From Gungho Batting TO middle order batting even worse than AFG.... How did this happen ?????????

[DGBOSS]

Once we were the best batting line up in the world. We were known for our Batting. Teams feared our Batting !!!!!!!

Today we have one of the worst (if not the worst) middle order and lower middle order batting in the world. We cannot even chae half decent targets with this batting. The MO is so bad that unless a top order batsman scores a big 100 we wont even get to 250.

 

Our Bowling has improved vastly but at what expense......!!!!!!! The batting has gone miles down !!!!!!!

 

Was this bad selection...bad execution or plain Not proper talent in the IPL era - these folkes play for the stands ?????

 

[Malcolm Merlyn]

If you back third rate players like DK Shankar Jadhav etc in the team, the result will be this only.

[goose]

I’m not sure today is the day to criticise the middle to lower order. They almost pulled it off. We lost because we were 5-3. How many sides come back from that in a WC semi-final chase? 

[maniac]

19 minutes ago, goose said:

I’m not sure today is the day to criticise the middle to lower order. They almost pulled it off. We lost because we were 5-3. How many sides come back from that in a WC semi-final chase? 

Almost pulled off in the sense chasing a subpar total and failing . Can you imagine had Nzl got 300?

 

Also define middle order? Our 7 and 8 had a partnership and it was unexpected from Jadeja and Dhoni as usual played a pointless knock in the end. 

Edited July 10, 2019 by maniac

[R!TTER]

Oldie+Brat match made in hell

[DGBOSS]

1 minute ago, goose said:

I’m not sure today is the day to criticise the middle to lower order. They almost pulled it off. We lost because we were 5-3. How many sides come back from that in a WC semi-final chase? 

Way I see it...the MO had a chance to save and they failed. All credit to Ravindra Jadeja but in all honesty it was too much for him really. The Karthiks and Pants and Pandyas shud have played more responsibly.

 

WHy is Pant at No 4? He might have 100 in tests but he is still a hack. Pandya isnt a specialist Batter yet in mould of Maxwell leave alone Ben Stokes. Karthik well not even sure what he was doing in the team.

 

Is this the MO the selectors banked on ? Positions that once UV, Raina occupied is held by Karthik, Pant. 

 

Looks simply Bad Team selection to me !!!!!!!!!

[bowl_out]

11 minutes ago, goose said:

I’m not sure today is the day to criticise the middle to lower order. They almost pulled it off. We lost because we were 5-3. How many sides come back from that in a WC semi-final chase? 

Top 3 pulled it off in 8 matches in the league stage..

The one match that they don't do well is when you expect the middle order to cover up for them... Blaming the top 3 again today is nonsense.. Then why have a middle order at all? Play top 3 and all bowlers after that.

[goose]

are we finally seeing the folly in TOLERATING a hack just because he MIGHT be the next coming of Kapil Dev?

[goose]

9 minutes ago, bowl_out said:

Top 3 pulled it off in 8 matches in the league stage..

The one match that they don't do well is when you expect the middle order to cover up for them... Blaming the top 3 again today is nonsense.. Then why have a middle order at all? Play top 3 and all bowlers after that.

just saying even a very good middle order would have struggled. this wasn't just a bad start is was an utter disaster.

Edited July 10, 2019 by goose

[vayuu1]

35 minutes ago, DGBOSS said:

Once we were the best batting line up in the world. We were known for our Batting. Teams feared our Batting !!!!!!!

Today we have one of the worst (if not the worst) middle order and lower middle order batting in the world. We cannot even chae half decent targets with this batting. The MO is so bad that unless a top order batsman scores a big 100 we wont even get to 250.

 

Our Bowling has improved vastly but at what expense......!!!!!!! The batting has gone miles down !!!!!!!

 

Was this bad selection...bad execution or plain Not proper talent in the IPL era - these folkes play for the stands ?????

 

Problem is ttfs and a timid captain and management, when coach prefers  youth over ttfs, don't try to  develop players gives absurd reason this is bound to happen, dhoni has been on constant decline since 2014 ,should have been dropped after 2015 ,should have been dumped after 2016,should have been booted after 2017 but none of this happened, instead of grooming Shaw, iyer, Gill, pant,kishan,aggarwal,we played  ttfs like hahane, jadhav, the grandpa yuvi, Raina, rayudu, dk and shankar, no efforts were made to develop  fast bowlers other then those selected, picked Deepak, kaul, unadgrunt, thakurs and sirajs while saini, avesh, rajpoot were busy getting wickets, selectors, coach laying down to captain, captain laying down to Tony, so ye to hona hi tha. 

 

[vijay50]

37 minutes ago, goose said:

I’m not sure today is the day to criticise the middle to lower order. They almost pulled it off. We lost because we were 5-3. How many sides come back from that in a WC semi-final chase? 

Aravinda De Silva walked in at 1 run for 2 wickets and mastered the greatest chase in knock out in 1996 wC.

[vijay50]

16 minutes ago, vayuu1 said:

Problem is ttfs and a timid captain and management, when coach prefers  youth over ttfs, don't try to  develop players gives absurd reason this is bound to happen, dhoni has been on constant decline since 2014 ,should have been dropped after 2015 ,should have been dumped after 2016,should have been booted after 2017 but none of this happened, instead of grooming Shaw, iyer, Gill, pant,kishan,aggarwal,we played  ttfs like hahane, jadhav, the grandpa yuvi, Raina, rayudu, dk and shankar, no efforts were made to develop  fast bowlers other then those selected, picked Deepak, kaul, unadgrunt, thakurs and sirajs while saini, avesh, rajpoot were busy getting wickets, selectors, coach laying down to captain, captain laying down to Tony, so ye to hona hi tha. 

