What do we do about our batting?

[rollingstoned]

Title says it all. From a country that has a proud batting culture and has excelled at it even when it may have sucked at other aspects of the sport this is a new low we have hit since 2019 where we cannot post big scores of around 400 and above consistently without the lower order and Pant chipping in and our so called best batsmen in the middle order have minnow level averages in this period, some of whom were phased out and others who still are holding on for dear life. All while we waste good talent in domestic cricket who pile on runs season after season without ever getting a look in. 

How can why fix it and why is it that we are singularly unable to bat teams out of matches even at home nowadays for some time now? 

Edited March 3, 2023 by rollingstoned

[zen]

Talking about home, difficult to judge batsmen on such "tailored" pitches. While good performances can be appreciated, cannot point fingers at bad ones as one unplayable ball can get you out anytime. A batsman is never set in such conditions, struggling to either be on the front foot or the back foot, and trying to adapt to uneven bounce (On green pitches, a batsman can relatively easily be on either front or back foot and can expect a more or less even bounce). 

 

Not ideal conditions to judge youngsters too .

 

Also the grass can be greener on the other side. The ones not playing or retired can automatically appear better but if they play, most of them could struggle too. 

 

 

PS post 2019, players were also impacted by the pandemic, where they went without playing cricket for long periods. Cricket was also played in a controlled environment, where players had to spend time in the "bubble", a mentally stressful experience for many. 

 

 

Edited March 3, 2023 by zen

[vvvslaxman]

7 minutes ago, rollingstoned said:

Title says it all. From a country that has a proud batting culture and has excelled at it even when it may have sucked at other aspects of the sport this is a new low we have hit since 2019 where we cannot post big scores of around 400 and above consistently without the lower order and Pant chipping in and our so called best batsmen in the middle order have minnow level averages in this period, some of whom were phased out and others who still are holding on for dear life. All while we waste good talent in domestic cricket who pile on runs season after season without ever getting a look in. 

How can why fix it and why is it that we are singularly unable to bat teams out of matches even at home nowadays for some time now? 

 

In England but for Shami/Bumrah partnership we might as well have lost the series. Also Thakur made fifties.  At the Gabba Thakur/Sundar made crucial 50s.  This stat padding in a losing cause is an art for some players. Still Pujara averages 30 in SENA in the last 3 years. Rahane 25. Kohli 32. These are appalling numbers for guys who hold key position in a batting order.  At home Axar/Jadeja/Ashwin/Pant have saved our asses with their batting. Moment they went missing we were exposed. Even in this eries Axar/Ashwin added 100 partnership.  Those are meaningful contributions.  These meaningless fifties and a 100 on flat road in Bangladesh prett much mean nothing. In the 2nd test where the conditions were actually challenging Pujara played like a t ailender.

 

 

[vvvslaxman]

Openers/No.3/No.4 set the tone for the entire team. If you have flaky, inconsistent, mediocre players in those spots it is unfixable until we find replacements. You have to give chances to others to see how good they are. 

[Chakdephatte]

That's for people who believe test cricket is not dead. Most batsman are not interested in playing tests. Take Gill for example, Bradman of ODI but here... They are finding alternate ways of playing, like Bazball. If someone has to play all formats, he has to play ODI style in tests, and most of them do not have technique good enough for that.

Edited March 3, 2023 by Chakdephatte

[Chakdephatte]

India may scout some 'Test level talents' and make train them separately from other top players. That's the only way. Or tell everyone to SehwagBall.

[vvvslaxman]

6 minutes ago, Chakdephatte said:

India may scout some 'Test level talents' and make train them separately from other top players. That's the only way. Or tell everyone to SehwagBall.

 

First they have to start respecting domestic performances. Sure they may not all click. But unless you test you won't wind them.

[Arvind32]

Why these talented player not getting a game ? 
 

