Gautam Gambhir, chief curator clash at The Oval

[lemsip]

9 minutes ago, express bowling said:

My bigger concern is whether we were denied access to the pitch for inspection. That is definitely not the norm in any country.

 

I don't think it is possible that India were denied access nor is anyone actually claiming that. There are clear ICC regulations allowing both teams access to the pitch for visual  inspection on the days before the match. They just have to do under the groundsman's guidance as he is responsible for the state of the pitch and the ground. ( https://i.imgci.com/link_to_database/ABOUT_CRICKET/ICC_1998-99/TEST_MATCH_PLAYING_CONDITIONS.html)

Here is a summary   - the groundsman is clearly the one in charge.

 

• Before the Toss (and leading up to it):

  • Inspection by Captains: The Ground Authority is required to grant suitable facilities for captains to inspect the pitch before the nomination of their players and the toss. This implies a level of access in the hours leading up to the game.

  • Captain and Team Coach Access: Prior to the start of play on any day (which would include the days leading up to the match), only the captain and team coach may walk on the pitch to assess its condition. Spiked footwear is not permitted.

  • No Ball Bouncing or Striking: Captains, umpires, and groundsmen must cooperate to ensure that, prior to the start of any day's play, no one bounces a ball on the pitch or strikes it with a bat to assess its condition or for any other reason, or causes damage to the pitch in any other way.

     

     

• During Preparation (General):

  • Ground Authority Responsibility: All mowings carried out before the match are the sole responsibility of the Ground Authority.

  • Artificial Drying: Prior to the scheduled time for the toss, the artificial drying of the pitch and outfield is at the discretion of the Ground Authority.

In essence, while the grounds staff are responsible for the pitch's preparation, opposing captains and coaches are allowed to inspect the pitch, usually without spiked footwear, to assess its condition in the lead-up to the match. However, they are strictly prohibited from interfering with the pitch's condition through actions like bouncing balls or striking it with a bat. The focus is on observation rather than active testing or alteration

 

[adi B]

1 minute ago, Lord said:

Curator was wrong but its GG's classist jibe that is being talked about. Its wrong and there is no back it just because hes Indian

 

There are better way to handle these things

Not with the English ,absolutely not !

Some of the Biggest Scums on the planet,especially how they treated our fellow Indians/Ancestors for so many years.

I can't ignore/Forget my History, sorry!

[lemsip]

5 minutes ago, adi B said:

Not with the English ,absolutely not !

Some of the Biggest Scums on the planet,especially how they treated our fellow Indians/Ancestors for so many years.

I can't ignore/Forget my History, sorry!

OK so how does Gambhir getting into  shouting and ranting mode at the groundsman in public view help the team's chances  in any way to win the game of cricket they are playing on Thursday ?

[lemsip]

19 minutes ago, IndianRenegade said:

dude, don't insult everyone's intelligence. there was a whole stadium behind him. No one cornered him or blocked him. He weas free to walk away any moment he chose, if in fact if saw the video, he did walk away at one point.

He was indeed cornered in the groundsman's area at the Oval which is his place of work. A more savvy person would have walked away and not even started engaging. Lots of Indian players and ex-players do exactly this on many occasions in such situations and refuse to engage. They do that because they have media training or exposure that prepares them to avoid situations that they are not equipped to handle. 

[kepler37b]

17 minutes ago, Lord said:

Curator was wrong but its GG's classist jibe that is being talked about. Its wrong and there is no back it just because hes Indian

 

There are better way to handle these things

Bro argued like a Thar owner.

 

"Teri aukaat kyaa hein..."

[IndianRenegade]

27 minutes ago, lemsip said:

I don't think it is possible that India were denied access nor is anyone actually claiming that.

 

Except that is what is explicity being claimed. Here it is from the very arctile you quoted earlier. 

 

 

Quote

Kotak later said they felt "awkward" at being asked to stay a certain distance from the pitch despite not wearing spikes.

 

"When some of us coaches went to see the wicket, a member of the groundstaff said stay away at least 2.5 metres, which was a little surprising," Kotak said. "Because it is the pitch, the match is starting day after, it will be a five-day Test, and we're standing in our joggers, so we felt a little awkward."

