Mariyam Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 @BacktoCricaddict @FischerTal @Khotaand the other science/biology people here. My noob question: Why do we start by inoculating the senior citizens? For the most part, they are indoors. Thereby of all sections of the population, their propensity to catch the virus is the lowest. Shouldn't we instead inoculate the younger/ working people *first*? There is some research showing that younger people are asymptomatic carriers for a few days longer. Also if they are inoculated, they will not infect the elders at their place. By extension the elders are also safe.
coffee_rules Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 8 minutes ago, Mariyam said: @BacktoCricaddict @FischerTal @Khotaand the other science/biology people here. My noob question: Why do we start by inoculating the senior citizens? For the most part, they are indoors. Thereby of all sections of the population, their propensity to catch the virus is the lowest. Shouldn't we instead inoculate the younger/ working people *first*? There is some research showing that younger people are asymptomatic carriers for a few days longer. Also if they are inoculated, they will not infect the elders at their place. By extension the elders are also safe. Most of the dead are older people, the vaccination reduces the risk of hospitalization and mortality for the elderly by about 75% (esp in the 60-70 range). I am not a man of biology, but read it in our company newsletter. Hence, they are urging over 60 and people with exciting condtions like diabetes to be vaccinated before others to reduce the risk of death in them. BacktoCricaddict and Mariyam 2
BacktoCricaddict Posted March 1, 2021 Author Posted March 1, 2021 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Mariyam said: @BacktoCricaddict @FischerTal @Khotaand the other science/biology people here. My noob question: Why do we start by inoculating the senior citizens? For the most part, they are indoors. Thereby of all sections of the population, their propensity to catch the virus is the lowest. Shouldn't we instead inoculate the younger/ working people *first*? There is some research showing that younger people are asymptomatic carriers for a few days longer. Also if they are inoculated, they will not infect the elders at their place. By extension the elders are also safe. There is not a clear cut answer. Some countries (e.g., Indonesia) are vaccinating their essential, non-healthcare workers after healthcare workers. In my opinion, it comes down to 2 things: (1) Do we prioritize decreasing mortality or decreased transmissions? Even if the elderly are mostly staying indoors, if they get infected, they are likely to get very sick and pass away. Most societies, I think, are culturally inclined to protect the most vulnerable and as such, have chosen to prioritize decreasing mortality of elders. (2) Minimize burden on healthcare systems: Younger people getting infected don't land up in large numbers in the hospital and overburden the already overworked healthcare systems. There was and continues to be a great deal of debate about the ethical and pragmatic concerns surrounding this issue. Definitely not easy. Often these decisions are made by razor-thin margins, but we only see the final call. @coffee_rulesbeat me to the answer :-)!! Edited March 1, 2021 by BacktoCricaddict Clarke, coffee_rules, dial_100 and 1 other 4
Mariyam Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 9 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: Most of the dead are older people, the vaccination reduces the risk of hospitalization and mortality for the elderly by about 75% (esp in the 60-70 range). I am not a man of biology, but read it in our company newsletter. Hence, they are urging over 60 and people with exciting condtions like diabetes to be vaccinated before others to reduce the risk of death in them. Agreed that the mortality rates are higher in the elderly. However if the old are always at home and those stepping out ie the working age people, are vaccinated, how would the old catch the virus in the first place?
BacktoCricaddict Posted March 1, 2021 Author Posted March 1, 2021 Just now, Mariyam said: Agreed that the mortality rates are higher in the elderly. However if the old are always at home and those stepping out ie the working age people, are vaccinated, how would the old catch the virus in the first place? If 10 out 100 old people catch the infection (which is very possible especially in the USA where indoor transmission is very likely due to internal air circulation), 7 will end up in the hospital. If 50 out of 100 young people catch it by being out and about, may be 1 or 2 will end up in the hospital. Mariyam and coffee_rules 2
coffee_rules Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 5 minutes ago, Mariyam said: Agreed that the mortality rates are higher in the elderly. However if the old are always at home and those stepping out ie the working age people, are vaccinated, how would the old catch the virus in the first place? In US esp, a lot elderly are in nursing homes (elderly living) and or quarantined themselves, but among the dead mostly. Once contracted risk of hospitalization is more. In India, they mostly live with their kids and with those who go out. The chance of getting the disease and hospitalization is more. Don’t know a clear answer. but ask anti-vaccers like @Real McCoy or @Jimmy Cliff , they’d say the vaccine is a Big Pharma hoax. I don’t know why Amit Mota Bhai took it, he already had the disease, so would have developed anti-bodies, which is same as the vacc Mariyam 1
BacktoCricaddict Posted March 1, 2021 Author Posted March 1, 2021 On a related note, there is also an ethical debate about who counts as an essential worker. During lockdowns in many states in the US, restaurant workers, grocery store workers, delivery drivers (especially overworked during Covid) etc. were deemed "essential," which means their employer could require them to work in-person. But when it came time for the vaccine, they were not deemed essential enough to get the vaccine earlier than the non-essentials in their age-group. It is always the blue-collar, working-class, often racial minority population that gets the shaft. construction430, dial_100, G_B_ and 1 other 1 3
coffee_rules Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 5 minutes ago, BacktoCricaddict said: On a related note, there is also an ethical debate about who counts as an essential worker. During lockdowns in many states in the US, restaurant workers, grocery store workers, delivery drivers (especially overworked during Covid) etc. were deemed "essential," which means their employer could require them to work in-person. But when it came time for the vaccine, they were not deemed essential enough to get the vaccine earlier than the non-essentials in their age-group. It is always the blue-collar, working-class, often racial minority population that gets the shaft. I have a friend who works for Deloitte and is working for the Govt, works from home, was considered essential and got the pfizer one. It is so ad-hoc.
