Is SDP (Hardik) the heir to the role vacated by MSD?

[zen]

Many talk about xyz is the new Kohli/Tendulkar, but for me multidimensional cricketers such as Dhoni are the key for LOIs with their cricketing acumen, leadership, batting, keeping /bowling and fielding (where applicable). Other cricketers displaying some of these qualities include Yuvi. Since Dhoni, Ind's greatest ODI cricketer in my book (because of the factors identified) has retired, SDP is the heir to such a role and may go on to become one of Ind's top 3 LOI cricketers ever. 

 

SDP has a wide range (and untapped potential considering he is yet to peak). Bat him with few overs to go, he comes up with a super high SR inning. Bat him up the order and he gives you those big knocks. Can bowl and field well too. On top of that he is a cricketer who is constantly challenging himself therefore learning and adapting too. A smart cricketer. 

 

I think he has a role to play in Test matches too esp. considering he is among the rare Indian batsmen comfortable against both bounce and spin. 

[sandeep]

Thoda zyaada ho gaya.

 

More than thoda. 

 

Seriously, let him be.  He's a developing player, let him find his ceiling and groove.  Time will tell what he can do.  Let him keep contributing to Indian cricket by hopefully staying injury free and coming back as a regular bowling contributor.

 

Pandya isn't ATG material IMHO - but an eminently serviceable and effective 3 tool player - such a player can make a huge difference to a team's fortunes if all the other boxes are ticked.  He can be that final piece to the puzzle and help the team get over the tournament winning hump, win some major away series etc.  That much is enough.  

Edited December 2, 2020 by sandeep

[zen]

42 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Thoda zyaada ho gaya.

 

More than thoda. 

 

Seriously, let him be.  He's a developing player, let him find his ceiling and groove.  Time will tell what he can do.  Let him keep contributing to Indian cricket by hopefully staying injury free and coming back as a regular bowling contributor.

 

Pandya isn't ATG material IMHO - but an eminently serviceable and effective 3 tool player - such a player can make a huge difference to a team's fortunes if all the other boxes are ticked.  He can be that final piece to the puzzle and help the team get over the tournament winning hump, win some major away series etc.  That much is enough.  

 

Why let him be? In sports, you should try to reach new heights (not be content by doing just enough to be good to hold a place or be better than the team you are playing against).  Ind is lucky to have such a cricketer and therefore should be motivated and challenged to reach new heights! 

 

PS Cricketers with potential can turn things around if challenged and channelled in the right direction:

 

Garry Sobers started as a bowler. In his first 3-4 years, only averaged 31 w/ the bat

 

Records type all-round analysis

View cumulative averages

Start of match date less than or equal to 1 Jan 1958

Ordered by start date (ascending)

 

Career averages

	Span	Mat	Runs	HS	Bat Av	100	Wkts	BBI	Bowl Av	5	Ct	St	Ave Diff
unfiltered	1954-1974	93	8032	365*	57.78	26	235	6/73	34.03	6	109	0	23.74
filtered	1954-1957	14	672	66	30.54	0	17	4/75	41.05	0	6	0	-10.51

 

 

After that retired as the greatest batsman after Bradman, averaging 63 b/w 1958 & 74:

 

Records type all-round analysis

View match by match list

Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 1958

Ordered by start date (ascending)

 

Career averages

	Span	Mat	Runs	HS	Bat Av	100	Wkts	BBI	Bowl Av	5	Ct	St	Ave Diff
unfiltered	1954-1974	93	8032	365*	57.78	26	235	6/73	34.03	6	109	0	23.74
filtered	1958-1974	79	7360	365*	62.90	26	218	6/73	33.49	6	103	0	29.41

Edited December 2, 2020 by zen

[Real McCoy]

30 minutes ago, zen said:

Many talk about xyz is the new Kohli/Tendulkar, but for me multidimensional cricketers such as Dhoni are the key for LOIs with their cricketing acumen, leadership, batting, keeping /bowling and fielding (where applicable). Other cricketers displaying some of these qualities include Yuvi. Since Dhoni, Ind's greatest ODI cricketer in my book (because of the factors identified) has retired, SDP is the heir to such a role and may go on to become one of Ind's top 3 LOI cricketers ever. 

 

SDP has a wide range (and untapped potential considering he is yet to peak). Bat him with few overs to go, he comes up with a super high SR inning. Bat him up the order and he gives you those big knocks. Can bowl and field well too. On top of that he is a cricketer who is constantly challenging himself therefore learning and adapting too. A smart cricketer. 

 

I think he has a role to play in Test matches too esp. considering he is among the rare Indian batsmen comfortable against both bounce and spin. 

In the first match when everyone was pissing in their pants when Hazelwood was running through the lineup, Pandya smacked his bouncers for 4. It was like whats the big deal showing up what Iyer, Kohli should have done.

[Serpico]

he definitely has shades of young dhoni while batting. If we had similar management Dhoni had early in his career, he would be getting chances at top order now and then to hit some big runs and gain confidence.

 

That 148 & 183 turned Dhoni's career around.. he gained more confidence and also trust from team mates and fans to get the job done. When other batsmen in the team are assured that even no. 6 can build a big innings if necessary, they will be able to score with more freedom and strike rate

[Majestic]

He should try to become like Kapil Dev rather than MS Dhoni with his all round show.

[sandeep]

7 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

In the first match when everyone was pissing in their pants when Hazelwood was running through the lineup, Pandya smacked his bouncers for 4. It was like whats the big deal showing up what Iyer, Kohli should have done.

