Why are our batsmen ......

[express bowling]

 

..  Why are our batsmen defending deliveries that have no chance of hitting the stumps ? 

 

Either leave them ... or hit them .. or take them on the body if both the earlier options fail.

 

..  Why are our batsmen NOT defending with soft hands  ?

 

..   Why are our batsmen poking at deliveries outside the off stump ?

 

..  Why are our batsmen trying to play cover drives / square drives / off drives on the front foot before getting set. ?   

 

..  Why are our batsmen not putting away the loose balls in most innings  ?  And why are they shutting shop completely and then suddenly going for a rash shot  ?

 

This is allowing the pacers to bowl.a better line and length without the pressure of getting hit.

 

 

All the above are basics of test match batting and must be followed.  (  Along with playing the ball under the eyes )

Edited September 4, 2021 by express bowling

[rkt.india]

Most of these are habits of playing in India and it has been there for years. Nothing new or for the first time or last time.  They like to feel the ball on the bat. Our batsmen have never been great leavers. It's not naturally in built. First instinct is to play instead of leave.

Edited September 4, 2021 by rkt.india

[Gollum]

Crux of the problem is->Post-fab 4 Indian test batsmen lack a strong backfoot game (either lacking skills or deliberately prodding forward as part of some team tactic), they are pushing forward instead of letting the ball come to them where they can make late adjustment to counter swing, forget 2000s guys even Azhar employed this method to great success in Eng. As a result they are looking to feel balls best left alone, and we aren't getting enough runs square of the wicket. As long as this flaw remains we will struggle against swing, seam and even quality spin. 

 

Rohit and KL are doing better than the other guys this series because they are playing late, under their eyes......of course soft hands help, and discipline. 

[SK_IH]

16 minutes ago, Gollum said:

Crux of the problem is->Post-fab 4 Indian test batsmen lack a strong backfoot game (either lacking skills or deliberately prodding forward as part of some team tactic), they are pushing forward instead of letting the ball come to them where they can make late adjustment to counter swing, forget 2000s guys even Azhar employed this method to great success in Eng. As a result they are looking to feel balls best left alone, and we aren't getting enough runs square of the wicket. As long as this flaw remains we will struggle against swing, seam and even quality spin. 

 

Rohit and KL are doing better than the other guys this series because they are playing late, under their eyes......of course soft hands help, and discipline. 

Of all the three, phoney Rahane atleast on paper & imagination has the game for conditions, he has the backfoot game as well. But the point is he is not good enough to score runs & so sometimes even having the game doesn't matter as well

India missed a great opportunity to try SKY in this game, he seems to be in form of his life & Oval would have been a perfect pitch to start your career

Edited September 4, 2021 by SK_IH

[express bowling]

Our openers started so well.

 

Saw off the new ball

 

Then saw off this morning too.

 

But did not put away the loose balls after that.

 

A wicket was lost when they became overly defensive.

 

 

[kubrickian]

Because its often the late movement which defeats the batsmen. The batsman could think the ball is coming straight at the stumps and he has to play at it but it could straighten at the last second and take the edge.

 

That's why bowlers bowl at 4th stump line because batsmen are not sure whether to play at it or leave. That's why there are 3 or 4 slips standing to take the catch.

 

When batsman is new to the crease, their foot movement is not up to the pitch of the ball and play away from the body and have no control over the shot, which makes them edge the ball. 

 

When they are not in form, they tend to be tentative and make misjudgements on playing or poking at deliveries they should be leaving alone,

 

Some have technical weakenesses they pick up from playing in different conditions, 

 

blah blah blah

[coffee_rules]

Del

Edited September 4, 2021 by coffee_rules

[express bowling]

1 hour ago, rkt.india said:

Most of these are habits of playing in India and it has been there for years. Nothing new or for the first time or last time.  They like to feel the ball on the bat. Our batsmen have never been great leavers. It's not naturally in built. First instinct is to play instead of leave.

 

 

Every player has habits depending on the condition he grows up in.

 

But the really good players

 

Either

 

1)  Really back their own strengths and raise their natural game to suit most conditions.

 

Or

 

2)  Modify their game to suit the given conditions.

 

Look at Bumrah

 

His natural bowling style is back a length, hit the deck, quick bowling.  In England, if the ball is not swinging, he has done this and done this well.  But when there is swing, he has pitched it up and gone for swing.

 

Basically done both of the above.

 

Really good batsmen like Tendulkar have done the same too.

 

There is a reason why good players are good and average players are average.

[Lord]

Kohli -ok thanks

[express bowling]

29 minutes ago, kubrickian said:

Because its often the late movement which defeats the batsmen. The batsman could think the ball is coming straight at the stumps and he has to play at it but it could straighten at the last second and take the edge.

 

That's why bowlers bowl at 4th stump line because batsmen are not sure whether to play at it or leave. That's why there are 3 or 4 slips standing to take the catch.

 

When batsman is new to the crease, their foot movement is not up to the pitch of the ball and play away from the body and have no control over the shot, which makes them edge the ball. 

 

When they are not in form, they tend to be tentative and make misjudgements on playing or poking at deliveries they should be leaving alone,

 

Some have technical weakenesses they pick up from playing in different conditions, 

 

blah blah blah

 

 

All these are known.

 

Which is why certain techniques are applied to counter swing bowling.

 

Some of them being ... don't defend any ball that is clearly not hitting the stumps.  This actually applies everywhere. Let's say a ball is above the hips. Why do you defend it ???  You can try to hit it but there is no reason to defend it in a test match.

