able to cope with him throughout the entire 6 test series.

 

Marshall had similar performances in other series and while he had frightening pace, bounce and movement, he did not have the nagging consistency of McGrath. Mcgrath bowled at top level throughout his career with very rare slumps in performance. You knew he would deliver for you. 2005 Ashes would have been won by Aus if McGrath did not get injured before the second test. He single handedly won the first test at Lords. I cannot think of any ATG batsman in his era that dominated him. In fact, you could say many were his bunnies. Even when his pace dropped he made up for it by nagging accuracy, seam movement and bounce. I cannot admire this guy enough. Now as a cricketer on the field he was a dik (because he had such a fierce mentality) mocking batsmen when getting out, sledging and getting upset when Sarwan dished back abuse, etc. He has performed well on all surfaces and under all conditions. Hard to say the same about all other ATGs. So it is still Mcgrath for me with Marshall a close second.

Edited March 12, 2020 by Audiophile

[Deleted_User_1]

Of all the ATG pace bowlers, I rate the Pak ones - Imran, Akram and Waqar the lowest because they grossly tampered with the ball (there is clear proof) and some of them may also have been involved in match fixing.

 

There is anecdotal evidence from the Indian players from late 70s and 80s when India played Pak in Pak several times. The ball would be doing nothing, then after a break, it would be talking  So clearly, these aussholes were tampering not only by themselves but also had the umpires involved. Chewtiya cheaters!!! 

[Vk1]

4 hours ago, kohli said:

 So kallis , dravid, laxman, sehwag, smith, ChandraPal, inzi, Yousuf, anwar ,andy flower was not a great batsman 

kallis, dravid yes..  McG is definitely a goat but in my view i rate steyn slightly higher due to circumstances

[Ankit_sharma03]

4 hours ago, lamellavig said:

What was so special about McGrath's bowling? I struggle to understand how he dominated even in Asia bowling at 130ks. Don't tell me about line and length, many bowlers have accurate line and length. I just think batsmen of that era paid too much respect to McGrath. He would have struggled bowling in this era. 

height n his wrist.....he use to get that extra bounce with the flick of his wrist and that also helped seam the ball both ways sharply . Plus he was very intelligent if there was chink in anyone game he wud exploit it. 

[rtmohanlal]

5 hours ago, kohli said:

Lot of fast bowler is better than ambrose in odi 

in  ODI econ gets more weightage .... Ambrose had 3.48 in the 90s decade.... on comparison Mcgrath had only 3.88 & Akram  3.89.  He had the <25 average & great longevity to go along with  it.

[rtmohanlal]

1 hour ago, Audiophile said:

Of all the ATG pace bowlers, I rate the Pak ones - Imran, Akram and Waqar the lowest because they grossly tampered with the ball (there is clear proof) and some of them may also have been involved in match fixing.

 

There is anecdotal evidence from the Indian players from late 70s and 80s when India played Pak in Pak several times. The ball would be doing nothing, then after a break, it would be talking  So clearly, these aussholes were tampering not only by themselves but also had the umpires involved. Chewtiya cheaters!!! 

well said .... a person believing in integrity & fair play  can never rate them higher, especially that shameless unethical  drug addict PM who played solely  in the pre multi camera days. Going by the punishment Steven Smith obtained, wonder what would have been the career graph of this unabashed cheater   had he played in the multi camera days...

[rkt.india]

7 hours ago, MechEng said:

This is the gold standard of pace bowling. No pace, late swing or huge lateral movement, just subtle changes in line and length:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKpThWWgoM8

This is what happens when you play the bowler, not the ball itself. McGrath's name enough to create nerves among the batsmen. Once you have that perception, even ordinary stuff gets you wickets but today cricket is a bit different. In this T20 era, bowlers have struggled develop that aura and perception.

[rkt.india]

18 hours ago, Gollum said:

Imagine McGrath vs Kohli, like 2014 Eng on loop. 

You are underestimating Kohli. With no swing like Anderson, Kohli will be all over McGrath.  The biggest thing about Kohli is he plays the ball, not the bowler.

[NameGoesHere]

I'm not sure if he was the ATG bowler.

 

But he's on the top of my list for a bowler who in a decade or less  is going to be questioned by nerds and amateur 'video analysts' on forums as 'over rated', 'harmless' and a 'dibbly dobbler' lucky because he would have been 'smashed today'..

[rkt.india]

7 minutes ago, NameGoesHere said:

I'm not sure if he was the ATG bowler.

 

But he's on the top of my list for a bowler who in a decade or less  is going to be questioned by nerds and amateur 'video analysts' on forums as 'over rated', 'harmless' and a 'dibbly dobbler' lucky because he would have been 'smashed today'..

Every great bowler would have got smashed today in this T20 era irrespective of whether he is dibbly dobbly or express. T20 doesn't spare anyone.

Edited March 11, 2020 by rkt.india

[MechEng]

8 hours ago, rtmohanlal said:

well said .... a person believing in integrity & fair play  can never rate them higher, especially that shameless unethical  drug addict PM who played solely  in the pre multi camera days. Going by the punishment Steven Smith obtained, wonder what would have been the career graph of this unabashed cheater   had he played in the multi camera days...

 

10 hours ago, Audiophile said:

Of all the ATG pace bowlers, I rate the Pak ones - Imran, Akram and Waqar the lowest because they grossly tampered with the ball (there is clear proof) and some of them may also have been involved in match fixing.

 

There is anecdotal evidence from the Indian players from late 70s and 80s when India played Pak in Pak several times. The ball would be doing nothing, then after a break, it would be talking  So clearly, these aussholes were tampering not only by themselves but also had the umpires involved. Chewtiya cheaters!!! 

Before you guys bash Pak bowlers any further:

 

 

 

[rkt.india]

4 minutes ago, MechEng said:

 

Before you guys bash Pak bowlers any further:

 

 

 

Batsmen those days without helmet were so scared to come on to front foot.

[MechEng]

11 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Batsmen those days without helmet were so scared to come on to front foot.

Too much pace. IK the politician is meh, IK the fast bowlers was seriously faassstt..

[rkt.india]

3 hours ago, MechEng said:

Too much pace. IK the politician is meh, IK the fast bowlers was seriously faassstt..

Nah, doesn't look that fast. 135-140ish

[Stan AF]

 

[rtmohanlal]

10 hours ago, MechEng said:

 

Before you guys bash Pak bowlers any further:

 

 

 

yeah .... here comes the irritating poorki logic....

accusation: ball tampering

reply: a  utube  video  of his bowling

 

superb sense of logic....

[Nikola]

[zen]

Early to mid 90s was a phase where Aus cricket was on the rise and WI on the decline, producing some of the most exciting test cricket. There was some amazing cricket due to likes Ambrose and Lara 

 

[zen]

22 minutes ago, Nikola said:

McGrath played a lot of tests. Many of the batsmen are subcon ones (struggle against bounce and/or slight movement) and top order batsmen from SEN who would face McGrath with the new ball in SENA ....  The best batsman on the list, Lara, avgs 41. 

Edited March 11, 2020 by zen