Sarfraz Khan 

Sanju Sampson 

Jaiswal 

Shaw 

Kuldeep 

Bhisnoi

 

 

[rollingstoned]

1 hour ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

In England but for Shami/Bumrah partnership we might as well have lost the series. Also Thakur made fifties.  At the Gabba Thakur/Sundar made crucial 50s.  This stat padding in a losing cause is an art for some players. Still Pujara averages 30 in SENA in the last 3 years. Rahane 25. Kohli 32. These are appalling numbers for guys who hold key position in a batting order.  At home Axar/Jadeja/Ashwin/Pant have saved our asses with their batting. Moment they went missing we were exposed. Even in this eries Axar/Ashwin added 100 partnership.  Those are meaningful contributions.  These meaningless fifties and a 100 on flat road in Bangladesh prett much mean nothing. In the 2nd test where the conditions were actually challenging Pujara played like a t ailender.

 

 

We have basically turned into England from before Bazball right around the time Cook left captaincy to Root giving it up, where their main batsman all sucked and only their lower order and tail were taking them to respectable totals. Our ceiling as a team is a game where the first innings score is at most around 300, we will struggle to make more than that even if the conditions are good for batting with the present lot.

[Insidious]

1. Stop dishing out rank Turner, where any random spinner can be match winner. It just unfair to batsman, audience and even bowler 

2. Stop dishing out green tops only in Ranji/domestic. It should be mixed bags - green tops, rank Turner, flat beds.

3. Stop picking players in Tests based on their performance in LOIs. Ex - Surya Kumar yadav.

 

[AuxiliA]

Must phase out Kohli and Pujara ASAP, before even the bowlers lose form. They can't drop Kohli immediately but atleast make Pujara retire after the WTC F.

 

Pujara has had a good career, deservedly got to play his 100th test, but to play him any further is like flogging a dead horse. 

 

 

[rollingstoned]

1 hour ago, Chakdephatte said:

That's for people who believe test cricket is not dead. Most batsman are not interested in playing tests. Take Gill for example, Bradman of ODI but here... They are finding alternate ways of playing, like Bazball. If someone has to play all formats, he has to play at style in tests, and most of them do not have technique good enough for that.

Even if that is true, there is enough talent in India that some players will not be suited to white ball cricket like Pujara who can be paid a pretty penny to ensure they only play tests. Only the most exceptional can successfully play all formats without it affecting their game or a noticeable drop off in performance.

[rollingstoned]

Just now, AuxiliA said:

Must phase out Kohli and Pujara ASAP, before even the bowlers lose form. They can't drop Kohli immediately but atleast make Pujara retire after the WTC F.

 

Pujara has had a good career, deservedly got to play his 100th test, but to play him any further is like flogging a dead horse. 

 

 

He was dropped last year tbf to the selectors, but he conned everyone by scoring runs in Div 2 county cricket and us going there to play only 1 test because we cancelled the last one the previous year. If not for that he would have been playing for Saurashtra in the Ranji trophy instead of the Indian team right now. Though you cannot fault him for going and playing there when he had nothing else to do at his age.

[The Realist]

[SRT100]

32 minutes ago, The Realist said:

Couldnt care less, if its that serious take a break from cricket, stop bringing down Mother India.

[wanted_desi]

Complete overhaul! 

[deepdynamo]

A major overhaul needed after WTC F.

But who has the guts to take that call- Rohit, Rahul, Kohli, Pujara - All of them needs to be chucked out.

[Number]

Sundar Sarfraz should replace Kohli Pujara.

[Vijy]

9 hours ago, deepdynamo said:

A major overhaul needed after WTC F.

But who has the guts to take that call- Rohit, Rahul, Kohli, Pujara - All of them needs to be chucked out.

I expect none of the 4 to be chucked out from the squad of 15, and rahane + dhawan will be brought back instead.

[tapandrun]

Totally hard to imagine days like this, there were times when Yuvraj was not able to make into the test side, Badrinath kept waiting for his chances, Many like muzumdar and other didnt even get 1 chance, now Ind had Rahane (Vice captain) scoring at an avg of sub 40s, Ind not able to find #4 in Odis for nearly 7 years and the batter Ind has right now at #4 (Iyer) is unsure of facing bouncer at any pace -though Iyer showed great guts till now but with an obvious flaw and guaranteed wkt how long Ind can persist with him.

 

Unable to find an Opening pair since Sehwag and Gambhir. 

 

When Eng is producing batters like Brook and Cadmore etc, Billings, Vince are not getting consistent chances. & Ind is stuck is early 2000s kind of batting

Edited March 8, 2023 by tapandrun