Shardul Thakur or Deepak Chahar - who would you play in LOI team as an all rounder?

[AKane]

I hope someone advises Shardul to up his pace to 140 kph. At his height with the low pace, his bowling will not be effective in any form of the game. The crack in the pitch he exploited in T2 was a gift which will not happen again.

 

He is a bowler first - he has forgotten it. He has to focus on his bowling speed - else he is done.

[Vijy]

2 minutes ago, AKane said:

I hope someone advises Shardul to up his pace to 140 kph. At his height with the low pace, his bowling will not be effective in any form of the game. The crack in the pitch he exploited in T2 was a gift which will not happen again.

 

He is a bowler first - he has forgotten it. He has to focus on his bowling speed - else he is done.

he can't up it with his current fitness. even 135 kph seems difficult

[AKane]

10 minutes ago, Vijy said:

he can't up it with his current fitness. even 135 kph seems difficult

Yes and he is 30 - if he gets dropped at 31.... it gets harder to come back fitter. But he has to realize what he has to do fitness wise.... else it is over for him in the national team.

 

I think he can do it but will he? With this guy Dravid and the kind of advice he will get..... even today Dravid was just talking about Shardul and Chahar's batting. As @express bowling  I think said .... "That is not their job". Yes - their job is bowling, taking wickets and restricting runs. But will Dravid let them do that.... Dravid did talk about wicket taking options in middle overs but wrt spinners mostly.

Edited January 24, 2022 by AKane

[Vijy]

24 minutes ago, AKane said:

Yes and he is 30 - if he gets dropped at 31.... it gets harder to come back fitter. But he has to realize what he has to do fitness wise.... else it is over for him in the national team.

 

I think he can do it but will he? With this guy Dravid and the kind of advice he will get..... even today Dravid was just talking about Shardul and Chahar's batting. As @express bowling  I think said .... "That is not their job". Yes - their job is bowling, taking wickets and restricting runs. But will Dravid let them do that.... Dravid did talk about wicket taking options in middle overs but wrt spinners mostly.

dravid is entirely built around defensive trundlers who bat

[express bowling]

2 hours ago, AKane said:

Yes and he is 30 - if he gets dropped at 31.... it gets harder to come back fitter. But he has to realize what he has to do fitness wise.... else it is over for him in the national team.

 

I think he can do it but will he? With this guy Dravid and the kind of advice he will get..... even today Dravid was just talking about Shardul and Chahar's batting. As @express bowling  I think said .... "That is not their job". Yes - their job is bowling, taking wickets and restricting runs. But will Dravid let them do that.... Dravid did talk about wicket taking options in middle overs but wrt spinners mostly.

 

Hardik Pandya's supposed bowling ability led us to drop a strike pacer like Shami in so many critical ODIs. And we could not win most of them. 

 

It will now happen with Chahar and Shardul. They will play that odd cameo and end up playing together. And sh!t up the pace bowling department with their floaty military medium stuff. 

 

If they are so good with the bat, let both of them play in the top 7. And leave the bowling to proper pacers. 

[express bowling]

2 hours ago, Vijy said:

he can't up it with his current fitness. even 135 kph seems difficult

 

That means he has to up his fitness, isn't it ?

 

Looks like Rakheem Cornwall is becoming his fitness idol.

[deepdynamo]

 Deepak Chahar provides more value than Shardul at No. 8/9 since he can bowl with new ball and actually has a nack of picking early wicket ( unlike bumrah). Shardul bowling is more miss than hit.

 

But, I will play both of them in next T20 world cup since its in Australia.

 

 

 

 

[prudent_kreeda]

13 hours ago, bahadur_billa said:

Chahar looks better than Shardul in first powerplay. But both can't bowl in death overs. Both should be playing all three ODIs vs West Indies. 

 

In that case our pace bowling will be very toothless with 2 trundlers. Only 1 can make it to the eleven. 

[Clarke]

Prolly everyone noticed by now, two things we have in abundance, at least in categorizing:

 

Openers: Rohit Dhawan Rahul already open, and potentials: Gill Shaw Mayank and even others we hear on the forum

 

5th bowler: Thakur Chahar Jadeja Sundar Hardik and some others tried like Jayant 

 

Tells us we're missing core areas like middle order batsmen and most of bowling other than Bumrah & Shami, other than the fact that they're categorized as 5th bowler since they're not doing well enough as main bowler and have some batting to fill in.

[express bowling]

22 minutes ago, Clarke said:

 

5th bowler: Thakur Chahar Jadeja Sundar Hardik and some others tried like Jayant 

 

Tells us we're missing core areas like middle order batsmen and most of bowling other than Bumrah & Shami, other than the fact that they're categorized as 5th bowler since they're not doing well enough as main bowler and have some batting to fill in.

 

 

Problem is that, we are often playing 5th bowlers as 3rd and 4th bowlers.

[express bowling]

50 minutes ago, prudent_kreeda said:

 

In that case our pace bowling will be very toothless with 2 trundlers. Only 1 can make it to the eleven. 

 

 

Exactly !

 

Maximum 1 trundler.

 

Even there, it would nice if we can get a big hitter spinner or a proper pacer like Hangargekar at No.8. And play 3 proper strike bowlers after that.

Edited January 24, 2022 by express bowling

[ShoonyaSifar]

40 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

 

Problem is that, we are often playing 5th bowlers as 3rd and 4th bowlers.

Our main bowlers haven't been any better, that's why. Bumrah looks a pale shadow of himself, no yorkers, finding it difficult to get any lift, drifting too much on the pads. Less said about the spinners the better.

