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Adamant

Is this the end of India's legacy of producing the best LOI batting lineups in the world.

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From the start of the millennium India has produced one of the best LOI batting lineups, filled with ATG batsman(Sachin, Rohit, kohli, Dhoni), great finishers(Dhoni,Raina,Kohli) and some borderline great batsman( Yuvi, Raina, Sehwag, Ganguly, Gambhir).
The current Indian team (with Rohit and Kohli in decline mode) does'nt look even a bit like our batting lineup of the past two decades.

There was a time when we fielded this lineup -No. of centuries in bracket
1. Sachin (49)
2.Sehwag (15)
3.Dravid (12)
4.Ganguly (22)
5.Yuvraj (14)
6. Kaif/Dhoni (10)
7. I Pathan

All of them were match winners and had the ability to win a match on their own

Then we transitioned into

1. Sehwag (15)
2. Gambhir (11)
3.Kohli (43)
4.Yuvraj (14)
5.Raina (5)
6.Dhoni (10)
7. Y Pathan (2)
 

All of them were technically great and were renowned match winners.

Then came:
1. Dhawan (17)
2. Rohit (29)
3.Kohli (43)
4.Rahane (3)
5.Raina (5)
6.Dhoni (10)
7.Nodody

Now we are suddenly going towards an era where our entire crop of young players don't have even a single hundred, many of them show promise but they are so inconsistent that our team is always fragile. 

Just imagine the team after Kohli and Rohit are done.
It could be the first time in Indian ODI history where in a lineup not even a single player has a century, this definitely tells us all we need to know about the emerging brand of our youngsters who ate talented but have the temperament and concentration ability of a fly.
I think Ipl is a big factor behind all this, the younger players are not as hungry as they used to be as IPL has already made them more popular than the likes of Pujara, Vihari,Vijay, Saha who have toiled a lot in the premier format.

Indian Cricket needs new Heroes.

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2 minutes ago, Adamant said:

From the start of the millennium India has produced one of the best LOI batting lineups, filled with ATG batsman(Sachin, Rohit, kohli, Dhoni), great finishers(Dhoni,Raina,Kohli) and some borderline great batsman( Yuvi, Raina, Sehwag, Ganguly, Gambhir).
The current Indian team (with Rohit and Kohli in decline mode) does'nt look even a bit like our batting lineup of the past two decades.

There was a time when we fielded this lineup -No. of centuries in bracket
1. Sachin (49)
2.Sehwag (15)
3.Dravid (12)
4.Ganguly (22)
5.Yuvraj (14)
6. Kaif/Dhoni (10)
7. I Pathan

All of them were match winners and had the ability to win a match on their own

Then we transitioned into

1. Sehwag (15)
2. Gambhir (11)
3.Kohli (43)
4.Yuvraj (14)
5.Raina (5)
6.Dhoni (10)
7. Y Pathan (2)
 

All of them were technically great and were renowned match winners.

Then came:
1. Dhawan (17)
2. Rohit (29)
3.Kohli (43)
4.Rahane (3)
5.Raina (5)
6.Dhoni (10)
7.Nodody

Now we are suddenly going towards an era where our entire crop of young players don't have even a single hundred, many of them show promise but they are so inconsistent that our team is always fragile. 

Just imagine the team after Kohli and Rohit are done.
It could be the first time in Indian ODI history where in a lineup not even a single player has a century, this definitely tells us all we need to know about the emerging brand of our youngsters who ate talented but have the temperament and concentration ability of a fly.
I think Ipl is a big factor behind all this, the younger players are not as hungry as they used to be as IPL has already made them more popular than the likes of Pujara, Vihari,Vijay, Saha who have toiled a lot in the premier format.

Indian Cricket needs new Heroes.

no need to imagine

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India is now getting hammnered in  bilaterals  vs SA, the same SA was destroyed 4-1 the last time we visited them.

We need a new batsman who is hungry for runs and records( Sachin,Kohli, Rohit), so that other players can look at him , the new brand of cricketers are just getting excited by a few sixes, they have no leader to look up to.

I say that we need someone in the mould of Babar Azam, yes he has his limitations, but the guy can bat, our youngsters can learn a lot from him.

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It is news to me that Ind had best batting line up (interesting to see views of fans in Ind & Pak, who would probably put its  bowling as best) :hmmm:

 

Game has evolved where T20 have influenced batting with a focus on making an impact 

 

 


 

Edited by zen
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1 minute ago, zen said:

It is news to me that Ind had best batting line up (interesting to see views of fans in Ind & Pak) :hmmm:



Game has evolved where T20 have influenced batting with a focus on making an impact 

 

 


 

How did that work in these two t20is?

Yes the game is more focused on impact nowadays, but believe me centuries and 50s have a lot of significance in this era, especially in LOIS.
A quick 30 does'nt really solve it if it's not being supported by a couple of 50s or an 80.

