If Ashwin goes wicketless in this test, should he be replaced by Vihari?

[G_B_]

A few overs of spin and a batter with concentration and solid defence might be a better fit on this tour on such pitches.

 

Ashwin has looked a bit redundant on this deck. 18 runs with the bat. 

[R!TTER]

If the next track doesn't aid spin then yeah why not?

[Adamant]

You are jealous of Ashwin. 

[Adamant]

Also you are trying to derail his career. 

[vvvslaxman]

We played 5 seamers in one of the test leaving out all the spinners. We won. Sure they can do that. But we had Pandya then with okay batting form. We can go with 5 seamers and Vihari in place of Pujara. Tail will be long though. At the end of the day our team selection is  based on covering trimurthis.

[jusarrived]

Ideally we should go with 5 pacers, but with this middle order we may need 3 more batsmen to up decent totals.  We had decent starts this test, unlikey it will happen in next 2 unless KL has a dream series the batting is going to cost us a match . So it's a tough call 

[R!TTER]

8 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

We can go with 5 seamers and Vihari in place of Pujara.

We don't need 5 pacers if the pitch is anywhere close to that last game! 7 batters & the current 4 pacers, Thakur's runs will be needed & Vihari is a serviceable part timer.

[vvvslaxman]

1 minute ago, R!TTER said:

We don't need 5 pacers if the pitch is anywhere close to that last game! 7 batters & the current 4 pacers, Thakur's runs will be needed & Vihari is a serviceable part timer.

 

Vihari is a part timer. if one bowler picks up an injury we will be left with a part timer and 3 seamers Opposition can target like how Australia targeted Leach. Part timers are not trained to bowl long 15 to 20 over spells. This will be like going back to Dhoni era.

[G_B_]

Its not just Ashwin. To be fair even Keshav Maharaj has looked so so on this deck.

 

I dont see innings lasting that long. Sides are being bundled out inside 160-170 overs across the innings. Thakur has bowled 16 overs thus far in this match. Tomorrow Bumrah Shami and Siraj will do most of the bowling. So the 4th and 5th bowlers are undertilised.

 

If India go 1-0 up, South Africa will have to gamble with the pitch and go for a seaming deck with bounce and hope to level the series by winning the toss etc. They cannot afford to put out a flat deck which results in a draw.

 

IMO is the deck is a seamer and there is even some rain around which makes the deck spicy, just drop the spinner for a batter.

 

 

[AuxiliA]

It always helps if you have a spinner, especially if you have a good one who can bat. Ashwin provides a little more value than Vihari imo. 

 

Ideally Jadeja is perfect in unhelpful conditions like these. He could keep it tight as well as Ashwin, gets through his overs super quick allowing more time for pacers and is a more consistent batter . 

[vvvslaxman]

2 minutes ago, G_B_ said:

Its not just Ashwin. To be fair even Keshav Maharaj has looked so so on this deck.

 

I dont see innings lasting that long. Sides are being bundled out inside 160-170 overs across the innings. Thakur has bowled 16 overs thus far in this match. Tomorrow Bumrah Shami and Siraj will do most of the bowling. So the 4th and 5th bowlers are undertilised.

 

If India go 1-0 up, South Africa will have to gamble with the pitch and go for a seaming deck with bounce and hope to level the series by winning the toss etc. They cannot afford to put out a flat deck which results in a draw.

 

IMO is the deck is a seamer and there is even some rain around which makes the deck spicy, just drop the spinner for a batter.

 

 

 

I don't think any side will go without spinners these days with over-rate penalization. Points will be docked. Captain may face suspension. It will impact Test champinoship points. If the seamers can finish off the job it is fine. But if the pitch flattens out seamers slogging means there will be over-rate issue.

[G_B_]

1 minute ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

I don't think any side will go without spinners these days with over-rate penalization. Points will be docked. Captain may face suspension. It will impact Test champinoship points. If the seamers can finish off the job it is fine. But if the pitch flattens out seamers slogging means there will be over-rate issue.

 

vihari can bowl those overs.

 

probably wont get any wickets but 10-12 quick overs is enough.

[express bowling]

Ashwin will be needed in Cape Town ... 3rd test.

 

Wanderers has nothing in it for spinners ... and if we get a green mamba again then it makes sense to have Vihari for Ashwin for only the 2nd test.

 

Jadeja would have been ideal for the 2nd test at the Wanderers.

[vvvslaxman]

1 minute ago, G_B_ said:

 

vihari can bowl those overs.

 

probably wont get any wickets but 10-12 quick overs is enough.

 

It is a tricky call to go with 4 seamers and a part timer. We did try that once at perth.  4 seamers and vihari. For a chance Pitch helped spinners. He picked a couple of wickets . But not nearly the impact you would expect from a senior spinner. Pitch was offering a lot of natural variation unusually.  Lyon enjoyed thoroughly and ended up winning man of the match. I think that was the last attempt where we went with 4 bowlers and a part timer.

[Chakdephatte]

Replace him with whom? Vihari, of all people?

 

If you want to strengthen the batting, remove Dracula. 3,4,5 are the real problem, Ash is not.

[vvvslaxman]

2 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

Replace him with whom? Vihari, of all people?

 

If you want to strengthen the batting, remove Dracula. 3,4,5 are the real problem, Ash is not.

 

All the jugglings are happening at no.1 & no.2 and lower order to improve our batting. If Rohit sharma comes in what will they do? Will they sit Agarwal out? What about GIll? He played 2 of the most important knocks for us in recent times. 

[Texan]

Absolutely. No point in playing Ashwin if he can't get wickets. Vihari could do the same holding job. Ashwin as a batter also appears useless in SA. 

[Jay]

33 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

I don't think any side will go without spinners these days with over-rate penalization. Points will be docked. Captain may face suspension. It will impact Test champinoship points. If the seamers can finish off the job it is fine. But if the pitch flattens out seamers slogging means there will be over-rate issue.

Please go ahead and suspend the captain and the VC if its still karate kid.

[Lone Wolf]

Indeed yesss...  But I liked what I saw with Ash from the bat.  Scored a few quick runs when others were struggling. 

Vihari has more upside with the bat for sure. 

Joburg doesn't spins at all these days & is fastest pitch in the world.  Ash is pretty useless with the ball there. 

[ShoonyaSifar]

The issue is much bigger. If he is going to be so useless in SENA, should younger spinners not be given chances at home/ in Asia? We cannot keep picking a 35 year old specialist spinner who does well only in helpful conditions.

 

Ashwin still has a great opportunity to throw out all such scenarios by picking wickets tomorrow.