 

Similarly, defending with soft hands is something very basic too. 

 

And you play late to counter the late swing.

 

Look at how Tendulkar, Gavaskar, Dravid, Ganguly, Vengsarkar played swing in England.

 

 

[express bowling]

Pujara put away the loose balls today and that made all the difference to his batting.

 

There is a saying that Pujara invariably gets the unplayable balls ... but that happens when he keeps defending and the bowlers are allowed to get their lines and lengths absolutely right ... and there is a perfect ball eventually.

 

Did not happen today because of his correct approach.

 

 

Edited September 4, 2021 by express bowling

[Vijy]

3 hours ago, express bowling said:

 

 

All these are known.

 

Which is why certain techniques are applied to counter swing bowling.

 

Some of them being ... don't defend any ball that is clearly not hitting the stumps.  This actually applies everywhere. Let's say a ball is above the hips. Why do you defend it ???  You can try to hit it but there is no reason to defend it in a test match.

 

Similarly, defending with soft hands is something very basic too. 

 

And you play late to counter the late swing.

 

Look at how Tendulkar, Gavaskar, Dravid, Ganguly, Vengsarkar played swing in England.

 

 

and also Fixer bhai.

[Vijy]

44 minutes ago, express bowling said:

Pujara put away the loose balls today and that made all the difference to his batting.

 

There is a saying that Pujara invariably gets the unplayable balls ... but that happens when he keeps defending and the bowlers are allowed to get their lines and lengths absolutely right ... and there is a perfect ball eventually.

 

Did not happen today because of his correct approach.

 

 

yes, and then he started being tentative against robinson once again and got out now

[Ankit_sharma03]

6 hours ago, express bowling said:

Pujara put away the loose balls today and that made all the difference to his batting.

 

There is a saying that Pujara invariably gets the unplayable balls ... but that happens when he keeps defending and the bowlers are allowed to get their lines and lengths absolutely right ... and there is a perfect ball eventually.

 

Did not happen today because of his correct approach.

 

 

 

thats how it shud always be , you shud always put bad balls away . Some players have more of ability of to make good balls into bat which is understandable that not all has but not putting bad balls away is never an excuse.

 

Its a long going debate in his case , started from that WI tour. KL was batting at 150 and he was blocking everything to which many defended saying he had to tough see off tough time....other opener is playing 100+ and its not doing much so what are you seeing off. Hence he failed in WI twice. 

 

TM was not wrong criticising him, they never asked him to bat like sehwag as it was made out to be.

 

 

[Vijy]

7 hours ago, express bowling said:

Pujara put away the loose balls today and that made all the difference to his batting.

 

There is a saying that Pujara invariably gets the unplayable balls ... but that happens when he keeps defending and the bowlers are allowed to get their lines and lengths absolutely right ... and there is a perfect ball eventually.

 

Did not happen today because of his correct approach.

 

 

Moreover, if one bats with controlled aggression, bowlers will actually make more mistakes than usual (due to loss of rhythm) which enables one to score more runs, thereby cause more breakdown of rhythm and so on. that's why looking for runs is important, albeit not at the cost of trying to score off good balls.

[express bowling]

Despite having a lead of 171 runs with 7 wickets in hand, the Indian batters were ultra defensive this morning.

 

Did not put away the loose balls.

 

Just 59 runs in a whole session as a result. And lost 3 wickets.

 

Don't know why the Indian middle order have become so defensive and afraid in their minds.

 

Shardul already releasing the pressure with his free batting.

 

 

Edited September 5, 2021 by express bowling

[Vijy]

5 minutes ago, express bowling said:

Despite having a lead of 171 runs with 7 wickets in hand, the Indian batters were ultra defensive this morning.

 

Did not put away the loose balls.

 

Just 59 runs in a whole session as a result. And lost 3 wickets.

 

Don't know why the Indian middle order have become so defensive and afraid in their minds.

 

Shardul already releasing the pressure with his free batting.

 

 

they don't have the talent to back them up - which is why they are so tentative. Kohli looked in good touch, then went into a complete rut (a sign of his decayed batting), rahane is a no. 11 batsmen so one cannot expect much from him, and jadeja is batting two positions too high

[express bowling]

10 minutes ago, Vijy said:

they don't have the talent to back them up - which is why they are so tentative. Kohli looked in good touch, then went into a complete rut (a sign of his decayed batting), rahane is a no. 11 batsmen so one cannot expect much from him, and jadeja is batting two positions too high

 

 

Their abilities have definitely deteriorated.

 

But we saw with Pujara how a positive mindset still results in better outcome.

 

If a batsman with reduced ability is afraid of batting then nothing can be more pathetic.

[Vijy]

Just now, express bowling said:

 

 

Their abilities have definitely deteriorated.

 

But we saw with Pujara how a positive mindset still results in better outcome.

 

If a batsman with reduced ability is afraid of batting then nothing can be more pathetic.

yes, they are pathetic. I think this level of flimsy mindset is something I haven't even seen in 80s or 90s. In 90s, there were isolated matches where some batsman would go on a rampage. Azhar in Lords (the Gooch test), Azhar and Sachin in SA, etc. And 80s had knocks from amarnath, vengsarkar, etc. right now, the current middle order looks as though the best they can do is grind their way to a tentative, pokey 40s-50s and then get out soon.

 

Need a complete infusion of new blood very soon. Gill, Shaw, Sundar, etc must all be brought in. if sarfaraz could have 1-2 more bumper seasons, he is just the kind of busy player middle order needs (I do realize he has technical limitations that need to be worked on)