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In T20s, we never had a batting legacy for a start. Yuvraj had a fantastic T20 world cup and clutch performances from others won us the first trophy and then Kohli single handedly made us look like a team to beat in t20s but we never really had any batting legacy in T20s.

 

In ODIs, we did had several in past and we are doing fine now also, aren't we? Rohit, Kohli, Rahul, Pant, S Iyer, Suryakumar Yadav, Shaw, Gill, kungfu Pandya, Kishan, Ruturaj, Jaiswal the list goes on.

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4 minutes ago, zen said:

It is news to me that Ind had best batting line up (interesting to see views of fans in Ind & Pak) :hmmm:

I should have said one of the best, I know the aussie lineup of the noughties was better and the English lineup since 2018 was better but still we have been numero uno for quite some duration in this millenium

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Just now, Majestic said:

In T20s, we never had a batting legacy for a start. Yuvraj had a fantastic T20 world cup and clutch performances from others won us the first trophy and then Kohli single handedly made us look like a team to beat in t20s but we never really had any batting legacy in T20s.

 

In ODIs, we did had several in past and we are doing fine now also, aren't we? Rohit, Kohli, Rahul, Pant, S Iyer, Suryakumar Yadav, Shaw, Gill, kungfu Pandya, Kishan, Ruturaj, Jaiswal the list goes on.

All of them are nobodies in ODIS.

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24 minutes ago, Adamant said:


Then came:
1. Dhawan (17)
2. Rohit (29)
3.Kohli (43)
4.Rahane (3)
5.Raina (5)
6.Dhoni (10)
7.Nodody

Now we are suddenly going towards an era where our entire crop of young players don't have even a single hundred, many of them show promise but they are so inconsistent that our team is always fragile. 

Just imagine the team after Kohli and Rohit are done.
It could be the first time in Indian ODI history where in a lineup not even a single player has a century, this definitely tells us all we need to know about the emerging brand of our youngsters who ate talented but have the temperament and concentration ability of a fly.
I think Ipl is a big factor behind all this, the younger players are not as hungry as they used to be as IPL has already made them more popular than the likes of Pujara, Vihari,Vijay, Saha who have toiled a lot in the premier format.

Indian Cricket needs new Heroes.

 

BATTING   R B M 4s 6s SR
Rohit Sharma  run out (Miller) 22 24 40 2 0 91.66
Shikhar Dhawan  lbw b Morris 11 12 19 2 0 91.66
Virat Kohli  run out (Morris/†de Villiers) 1 1 3 0 0 100.00
Suresh Raina  c Amla b Imran Tahir 22 24 46 3 0 91.66
Ambati Rayudu  b Rabada 0 2 4 0 0 0.00
MS Dhoni (c)† c †de Villiers b Morkel 5 8 20 0 0 62.50
Axar Patel  c du Plessis b Morkel 9 12 18 0 0 75.00
Harbhajan Singh  b Imran Tahir 0 1 1 0 0 0.00
Ravichandran Ashwin  b Morris 11 15 24 1 0 73.33
Bhuvneshwar Kumar  b Morkel 0 2 1 0 0 0.00
Mohit Sharma  not out 0 4 9 0 0 0.00
Extras (lb 1, nb 1, w 9) 11  
TOTAL 17.2 Ov (RR: 5.30, 97 Mts) 92
 
 

 

 

LAst time that legendary batting lineup played on same ground against same opposition minus nortje. 

All out 92, atleast we reached 148 today 

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Just now, Adamant said:

How did that work in these two t20is?

Yes the game is more focused on impact nowadays, but believe me centuries and 50s have a lot of significance in this era, especially in LOIS.
A quick 30 does'nt really solve it if it's not being supported by a couple of 50s or an 80.


It is SR and ability to play per the situation that makes an impact … a 30 off 15 can be match winning over a 80 off 70 … a 80 off 40 can be impactful versus a 35 off 30 … a 50 off 40 can be impactful in a low scoring game

 

The individual score is not important. Kohli has scored many 50s at a low SR in conditions where a high SR was needed, losing his team games 

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1.  The OP has quoted ODI centuries and we are playing a T20I series.

 

T20Is should have its own specialists, who may or may not be good in ODIs 

 

2. In T20Is we need players with high SR and good enough average for T20Is. We need need impact players who can hit under pressure. Century scoring ability is not that important here.

 

3.  Most of these batters are at the beggining of their LOI careers and how van we compare their number of centuries with retired veterans with careers spanning 15 to 24 years  !!

Edited by express bowling
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27 minutes ago, express bowling said:

1.  The OP has quoted ODI centuries and we are playing a T20I series.

 

T20Is should have its own specialists, who may or may not be good in ODIs 

 

2. In T20Is we need players with high SR and good enough average for T20Is. We need need impact players who can hit under pressure. Century scoring ability is not that important here.