 

Kotak did not expand on the exchange between Gambhir and Fortis. "(We were) just looking at the wicket, with rubber spikes, day after there's a Test match there, there's nothing wrong (with that). Curators also need to understand the people they are talking to, they are highly skilled and intelligent. For example, if you go on the ground now where we practised, you won't even see that any bowler in the outfield would have marked with his spikes. That all comes from the head coach. We try and see this ground also doesn't get damaged."

 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/gambhir-involved-in-verbal-altercation-with-surrey-groundsman-ahead-of-oval-test-1497235

 

  

8 minutes ago, lemsip said:

He was indeed cornered in the groundsman's area at the Oval which is his place of work. A more savvy person would have walked away and not even started engaging. Lots of Indian players and ex-players do exactly this on many occasions in such situations and refuse to engage. They do that because they have media training or exposure that prepares them to avoid situations that they are not equipped to handle. 

considering you claimed the NO ONE CLAIMED access was being refused to the pitch when it was their in the very article youquoted, I have no illusions of convincing you on this point.

Edited July 29, 2025 by IndianRenegade

[ShoonyaSifar]

Well done Gautam Gambhir for calling out what clearly looks like a racist bully and giving him exactly what he deserved.

 

As for the Indian media nowp reporting that this same guy similarly harassed the Indian women’s team at The Oval without a single word from the team management or the BCCI, that’s just pathetic. Makes Gambhir's immediate unapologetic reaction, irrespective of the language used, even more important and necessary. We can’t keep sitting silent while a racist groundsman dishes out disrespect like it’s his right.

 

To the usual suspects here on ICF still nitpicking Gambhir’s reaction (mostly because you're panicking that this might actually boost his case as a coach despite his poor Test record so far), drop the bias for once and try backing an Indian who stood his ground and called out a racist clown for what he is.

[lemsip]

3 minutes ago, IndianRenegade said:

Except that is what is explicity being claimed. Here it is from the very arctile you quoted earlier. 

 

It says "some of us coaches went to the see the wicket". Usually only the captain and head coach are the ones who are allowed close access. If the groundsman was asking a group of 4 or 5 coaches ( the captain wasn't even there today) to keep a distance, they could have calmly clarified and worked out a solution rather than let it become an innecessarily inflammed argument culminating in "teri kya aukat hai groundsman" etc If he was being unreasonable they could have gone to the match referee behind the scenes and sorted it out.

The bottom line is that the rules require the access to be granted for inspection but it has to be controlled by the groundsman. So picking a public fight with him a day before the test is completely counterproductive. 

[IndianRenegade]

42 minutes ago, lemsip said:

Most people living around me wouldn't even be aware there is a cricket series going on with India nor name any England players. England women winning the Euros in football is by far the biggest story here at the moment. No one really cares about the Surrey groundsman vs Gambhir and it is not going to get anywhere near the coverage it will ge in India.

its okay to not follow the rules in cricket because the Eglish don't care, but GG is wrong because he said "youre just a groundsman"! must be intresting to hold both these positions!

[ShoonyaSifar]

11 minutes ago, lemsip said:

He was indeed cornered in the groundsman's area at the Oval which is his place of work. A more savvy person would have walked away and not even started engaging. Lots of Indian players and ex-players do exactly this on many occasions in such situations and refuse to engage. They do that because they have media training or exposure that prepares them to avoid situations that they are not equipped to handle. 

Just because it’s the groundsman’s workplace doesn’t give the clown a free pass to piss on the Indian coaching staff and players as he pleases.

 

Imagine the level of stupidity. As per our batting coach Sitanshu Kotak, the groundsman and his team accused the visiting team of trying to push grass from the center practice wickets to the main square!! That’s how clueless and petty this racist clown is.

 

And let’s not pretend this is a one-off. Going by the reports of his similar behaviour with Indian women's team earlier, the guy clearly has a pattern of bullying and racist behaviour and should be properly investigated for it.

[Suhaan]

10 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Well done Gautam Gambhir for calling out what clearly looks like a racist bully and giving him exactly what he deserved.

