Gower versus Dravid

[rkt.india]

2 hours ago, zen said:

Like the overuse of logical fallacies on this thread (An example of how not to make a point): 

 

• Gower would not make it to my 1st Eng 11. As if that matters and has any relation to his comparison with Dravid, who would not make it too if he played for Eng (and when Dravid too would not make it to many folks Ind AT11)
• Gower was not a regular #3. Irrelevant to his skills and his ability to be picked to play at #3  ...  England fans chose him to bat at #3 in the recent 1,000 test poll 
• X, y, z England players are rated above Gower (which can be debated) as if that counts versus Dravid, who would not be rated too (and as if Dravid is rated above many Indian batsmen)
• and many more ... 

 

Dravid would be #3 in every Indian AT XI.

[zen]

13 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

That's the point you are missing with Gower. Sena batsmen's real test is in SC. They are born and brought up playing pace.

 

 

Top order (#1-3) is required to play pace and swing well as conditions in most countries are similar esp. in SENA

 

Only India & SL have those spin friendly pitches (many of which can even be considered as doctored. Note swing friendly is not doctoring a pitch but leaving it unprepared can be). 

 

Key concern with Gooch is getting exposed by Warne in SENA. 

 

 

12 minutes ago, rkt.india said:

Dravid would be #3 in every Indian AT XI.

 

I am sure you must have done a survey and created a comprehensive database on every Indian AT 11  

 

 

Edited January 31, 2022 by zen

[diga]

1 minute ago, zen said:

 

 

Top order (#1-3) is required to play pace and swing well as conditions in most countries are similar esp. in SENA

 

Only India & SL have those spin friendly pitches (many of which can even be considered as doctored. Note swing friendly is not doctoring a pitch but leaving it unprepared can be). 

 

 

 

I am sure you must have done a survey and created a database on that  

Pujara wont be there in every X1 if that helps 

[zen]

Just now, diga said:

Pujara wont be there in every X1 if that helps 

 

That's fine ... 

[ComfortFood]

2 hours ago, rkt.india said:

Dravid would be #3 in every Indian AT XI.

Every Sane person’s AT xi

Defntly there are some low iq guys using “fitlers” to call a basic batter like PUJARA the goat 

 

[Adamant]

8 hours ago, zen said:

Like the overuse of logical fallacies on this thread (An example of how not to make a point): 

 

• Gower would not make it to my 1st Eng 11. As if that matters and has any relation to his comparison with Dravid, who would not make it too if he played for Eng (and when Dravid too would not make it to many folks Ind AT11)
• Gower was not a regular #3. Irrelevant to his skills and his ability to be picked to play at #3  ...  England fans chose him to bat at #3 in the recent 1,000 test poll 
• X, y, z England players are rated above Gower (which can be debated) as if that counts versus Dravid, who would not be rated too (and as if Dravid is rated above many Indian batsmen)
• and many more ... 

 

I get it, you don't really have a good mathematical background, so you aren't able to analyse reasonings like those. 

I understand, it's not everyone's cup of tea. 

I will take out some time today or tomorrow to explain it in layman's terms. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

if Statsguru filters do not prove your point, go onto a dope level tangent and use things like add 10% due to his SENA performance (data vs sentiments)..only to realise there was only ENA during Gower's time! 

[Majestic]

David Gower is comparable to VVS Laxman and Damien Martyn. Rahul Dravid is a couple of level ahead.

 

Again, I don't need to do anything to come to this conclusion. No stats, no methodology required. 

[zen]

2 hours ago, Adamant said:

I get it, you don't really have a good mathematical background, so you aren't able to analyse reasonings like those. 

I understand, it's not everyone's cup of tea. 

I will take out some time today or tomorrow to explain it in layman's terms. 

Keep pan galla level talks to yourself 

 

Not into spoon feeding but first understand the point of the post you quoted duh which is to pick a player without writing unnecessarily against the other player! 
 

Edited January 31, 2022 by zen

[sage]

Looks like someone has far too much free time

[Vijy]

On 1/30/2022 at 7:37 PM, zen said:

Like the overuse of logical fallacies on this thread (An example of how not to make a point): 

 

• Gower would not make it to my 1st Eng 11. As if that matters and has any relation to his comparison with Dravid, who would not make it too if he played for Eng (and when Dravid too would not make it to many folks Ind AT11)
• Gower was not a regular #3. Irrelevant to his skills and his ability to be picked to play at #3  ...  England fans chose him to bat at #3 in the recent 1,000 test poll 
• X, y, z England players are rated above Gower (which can be debated) as if that counts versus Dravid, who would not be rated too (and as if Dravid is rated above many Indian batsmen)
• and many more ... 

 

In Gower's case, it is fine to discuss the no. 3 position since he has at least played some tests at No. 3. In general, however, one cannot speak about a regular No.5 player opening and vice-versa since the skill sets are different, irrespective of any innate ability. Just wanted to point that out.

[zen]

3 minutes ago, Vijy said:

In Gower's case, it is fine to discuss the no. 3 position since he has at least played some tests at No. 3. In general, however, one cannot speak about a regular No.5 player opening and vice-versa since the skill sets are different, irrespective of any innate ability. Just wanted to point that out.

Gower is a very talented cricketer and has played at 3-5. IIRC, has 30 or more tests (and over 2k runs) at each of those positions. He can play both at 3 and 5. 
 

As many used to say - “last to come to practise, first to go”, so someone who was confident about his abilities … Also a cricketer who probably played to enjoy every moment of cricket 

Edited February 2, 2022 by zen

[Vijy]

Just now, zen said:

Gower is a very talented cricketer and has played at 3-5. IIRC, has 30 or more tests at each positions. He can play both at 3 and 5. 
 

As they used to say - “last to come to practise, first to go” … A cricketer who probably enjoyed every moment of cricket and played to challenge himself 

Gower had the better hair. This should be taken into consideration as well. Golden Boy Gower.

[zen]

Just now, Vijy said:

Gower had the better hair. This should be taken into consideration as well. Golden Boy Gower.

And a big fan following too across countries … On ICF, most will automatically pitch for Dravid but Gower probably has more universal appeal 

[Vijy]

Just now, zen said:

And a big fan following too across countries … On ICF, most will automatically pitch for Dravid but Gower probably has more universal appeal 

I doubt if Dravid is getting that many plaudits even on ICF. there has been a lot of (justified) criticism about his coaching

[zen]

Just now, Vijy said:

I doubt if Dravid is getting that many plaudits even on ICF. there has been a lot of (justified) criticism about his coaching

Dravid criticism for his coaching is not on yet IMO as he is starting out and was a reluctant coach (thrust into the role by BCCI) 

 

On ICF, you have fanboys show up esp. when a less discussed Gower is on 

 

If you do Ponting versus Dravid, there is nothing to speak. Ponting, Kallis, etc., are like Kryptonite for blind desi fanboys