 

3.  Most of these batters are at the beggining of their LOI careers and how van we compare their number of centuries with retired veterans with careers spanning 15 to 24 years  !!

Although I have disagreed with OP on many occasions, I do think our LOI batting is quite poor. And the same goes for our Test batting - one of the worst lineups in the past 2 years.

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1 hour ago, Adamant said:

From the start of the millennium India has produced one of the best LOI batting lineups, filled with ATG batsman(Sachin, Rohit, kohli, Dhoni), great finishers(Dhoni,Raina,Kohli) and some borderline great batsman( Yuvi, Raina, Sehwag, Ganguly, Gambhir).
The current Indian team (with Rohit and Kohli in decline mode) does'nt look even a bit like our batting lineup of the past two decades.

There was a time when we fielded this lineup -No. of centuries in bracket
1. Sachin (49)
2.Sehwag (15)
3.Dravid (12)
4.Ganguly (22)
5.Yuvraj (14)
6. Kaif/Dhoni (10)
7. I Pathan

All of them were match winners and had the ability to win a match on their own

Then we transitioned into

1. Sehwag (15)
2. Gambhir (11)
3.Kohli (43)
4.Yuvraj (14)
5.Raina (5)
6.Dhoni (10)
7. Y Pathan (2)
 

All of them were technically great and were renowned match winners.

Then came:
1. Dhawan (17)
2. Rohit (29)
3.Kohli (43)
4.Rahane (3)
5.Raina (5)
6.Dhoni (10)
7.Nodody

Now we are suddenly going towards an era where our entire crop of young players don't have even a single hundred, many of them show promise but they are so inconsistent that our team is always fragile. 

Just imagine the team after Kohli and Rohit are done.
It could be the first time in Indian ODI history where in a lineup not even a single player has a century, this definitely tells us all we need to know about the emerging brand of our youngsters who ate talented but have the temperament and concentration ability of a fly.
I think Ipl is a big factor behind all this, the younger players are not as hungry as they used to be as IPL has already made them more popular than the likes of Pujara, Vihari,Vijay, Saha who have toiled a lot in the premier format.

Indian Cricket needs new Heroes.

Which entire crop are you talking Bout?

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1 hour ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

 

BATTING   R B M 4s 6s SR
Rohit Sharma  run out (Miller) 22 24 40 2 0 91.66
Shikhar Dhawan  lbw b Morris 11 12 19 2 0 91.66
Virat Kohli  run out (Morris/†de Villiers) 1 1 3 0 0 100.00
Suresh Raina  c Amla b Imran Tahir 22 24 46 3 0 91.66
Ambati Rayudu  b Rabada 0 2 4 0 0 0.00
MS Dhoni (c)† c †de Villiers b Morkel 5 8 20 0 0 62.50
Axar Patel  c du Plessis b Morkel 9 12 18 0 0 75.00
Harbhajan Singh  b Imran Tahir 0 1 1 0 0 0.00
Ravichandran Ashwin  b Morris 11 15 24 1 0 73.33
Bhuvneshwar Kumar  b Morkel 0 2 1 0 0 0.00
Mohit Sharma  not out 0 4 9 0 0 0.00
Extras (lb 1, nb 1, w 9) 11  
TOTAL 17.2 Ov (RR: 5.30, 97 Mts) 92
 
 

 

 

LAst time that legendary batting lineup played on same ground against same opposition minus nortje. 

All out 92, atleast we reached 148 today 

Strawman argument bro. 

I am not talking about one offs, also I am talking about LOIs not just t20s. 

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The current lineup is probably the worst lineup that India has fielded in history. So boring and clueless. None of them inspire any confidence. I dont watch IPL so I dont rate any cricketer based on IPL performances but seems to me most of the players in the side dont belong at the international level. As always, selectors and fans in general getting carried away with mickey mouse IPL and rating a player based on that.

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45 minutes ago, Vijy said:

Although I have disagreed with OP on many occasions, I do think our LOI batting is quite poor. And the same goes for our Test batting - one of the worst lineups in the past 2 years.

 

 

That maybe so, but we have to evaluate them on different parameters for T20Is ( compared to ODIs or tests )  to arrive at this conclusion. 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, express bowling said:

 

 

That maybe so, but we have to evaluate them on different parameters for T20Is ( compared to ODIs or tests )  to arrive at this conclusion. 

 

 

yes, diff ball games. but I don't see any promising batters in any format who will set the game alight. lots of promise and talent for sure, but not much delivery. to take the example of Tests (not T20s), gill has underperformed, shaw has poor fitness and consistency, sarfaraz doesn't get a chance, sundar is perennially injured, and so on. bunch of underperformers. the last time the batting was this bad was 1970s, not even 1980s and 1990s.

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