Jimmy Cliff Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 (edited) 24 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: In US esp, a lot elderly are in nursing homes (elderly living) and or quarantined themselves, but among the dead mostly. Once contracted risk of hospitalization is more. In India, they mostly live with their kids and with those who go out. The chance of getting the disease and hospitalization is more. Don’t know a clear answer. but ask anti-vaccers like @Real McCoy or @Jimmy Cliff , they’d say the vaccine is a Big Pharma hoax. I don’t know why Amit Mota Bhai took it, he already had the disease, so would have developed anti-bodies, which is same as the vacc I am neither an anti-vaxxer nor have I said the vaccine is a hoax. My stance is that as long as there is no data regarding medium to long term side effects for this vaccine, there is no way it should be mandatory. If people willingly want to be guinea pigs for experimental, hastily approved mRNA vaccines (more like "gene therapy" than vaccines) or the Astrazeneca vaccine with it's Eugenics links, that is their choice. Edited March 1, 2021 by Jimmy Cliff coffee_rules 1
coffee_rules Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 1 minute ago, Jimmy Cliff said: I am neither an anti-vaxxer nor have I said the vaccine is a hoax. My stance is that as long as their no data regarding medium to long term side effects for this vaccine, there is no way it should be mandatory. If people willingly want to be guinea pigs for experimental, hastily approved mRNA vaccines (more like "gene therapy" than vaccines) or the Astrazeneca vaccine with it's Eugenics links, that is their choice. Apologize, I had read your stance incorrectly. I am scared to volunteer too, but at some point, for the sake of the job, it might become mandatory. Holding off till then Jimmy Cliff 1
Jimmy Cliff Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 5 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: Apologize, I had read your stance incorrectly. I am scared to volunteer too, but at some point, for the sake of the job, it might become mandatory. Holding off till then No worries.
Real McCoy Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 42 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: In US esp, a lot elderly are in nursing homes (elderly living) and or quarantined themselves, but among the dead mostly. Once contracted risk of hospitalization is more. In India, they mostly live with their kids and with those who go out. The chance of getting the disease and hospitalization is more. Don’t know a clear answer. but ask anti-vaccers like @Real McCoy or @Jimmy Cliff , they’d say the vaccine is a Big Pharma hoax. I don’t know why Amit Mota Bhai took it, he already had the disease, so would have developed anti-bodies, which is same as the vacc In hospitals no matter which country there are, if some old person goes for a chest pain, they have to check for corona first, then and only then if they chose they will treat the chest pain. A lot of heart attacks may have already happened by the time the person has complained of chest pain. And when corona test is a pre-requisite to mainline treatment to the actual thing the patient is suffering from, more is the percentage that die out of heart attacks and other ailments but a covid related death certificate is given so that the hospital gets its funding money from the govt and the govt gets more "proof" that corona exists. I had an elderly relative who went for low pulse and the nieghborhood doctor who she used to go to and knows her on a first name basis called an ambulance to have her driven to the corona testing clinic. Mind you she didn't agree yet but this knobhead already called the ambulance and made her look like a corona case. Its after the influence of a highly influential relative that she managed to escape this ordeal and get her treatment from some other hospital. This knobhead is most likely a participant to the corona hoax and probably lured into it by some good ol' cash coffee_rules 1
Real McCoy Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 59 minutes ago, coffee_rules said: In US esp, a lot elderly are in nursing homes (elderly living) and or quarantined themselves, but among the dead mostly. Once contracted risk of hospitalization is more. In India, they mostly live with their kids and with those who go out. The chance of getting the disease and hospitalization is more. Don’t know a clear answer. but ask anti-vaccers like @Real McCoy or @Jimmy Cliff , they’d say the vaccine is a Big Pharma hoax. I don’t know why Amit Mota Bhai took it, he already had the disease, so would have developed anti-bodies, which is same as the vacc Consider this. Corona is supposed to be a highly contagious global epidemic right and those who contract it dies within a few weeks/months. In India, most people dont even wear masks properly (as though the mask is supposed to prevent the disease). Then they come home and be with the parents. If these people haven't got it after an year, that means they have already developed antibodies right (that is if the disease actually exists). With them saying this disease is in the vacc (that is the meaning of vaccines - to issue the disease and help the bodies create antibodies), that means the people who are acting like guinea pigs taking the vacc are injecting an actual new and foreign disease into their body and for sure its going to go south. And now they are saying the second dose should be delivered within 3 weeks. That means the body is still knocked out by an alien disease and they are giving an extra shot. It doesn't look good for old people and the young are not that far off. All govt leaders are fakers when it comes to global things like this. mota bhai is no exception. He may have received a placebo injection or made up the fact that he got one. nobody will know for sure. The people who are scared and taking this using mota as an example and probably Virat Kohli next are being used because of lack of knowledge about deception on a large scale. coffee_rules 1