 

Where do TTFs come from ? India A. As long as they come from that less chance for youngsters like Shaw, gill to play.

[vayuu1]

2 minutes ago, vijay50 said:

Where do TTFs come from ? India A. As long as they come from that less chance for youngsters like Shaw, gill to play.

Nope, dk didn't come from India A, Tony certainly didn't, regarding jadhav and Shankar selectors preferred experience over fearlessness and that is the problem. 

[sandeep]

56 minutes ago, DGBOSS said:

Way I see it...the MO had a chance to save and they failed. All credit to Ravindra Jadeja but in all honesty it was too much for him really. The Karthiks and Pants and Pandyas shud have played more responsibly.

 

WHy is Pant at No 4? He might have 100 in tests but he is still a hack. Pandya isnt a specialist Batter yet in mould of Maxwell leave alone Ben Stokes. Karthik well not even sure what he was doing in the team.

 

Is this the MO the selectors banked on ? Positions that once UV, Raina occupied is held by Karthik, Pant. 

 

Looks simply Bad Team selection to me !!!!!!!!!

I have no problem if you want to send Pandya and Pant in at #4 and #5.  But if you want them to do the job for the team in WC semi-final, how about giving them proper opportunities to bat in those situations in the 2 years ahead of the WC?   

 

But no, let's play musical chairs at those slots with Rayudu, Yuvi, DK, Dhoni, etc etc, and then at the last second, throw the young ones into the cauldron and have guys like @goose "pan" Pandya for playing an attacking shot against a spinner.  Something that is admittedly risky, but something he has a high degree of success with.  

 

Rohit and Kohli failed - they have earned a pass.  But the rest of the 'batsmen' haven't and 2 of them - KLPD and Karthik got out to soft dismissals which reflected their lack of mental fortitude.  The latter, king of warm-ups, has demonstrated it for years.  And unfortunately, KL Rahul, our most promising young batsman since a young Rohit burst onto the scene, is showing signs of walking the same path.  

 

If anybody is to blame for the loss - its the team management - they failed to use the last 2 years to groom proper personnel - in spite of the absolute wealth of player prospects that India has.  And holding Dhoni back, while asking stroke-makers like Pant and Pandya to absorb the early pressure and hold themselves back, ended up costing us the game.  

[coffee_rules]

Blaming it all on KLPD . very convenient. Especially when we have a top order Rohit, Dhawan and Kohli failing big time in crunch games, KOs and SF. They have done it earlier in 2015, ICC CT etc.

KL's was his first WC chosen for #4 was pushed as an opener against a crucial Pak game onwards. Had a decent WC with 361 runs (third highest after Kohli). In the two lost matches, the approach of Dhoni and MO has failed. Somebody had to sit with him and tell him that his strategy of refusing singles and taking singles with the RRR is 15, was not ON. 

Edited July 10, 2019 by coffee_rules

[Tendulkar1996]

''We are a professional outfit.One of the top 3 play till the end,and everyone else plays around them.Thats how we play''

Ok genius,if the top 3 is the only trick you have learn to play swing.

[shami_123]

To OP , this is how it happened

 

1) Backing TTF in Karthik, Jadhav, Rayudu, Rahane for multiple years.

2) Impatient and stupid captain chopping and changing youngsters in Pandey, Gill and Shreyas after couple of LOIs and never backing them.

 

End result we have most inexperienced MO in Pant, Pandya and a player in DK who's ceiling is 30 runs.

 

Don't blame Pant and Pandya as they should not bat higher than 6 and 7.

 

Your most experienced BAT should play on 4, 5 and 6.

 

Ideally with no such pre planning they should have made C and VC bat at 4 and 5 with Dhoni at 6. Let the youngsters Bat in top order and if they fail you have experience in middle order to arrest the fall of wickets.

 

Mayank

Pant

Kl Rahul

Kohli

Rohit

Dhoni

Pandya

Jadeja

 

This should have been batting order since start of WC because we failed to groomed proper MO for 4 freaking years. Like Paresh Rawal said in Cola adv., 4 saal the toh tayyari karni chaiye thi na

 

 

[nevada]

Big 3's big contributions for a long time masked weakness in the middle order. Players like Pandey, who raised much hope after scoring a match winning century in a chase in Australia, and Kedar Jadhav who had a match winning century in a chase vs England, failed to make the #4 spot their own. Rahane was also tried out in the middle order but he is a physical and mental weakling. 

Kohli's fondess for experience meant total lockdown of opportunities for youngsters 2 years ahead of the world cup. Dhoni was in terminal decline but on the pretext of the world cup being so close, he was allowed to carry on as a passenger in the team. If I hear "with the world cup in mind" one more time I am gonna puke! With their grand planning have Kohli and the selectors have delivered the most pathetic choke job. So much preparation and strategizing for this shitfest!

And, as someone said in another thread, there seems to be an apparent conflict of interest with so much sponsorship money at stake. Our revered superstars are very big money making machines guided by very smart, ruthless businessmen. Whoever is paying the players huge sums of money will obviously want to make more than they paid them and why would they care about nurturing new talent?

Edited July 11, 2019 by nevada