Pitch/Conditions in Ahmedabad are slightly concerning

[Number]

In the opening game at Ahmedabad the ball in first half kept doing some tricks off the pitch for NZ. 

Matt Henry was able to seam it around considerably well.

Santner and Glenn Philips got good amount of turn as well. 

Though it still looked like a 300 runs wicket.

 

As soon as England started to bowl under lights in the evening, it became a belter. No movement off the pitch, no spin. It became a typical Ahmedabad IPL pitch.

 

This is same as what used to happen in UAE in 6.30 PM local time start in t20 world cups/asia cups.

 

Batting first it used to be a 155-160 par score pitch where ball used to grip a lot and batsmen used to struggle with timing and then in 2nd innings it used to become a 200 runs par score pitch.

 

Although the sample size is just one game and we don't have any other game there before 14th so it is a bit concerning. If we get to bat first and don't get way above par, we may be in trouble.

Edited October 11, 2023 by Number

[Frustrated]

No matter what, if Ind win toss, they would bat first I think.  We don't hv any pleasant memory of chasing big score against Pak in recent times.  #CT2017 Final on a flat pitch#

[LehraDo]

Any team winning this toss will bat first. Neither bowling is as poor as Lanka.

[Nikhil_cric]

Yeah, this is my concern too. We have to bowl first.

 

Cricviz noted that among the venues, the ball swing the least in Ahmedabad and Hyderabad . 

 

So there is not much threat under lights in terms of movement .

 

The pitch is tacky during day time and you can only smash full length deliveries and the spinners get enough grip.

 

Under lights, margin for error is less . Gotta chase on that wicket. 

[R!TTER]

3 hours ago, Nikhil_cric said:

 

Cricviz noted that among the venues, the ball swing the least in Ahmedabad and Hyderabad . 

And it spun the most in Ahmedabad & Hyderabad, even more than Chennai, shown on Star yesterday. Whatever we do we should do well - bat first score close to 400 if the wicket is super flat or bowl first & ideally restrict Pak to under 350 again if the wicket is flat. We lost the CT final because we didn't bowl & field well, the 2021 WT20 was completely down to the conditions so I wouldn't worry about that too much.

Edited October 11, 2023 by R!TTER

[Nikhil_cric]

38 minutes ago, R!TTER said:

And it spun the most in Ahmedabad & Hyderabad, even more than Chennai, shown on Star yesterday. Whatever we do we should do well - bat first score close to 400 if the wicket is super flat or bowl first & ideally restrict Pak t under 350 again if the wicket is flat. We lost the CT final because we didn't bowl & field well, the 2021 WT20 was completely down to the conditions so I wouldn't worry about that too much.

If England couldn't score more than 280, then Im not sure India can either because we lack batting depth. 

 

Unless it's a surface like the one SA got in Delhi or there's evidence of swing under lights , we have to chase. 

 

The spin point is spot on. If it's spinning there, there's more reason reason to bowl first , because of dew coming in later .

 

 

[R!TTER]

You're overrating Eng, they're a poor ODI side in India -

View overall figures [change view]

Opposition team Australia  or Bangladesh  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka

Host country India

Totals in terms of batting team

Qualifications matches won greater than or equal to 20

Ordered by win/loss ratio (descending)

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Overall figures

Team	Span	Mat	Won	Lost	Tied	NR	W/L	Ave	RPO	Inns	HS	LS
India	1981-2023	278	165	103	1	9	1.601	37.70	5.46	275	414	78
Pakistan	1983-2023	44	26	18	0	0	1.444	32.64	5.22	44	345	89
Australia	1984-2023	87	44	38	0	5	1.157	37.13	5.47	86	359	139
South Africa	1991-2023	40	21	19	0	0	1.105	35.18	5.11	40	438	99
West Indies	1983-2022	83	38	43	1	1	0.883	31.16	4.97	83	333	80
England	1981-2023	62	23	38	1	0	0.605	30.97	5.22	62	366	125
Sri Lanka	1982-2023	73	20	50	0	3	0.400	28.63	5.08	73	411	73

[R!TTER]

Even their "bassball" approach doesn't work when the bowl spins. This is why we still see them constantly whine about pitches "in these conditions" 

[Serpico]

Both England and sri lanka have pretty bad bowling lineups tbh. England's entire strategy is pick batsmen till 11 and out bat the opposition so defending will always be extra hard for them. We on the other hand have three specialist bowlers who are allergic to even holding the bat. If they cannot defend a large score then what's the point 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Serpico

[deathmonger]

if pak win, will they chase cause of last night match or bat first due to asia cup match?