IIRC he did that in one of those ODIs in NZ as well - walked in to a collapse, hit a few shots like it was nothing.  Couldn't carry on to a biggie that time.  But as we see in this series - he  continues to demonstrate improvement.

[maniac]

We get it @sandeep congratulations. Don’t forget to wash. Ok?

[Real McCoy]

17 minutes ago, Serpico said:

he definitely has shades of young dhoni while batting. If we had similar management Dhoni had early in his career, he would be getting chances at top order now and then to hit some big runs and gain confidence.

 

That 148 & 183 turned Dhoni's career around.. he gained more confidence and also trust from team mates and fans to get the job done. When other batsmen in the team are assured that even no. 6 can build a big innings if necessary, they will be able to score with more freedom and strike rate

Even rat has to acknowledge Pandya's capability. He is here to stay but the others are mismanaged by rat and his bewda buddies and the team suffers because of it. Remove rat from captaincy and we'll be doing much better

[sandeep]

32 minutes ago, maniac said:

We get it @sandeep congratulations. Don’t forget to wash. Ok?

So this means I have to put up with snarky passive-aggressive "banter" from you for how long?  Maybe a T20 failure with the bat by Pandya will get you out of that mode. 

 

Or not.  Petty empty vessels are like that only. 

 

Get it through your thick head - if you take silly potshots at me, I'm going to come back at you with kid gloves off.  Had enough of your nonsense.

Edited December 2, 2020 by sandeep

[sandeep]

16 minutes ago, Majestic said:

He should try to become like Kapil Dev rather than MS Dhoni with his all round show.

Dhoni is a bonafide ODI ATG, at least for India if not overall.  Yes his last couple of years were dragged out badly - kind of like Kapil Dev's if you think about it. 

[Ankit_sharma03]

21 minutes ago, Majestic said:

He should try to become like Kapil Dev rather than MS Dhoni with his all round show.

 

he shud just be himself and fulfill his potential, dont try to be kapil or dhoni. 

Kapil was a bowler 1st pandya is a batsman 1st

[zen]

On 12/2/2020 at 11:39 AM, Real McCoy said:

In the first match when everyone was pissing in their pants when Hazelwood was running through the lineup, Pandya smacked his bouncers for 4. It was like whats the big deal showing up what Iyer, Kohli should have done.

He usually looks comfortable against most types of bowling. In LOIs, those batting up the order have the luxury of picking the right balls for 6 (say someone played 100 balls and hit 3 6s, where he picked out 3 bad balls from 100), while those batting in the lower middle order do not have that option as they have to hit good balls including those not bowled in the slot for 6s as well. SDP is able to do that brilliantly too due to his talent. 

[maniac]

Pandya the finisher may be but Pandya the tactician like Dhoni- Rohit don’t think so

[Real McCoy]

42 minutes ago, zen said:

He usually looks comfortable against most types of bowling. In LOIs, those batting up the order have the luxury of picking the right balls for 6 (say someone played 100 balls and hit 3 6s, where he picked out 3 bad balls from 100), while those batting in the lower middle order do not have that option as they have to hit good balls including those not bowled in the slot for 6s as well. SDP is able to do that brilliantly too due to his talent. 

The flip side is the top order cannot lose wickets going for runs hence the selective shot making. The same thing happened in the first odi where Indian top order crumbled under scoreboard pressure and lost their wickets going for crazy shots. If the top order played like in the second ODI in the first ODI, there is a chance that we may have chased that total. We were given a 20 run first over as a bonus from starc. All we needed was build a parnership like the aussies and go hell for leather at the back 20 with 3-4 batsmen in the sheds

[Rasgulla]

Only guy who can hit like Dhoni. Unfortunate but fact that we don't have much options in that team is just sad.

[nevada]

No, he isn't, because he doesn't do tuk tuk with the chief goal of remaining not out. 

[SK_IH]

44 minutes ago, nevada said:

No, he isn't, because he doesn't do tuk tuk with the chief goal of remaining not out. 

C'mon man, last match was a quintessential Dhoni innings. He didn't take unnecessary risk, tried building a partnership & tried playing complete overs to build a good score. If he can emulate Dhoni, Indian cricket would well served.

[zen]

1 hour ago, nevada said:

No, he isn't, because he doesn't do tuk tuk with the chief goal of remaining not out. 

 

Many Indians (selectors, cricketers, fans) judge batsmen based on only runs and averages (and probably how risk free they appear while batting). Is it a surprise that established top order guys put their numbers first before the team, while Dhoni focused (going by your statement) on remaining not out (but may have been more obsessed with taking the game to the last over than numbers)?  

 

Vaughan hit the nail on its head:

 

 

 

Eng even got bowled out in 43 overs but it was seen as okay as that is the style of cricket Eng wanted to play, and therefore going through such games to help players develop that aggressive mindset including looking for a boundary (if not more) option almost every over. 

Edited December 4, 2020 by zen

[nevada]

52 minutes ago, SK_IH said:

C'mon man, last match was a quintessential Dhoni innings. He didn't take unnecessary risk, tried building a partnership & tried playing complete overs to build a good score. If he can emulate Dhoni, Indian cricket would well served.

He has the knack of sticking around and not giving his wicket away, can't find fault with that. But just looking to eat up the overs and taking it deep will cost us the game more often than not. And that's what cost us that game.