 

As for the Indian media nowp reporting that this same guy similarly harassed the Indian women’s team at The Oval without a single word from the team management or the BCCI, that’s just pathetic. Makes Gambhir's immediate unapologetic reaction, irrespective of the language used, even more important and necessary. We can’t keep sitting silent while a racist groundsman dishes out disrespect like it’s his right.

 

To the usual suspects here on ICF still nitpicking Gambhir’s reaction (mostly because you're panicking that this might actually boost his case as a coach despite his poor Test record so far), drop the bias for once and try backing an Indian who stood his ground and called out a racist clown for what he is.

Long time

Welcome back

[lemsip]

1 minute ago, IndianRenegade said:

its okay to not follow the rules in cricket because the Eglish don't care, but GG is wrong because he said "youre just a groundsman"! must be intresting to hold both these positions!

The only difference is that in the press conference India's compaint was that the groundmen was rude and that is why Gambhir lost his rag. I will save the outrage about rules  till I see an official statement from the Indian team or bcci saying they were denied access to the pitch according to the rules. You have assumed that England are not following rules but if this is really so they will have made a formal complaint to the ICC to require the host county to address that. Let's see if this happens. I have posted the regulations above. From them, it seems the groundsman has a lot of influence over how to control access to the pitch for inspection.

Bottom line India getting into this argument is not going to be a productive use of their preparation time. Most of the team including the captain was not even there today.  If necessary they can save all this discussion until after the match and series has finished. Neither the groundsman nor the ground will change so right now the most important thing they can do is too focus on beating England on the field.

On the second point, I don't think any person in a leadership role denigrating anyone else however unpleasant because they work in a perceived less worthy profession compared to them is an admirable quality. 

[DeepSpace]

3 hours ago, Lord said:

Pathetic classist stuff from GG. Even if groundsman was wrong, that is not a way to handle it. 

 

I wonder how he worked as MP or in dressing room now where people are 'just analyst', 'just masseur' etc

100%. Regardless of what was said, that is a crass way of responding. Basically translated in Hindi he said "Tu naukar hain bhenchod, yaad rakhna. Hame mat sikha kya karna, kya nahin karna, bhonsrike! Apni aukaat mein raho, madarchod!!! Classist all the way.

Edited July 29, 2025 by DeepSpace

[nitinbwj]

In angrezon ki *****. Accha huya.  Fuking hate these Eng idiots.

[ShoonyaSifar]

4 minutes ago, Suhaan said:

Long time

Welcome back

Thank you. Hope you have been well. I swear I thought about the fast bowling support brigade of ICF and the hilarious reactions when I saw Kamboj bowling his millitary medium pies 

 

Had lost interest in cricket. Reached that stage where 24 hours feel too short with work and other priorities taking over. But this young batting team’s superb performance has pulled me back in. Let's see how long this stint lasts.

[lemsip]

 The groundsman is not going to change so you can fight all you want with him but all this is creating is a complete distraction. The right answer is to beat England on the field not get sucked into pointless public arguments with groundstaff one day before the test starts. India can always file a complaint after the test but right now this is not a productive use of the TM's time. They need to focus on selection which they screwed up in the last test

[IndianRenegade]

30 minutes ago, lemsip said:

It says "some of us coaches went to the see the wicket". Usually only the captain and head coach are the ones who are allowed close access. If the groundsman was asking a group of 4 or 5 coaches ( the captain wasn't even there today) to keep a distance, they could have calmly clarified and worked out a solution...

 

here are the facts:

1. the rules book you quote is from ICC_1998-99  playing conditions. What does the latest playing conditions say? 

 

Quote

6.3 Selection and preparation

Before the match, the Ground Authority shall be responsible for the selection and preparation of the pitch. During the match, the umpires shall control its use and maintenance.

6.3.1 The Ground Authority shall ensure that during the period prior to the start of play and during intervals, the pitch area shall be roped off so as to prevent unauthorised access. (The pitch area shall include an area at least 2 metres beyond the rectangle made by the crease markings at both ends of the pitch).