coffee_rules Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 @Real McCoy Agree, the information is hardly managed well by most countries and it is cause for such concerns of monopoly by a few, But is hard to deny the potency of the virus and how quickly it spread across the world even more than a previous pandemic like H1N1 or eBola. Good or bad, vacc is the only solution to return to normalcy, economically and for the future generations. I have had close relatives getting it and recovered, one fatality at work. It was seriously scary to go to work, with vaccinations, we will more equipped to deal with such anxieties
Clarke Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 2 hours ago, Mariyam said: @BacktoCricaddict @FischerTal @Khotaand the other science/biology people here. My noob question: Why do we start by inoculating the senior citizens? For the most part, they are indoors. Thereby of all sections of the population, their propensity to catch the virus is the lowest. Shouldn't we instead inoculate the younger/ working people *first*? There is some research showing that younger people are asymptomatic carriers for a few days longer. Also if they are inoculated, they will not infect the elders at their place. By extension the elders are also safe. It's a secret plan to knock off the old ones first as part of population control Jimmy Cliff and velu 1 1
Jimmy Cliff Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 2 hours ago, Mariyam said: @BacktoCricaddict @FischerTal @Khotaand the other science/biology people here. My noob question: Why do we start by inoculating the senior citizens? For the most part, they are indoors. Thereby of all sections of the population, their propensity to catch the virus is the lowest. Shouldn't we instead inoculate the younger/ working people *first*? There is some research showing that younger people are asymptomatic carriers for a few days longer. Also if they are inoculated, they will not infect the elders at their place. By extension the elders are also safe. I don't think this is the case. You can still get infected and still be a spreader even after being vaccinated. Mariyam 1
Real McCoy Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 54 minutes ago, Jimmy Cliff said: I don't think this is the case. You can still get infected and still be a spreader even after being vaccinated. If you can still get infected and be a spreader, then why even take the vacc. Dumb check 101 Mariyam 1
coffee_rules Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 Just now, Real McCoy said: If you can still get infected and be a spreader, then why even take the vacc. Dumb check 101 you reduce your chances of hospitalization and death if vaccinated, otherwise if you get infected, you might be asymptomatic or have mild symptoms like a common cold.
Real McCoy Posted March 1, 2021 Posted March 1, 2021 1 hour ago, coffee_rules said: @Real McCoy Agree, the information is hardly managed well by most countries and it is cause for such concerns of monopoly by a few, But is hard to deny the potency of the virus and how quickly it spread across the world even more than a previous pandemic like H1N1 or eBola. Good or bad, vacc is the only solution to return to normalcy, economically and for the future generations. I have had close relatives getting it and recovered, one fatality at work. It was seriously scary to go to work, with vaccinations, we will more equipped to deal with such anxieties There is no actual evidence that this virus even exists. Even if it did, there is no logic that says this virus is more potent than the h1n1 or other bs virus. Do you remember when h1n1 was the in thing when everyone was told to be in panic and nobody got panicked. They learnt that the propaganda wasn't effective enough and came back after 10 years to do it more effectively. That's how it became "potent". The only thing that is potent about this virus is the propaganda at all levels this time. If you watch immadon prime or netfux, you'll see pandemic entertainment in the form of movies. its all over the news. in sports, they put the mask on just for show. I watch several sports its not just crikcet. Tennis, football where people are sitting close to each other, not wearing masks, eating outside food, tennis players were served balls by ball kids but told to get their own towels All I'm seeing is a vacc pusher. are you paid to do this or you're literally sh1t scared. Get a hold of yourself man. My flat opposite to mine has some old people that supposedly got this virus. Its more likely that they went with some condition and the hospital authorities would have told them to check for corona and they did. Most of the tests give false positives. That must be the case. So now that they dont have it, how did it go away all of a sudden. This killer disease goes away after quarantining? So why this vacc when everyone can just quarantine for a while and get better. This makes zero sense
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