 

The new coaching set up seem to love slower balls (didn't see many knuckle balls introduced by Bharat Arun). If the trend continues better to play both Thakur and Chahar, will not do any worse than the main bowlers and will extend our batting

[Adamant]

1 hour ago, express bowling said:

 

 

Exactly !

 

Maximum 1 trundler.

 

Even there, it would nice if we can get a big hitter spinner or a proper pacer like Hangargekar at No.8. And play 3 proper strike bowlers after that.

I gave it a thought and only way we can have a good bowling attack and balanced team is by playing two spin allrounders and 3 proper pacers which you said yesterday. 

 

I mean spin stocks are already down in dumps, so let's not even pretend that we have a good spinner and just carry on with whatever darters we get if they can score some runs down the order. 

[express bowling]

6 minutes ago, Adamant said:

I gave it a thought and only way we can have a good bowling attack and balanced team is by playing two spin allrounders and 3 proper pacers which you said yesterday. 

 

I mean spin stocks are already down in dumps, so let's not even pretend that we have a good spinner and just carry on with whatever darters we get if they can score some runs down the order. 

 

I agree.

[Jay]

1 hour ago, express bowling said:

 

 

Exactly !

 

Maximum 1 trundler.

 

Even there, it would nice if we can get a big hitter spinner or a proper pacer like Hangargekar at No.8. And play 3 proper strike bowlers after that.

That's why I want mavi or hangeraker to be groomed quickly for number 8 or 9 spot. 

[express bowling]

47 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Our main bowlers haven't been any better, that's why. Bumrah looks a pale shadow of himself, no yorkers, finding it difficult to get any lift, drifting too much on the pads. Less said about the spinners the better.

 

The new coaching set up seem to love slower balls (didn't see many knuckle balls introduced by Bharat Arun). If the trend continues better to play both Thakur and Chahar, will not do any worse than the main bowlers and will extend our batting

 

The situation has come to this because we have not looked beyond Bumrah, Bhuvi and sometimes Shami and Deepak as strike bowlers. 

 

I want us to try Prasidh and Siraj in ODIs and Siraj, Avesh and Umran in T20Is as the specialist pacers ... give them atleast 10 games and see whether they look like wicket taking strike bowlers.

 

I doubt we will win much if we play Deepak, Shardul and Bumrah / Bhuvi as pacers. 

[anish2tweet]

In that case, among the two I will pick Deepak in LOIs. But honestly don't want either.

Dude, it is not about pace only in LOIs. If they can bowl 5 overs each and do some finishing work down the order, the job is done right? They are much better in bowling than V.Iyer

Sent from my CPH1819 using Tapatalk

[express bowling]

16 minutes ago, anish2tweet said:

. If they can bowl 5 overs each and do some finishing work down the order, the job is done right? They are much better in bowling than V.Iyer
 

 

If they are bowling 5 overs each then 4 other bowlers are needed ... which means both have to bat in the top 7. 

 

[ShoonyaSifar]

49 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

The situation has come to this because we have not looked beyond Bumrah, Bhuvi and sometimes Shami and Deepak as strike bowlers. 

 

I want us to try Prasidh and Siraj in ODIs and Siraj, Avesh and Umran in T20Is as the specialist pacers ... give them atleast 10 games and see whether they look like wicket taking strike bowlers.

 

I doubt we will win much if we play Deepak, Shardul and Bumrah / Bhuvi as pacers. 

if only these two had stepped up when we had KulCha still doing well. Would have meant lesser pressure on the bowlers to score runs with batting upto no. 8. 

 

If we have to pick bowlers bowling 130-132 kmph or slower, we should pick between Shardul, Chahar and Harshal. In fact, Shardul can bowl 135-140 (like he used to 2 years back before he put on some weight) if he gets fitter and can play as the 2nd pacer. 

[Jay]

2 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

The situation has come to this because we have not looked beyond Bumrah, Bhuvi and sometimes Shami and Deepak as strike bowlers. 

 

I want us to try Prasidh and Siraj in ODIs and Siraj, Avesh and Umran in T20Is as the specialist pacers ... give them atleast 10 games and see whether they look like wicket taking strike bowlers.

 

I doubt we will win much if we play Deepak, Shardul and Bumrah / Bhuvi as pacers. 

Problem is our 3rd pacer has to be able to bat. Bumrah is at best a 12 run man vs pace in odi. 

 

Shami and siraj are just sloggers vs genuine pace and spin. 

Prasidh can't bat. 

 

The issue is thakur and chahar are more like 4th and 5th bowling options. 3rd one has to be a genuine pacer who can bat or is a wicket taker. 

 

Chennai superkings style team may work but ideally one of our 3 premier bowlers need to learn how to bat. 

 

Look at aussies; hazlewood, starc and Cummins. Cummins can hold the bat at 9. Starc can sort of slog a bit in odi. 

 

England? Wood can bat and he comes in at 9. Then you have Archer who can bat at 10. Lastly willey is no slouch either. Insane depth in batting. 

 

S Africa. Weak tail like us but imo better. 

Rabada at 9 can hold the bat and took a bit. Averages 17 ffs. Nortje and probably shamsi are weak batsmen. 

 

But they have depth till 9 too. 

 

Prime bhuvi would have been ok at 9 as he can bat. Current one? No. We need hangerakr or mavi.

 

Also let's not forget Kiwis. Lockie and boult can't bar obviously. Southee can at 9. Or jammu at 9. 

 

We are the only top side (not either dravid selections) without a number 9 premier bowler who can bat and possesses an average of above 14. Ridiculous.