6.3.2 The fourth umpire shall ensure that, prior to the start of play and during any intervals, only authorised staff, the ICC match officials, players, team coaches and authorised television personnel shall be allowed access to the pitch area.

Such access shall be subject to the following limitations:

6.3.2.1 Only captains and team coaches may walk on the actual playing surface of the pitch area (outside of the crease markings).

6.3.2.2 Access to the pitch area by television personnel shall be restricted to one camera crew (including one or two television commentators) of the official licensed television broadcaster(s) (but not news crews).

6.3.2.3 No spiked footwear shall be permitted.

6.3.2.4 No one shall be permitted to bounce a ball on the pitch, strike it with a bat or cause damage to the pitch in any other way.

6.3.2.5 Access shall not interfere with pitch preparation.

6.3.3 In the event of any dispute, the ICC Match Referee will rule and his ruling will be final.

https://www.icc-cricket.com/about/cricket/rules-and-regulations/playing-conditions

 

it says team coaches not just captain & head coach. Even the rule book you quopte doesn't tmandate the captain should be there, so whats the relevance of him not being there?

so was it just a coincidence that you happened upon a dated rulebook that would make it look like the Indian team was wrong? considering you have been claiming the Indian team didn't even claim they were being refused access till now, I am not so sure.

 

30 minutes ago, lemsip said:

 it become an innecessarily inflammed argument culminating in "teri kya aukat hai groundsman" etc If he was being unreasonable they could have gone to the match referee behind the scenes and sorted it out.

The bottom line is that the rules require the access to be granted for inspection but it has to be controlled by the groundsman. So picking a public fight with him a day before the test is completely counterproductive. 

well it defenitely could have been handled better, no doubt. But the point is one can't keep the focus on what Gambhir did alone ignoring the context, the context being Indian team being refused access to the pitch against the rules.

Edited July 29, 2025 by IndianRenegade

[goose]

33 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

Well done Gautam Gambhir for calling out what clearly looks like a racist bully and giving him exactly what he deserved.

 

As for the Indian media nowp reporting that this same guy similarly harassed the Indian women’s team at The Oval without a single word from the team management or the BCCI, that’s just pathetic. Makes Gambhir's immediate unapologetic reaction, irrespective of the language used, even more important and necessary. We can’t keep sitting silent while a racist groundsman dishes out disrespect like it’s his right.

 

To the usual suspects here on ICF still nitpicking Gambhir’s reaction (mostly because you're panicking that this might actually boost his case as a coach despite his poor Test record so far), drop the bias for once and try backing an Indian who stood his ground and called out a racist clown for what he is.

what’s the evidence the curator was racist?

[IndianRenegade]

8 minutes ago, lemsip said:

The only difference is that in the press conference India's compaint was that the groundmen was rude and that is why Gambhir lost his rag. I will save the outrage about rules  till I see an official statement from the Indian team or bcci saying they were denied access to the pitch according to the rules. You have assumed that England are not following rules but if this is really so they will have made a formal complaint to the ICC to require the host county to address that. Let's see if this happens. I have posted the regulations above. From them, it seems the groundsman has a lot of influence over how to control access to the pitch for inspection.

Bottom line India getting into this argument is not going to be a productive use of their preparation time. Most of the team including the captain was not even there today.  If necessary they can save all this discussion until after the match and series has finished. Neither the groundsman nor the ground will change so right now the most important thing they can do is too focus on beating England on the field.

On the second point, I don't think any person in a leadership role denigrating anyone else however unpleasant because they work in a perceived less worthy profession compared to them is an admirable quality. 

Keep moving the goal posts until you hit gold!

 

1st nothing happened, if something happened it was GG's fault 

then no one claimed they were refused access

if they claimed access was refused then they will need make an official statement with formal complaint.

 

yet the english curator has made no official complaint on GG & others, but you will give him the benifit of doubt. And the rregulation you are using to justify his actions is old as brown sepoy syndrome. its from 1999, try to keep up.

[BacktoCricaddict]

12 minutes ago, ShoonyaSifar said:

ut this young batting team’s superb performance has pulled me back in.

It's the Moth-to-flame phenomenon. Happened to me many years ago. I just accepted it.