[Nikhil_cric]

1 hour ago, R!TTER said:

You're overrating Eng, they're a poor ODI side in India -

View overall figures [change view]

Opposition team Australia  or Bangladesh  or England  or India  or New Zealand  or Pakistan  or South Africa  or Sri Lanka

Host country India

Totals in terms of batting team

Qualifications matches won greater than or equal to 20

Ordered by win/loss ratio (descending)

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Overall figures

Team	Span	Mat	Won	Lost	Tied	NR	W/L	Ave	RPO	Inns	HS	LS
India	1981-2023	278	165	103	1	9	1.601	37.70	5.46	275	414	78
Pakistan	1983-2023	44	26	18	0	0	1.444	32.64	5.22	44	345	89
Australia	1984-2023	87	44	38	0	5	1.157	37.13	5.47	86	359	139
South Africa	1991-2023	40	21	19	0	0	1.105	35.18	5.11	40	438	99
West Indies	1983-2022	83	38	43	1	1	0.883	31.16	4.97	83	333	80
England	1981-2023	62	23	38	1	0	0.605	30.97	5.22	62	366	125
Sri Lanka	1982-2023	73	20	50	0	3	0.400	28.63	5.08	73	411	73

You're absolutely right. England are overrated But any team would struggle when the pitch changes under lights . The only time batting first makes sense is if the pitch gets slower or if the ball does something under lights.

 

If there's no evidence of either, doesn't it make sense to chase ?  Based on the previous match in Ahmedabad, it simply got easier to bat with marginal swing and skidded on straight to the bat.

 

I

[Number]

23 minutes ago, Serpico said:

Both England and sri lanka have pretty bad bowling lineups tbh. England's entire strategy is pick batsmen till 11 and out bat the opposition so defending will always be extra hard for them. We on the other hand have three specialist bowlers who are allergic to even holding the bat. If they cannot defend a large score then what's the point 

Adil Rashid and Mark Wood are good bowlers to be fair and they found nothing from the pitch.

I do expect our bowlers to be better but they can't do  much when the ball just doesn't do anything.

[Number]

4 hours ago, R!TTER said:

2021 WT20 was completely down to the conditions so I wouldn't worry about that too much.

That is the point. This Ahmedabad track behaved exactly the same way 2021 WT20, once sun sets temperatures drop sharply in desert and that leads to conditions getting easy to bat.

Shaheen bowled well and we were not ready for that but our bowlers were not that bad to lose that badly. 

Same was WT20 SF 2022, after 14-15 overs of first innings it was a different pitch.

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Number

[R!TTER]

They can change the timing to an hour or half an hour of early start if the conditions change so drastically. We'll have to see though how the second half plays out, at least I hope ICC don't act like an Ostrich this time.

[Number]

Their team chased a record world cup total.

Our team chased 273 in 35 overs.

 

Lets see what the toss winner captain does. I am inclined towards chasing.

[IndianRenegade]

Probably the best way to take conditions out of the equation and save ODI is to play it as two 25 over innings as Sachin suggested. 

[jf1gp_1]

We will see a repeat of Asia cup final. India will bowl first Pak will be ao for 75 and we will win by 10 wickets

[mikeypbadana86]

16 hours ago, Frustrated said:

No matter what, if Ind win toss, they would bat first I think.  We don't hv any pleasant memory of chasing big score against Pak in recent times.  #CT2017 Final on a flat pitch#

That was in England where the ball seams/swings considerably better than any other country.  The knock out(final) vs league match preassure is different.

 

India should chase under lights since its no guarantee that we won't loose early wickets batting first.

[cricketfan28]

I am I the only one , who is too afraid to watch the first few overs of  our batting?

[AKane]

In both T20WC in 2021 vs Pak and CT 2017 final - it was not just an issue of pitch easing up.

 

The main problem was the collapse of the top order to Shaheen in 2021 and Amir in 2017. In T20 we recovered to 155 after that but then Bhuvaneshwar did his thing in the first over.  In CT 2017 from 33/3 we went to 72/6 and then it was academic after that despite the Pandya inning.

 

How we deal with the new ball is important. Another 2/3 like in the Aus game and it will be fatal.