The fraud selection of Shardul over Shami

[Nikhil_cric]

Supposedly , Thakur can bat better than Shami and that's why he is in the first XI.

 

But that was true at some point in the past. Thakurs batting has regressed just like Jadeja's batting. 

 

In his last 29 matches going back to Feb 2022, Thakur's batting record is

 

Average - 9 , Strike rate - 80 odd. 

 

He has hit only 1 six in this period. 

 

 

Shami on the other hand has batted only 6 times in ODIs.

 

But he has an average of 12 and strike rate of 96.

 

Also has hit 2 sixes in a much smaller sample space.

 

How is Shardul's selection over Shami justified ? 

 

 

 

 

[Trichromatic]

Selection is based more on potential with bat rather than actual performances. Another reason could be that Siraj and Shami are seen as similar type of bowlers.

[express bowling]

3 hours ago, Trichromatic said:

Selection is based more on potential with bat rather than actual performances. Another reason could be that Siraj and Shami are seen as similar type of bowlers.

 

How are they similar ?

 

Siraj is around 6'0" pacer who can crank it up to 145 k+ when on song.  He gets outswing with the new ball and then bowls cross seamers with the older ball. Has a vicious bouncer.  

 

Shami is around 5'9" with a much lower release point that Siraj. Is currently slower than Siraj. Shami has a great seam position and is primarily a seam bowler with upright seam. You won't get any cross seamers from him and not as much outswing with the new ball as Siraj. 

 

The only similarity is that neither are dependable death bowlers. But neither is Shardul. And Shardul is a dibbly dobbly bowlers who does not look like a specialist pacer nowadays but a part timer.

Edited October 19, 2023 by express bowling

[Number]

What are their bowling stats in last 10 matches ?

[Nikhil_cric]

1 hour ago, Trichromatic said:

Selection is based more on potential with bat rather than actual performances. Another reason could be that Siraj and Shami are seen as similar type of bowlers.

I agree that they are similar bowlers but then the question has to be asked why a superior bowler who offers a point of difference like Prasidh(high release) does not deserve selection over Thakur who is not trusted to bowl even 5 overs at times?

 

Surely, it was the "batting" ability that got him the nod?

 

 

[Nikhil_cric]

3 minutes ago, Number said:

What are their bowling stats in last 10 matches ?

Last 10 bowling innings for each bowler

 

Thakur - 14 wickets at 25 ( 8 wickets at 11 against WI, 0/113 vs OZ, 1/28 vs PAK)

 

Shami - 18 wickets @ 18.94( 9 wickets @ 19 vs OZ, 4 wickets @21.75 vs NZ)

 

There's no comparison bowling-wise.

 

[Adamant]

Nah, any way you paint it doesn’t matter.

Shardul is a way better batsman than Shami, not everything is about stats.

You did the same for Jadeja and Bumrah, both of them have won matches for us in this world cup.

[MediumPacer]

We don't have pacers for no 8,9.Hardik too is iffy with his fitness.

[Nikhil_cric]

43 minutes ago, Adamant said:

Nah, any way you paint it doesn’t matter.

Shardul is a way better batsman than Shami, not everything is about stats.

You did the same for Jadeja and Bumrah, both of them have won matches for us in this world cup.

Question wa about whether Bumrah should start every match or not .   Also Jadeja's batting is still not a given 

[putrevus]

The same genius wanted Jadeja out of the team also.

[Lord]

Can't compare last few matches only.

 

Ability wise Shardul is much better hitter.

[bowl_out]

No 8 is a bowler who is expected to bat when required.. Thakur and Ashwin fit that bill.. Shami doesn't (at least based on perception)

Expect Ashwin to come in for the next 3 games against Eng, NZ, Netherlands.

[Lord]

3 hours ago, putrevus said:

The same genius wanted Jadeja out of the team also.

 

loves the word fraud. Earlier used for Jadeja

[sandeep]

11 hours ago, Nikhil_cric said:

Supposedly , Thakur can bat better than Shami and that's why he is in the first XI.

 

But that was true at some point in the past. Thakurs batting has regressed just like Jadeja's batting. 

 

In his last 29 matches going back to Feb 2022, Thakur's batting record is

 

Average - 9 , Strike rate - 80 odd. 

 

He has hit only 1 six in this period. 

 

 

Shami on the other hand has batted only 6 times in ODIs.

 

But he has an average of 12 and strike rate of 96.

 

Also has hit 2 sixes in a much smaller sample space.

 

How is Shardul's selection over Shami justified ? 

 

 

 

 

only argument one can make is that shardul has a bit more proven track record in the middle phase, whereas Shami is more of a newball bowler and sometimes struggles in the other 2 phases.  Shardul, somehow has that knack for using his variety, scrambled seam etc to get wickets on flat tracks where batters are attacking him.  

 

But yes, for me, I'd pick Shami ahead of him regardless.

[putrevus]

1 hour ago, Lord said:

 

loves the word fraud. Earlier used for Jadeja

Every team wants 11 great players but reality is diferent.

 

 

Edited October 19, 2023 by putrevus

[Need4Speed]

I hv seen Thakur playing meaningful innings in Tests but havent seen any major batting contribution in white ball..feel free to correct me..as I am just saying by memory..

I even dont trust him to hold one end and help regular batsman to guide the innings..

for me Deepak Chahar is much reliable batter..DC’s fragile body  and bowling is a different discussion.

 

seeing Thakur in xi gives a cushion and even I feel we have a better batting lineup..however deep down I know..he wont contribute that much with bat.

 

On another note..I am seeing big improvement in Rahul Chahar’s batting..he looks very assured on taking on high pace too..

 

even if he is not bowling great..not bad as a sixth bowler..if he bats well..

[Serpico]

What is the point of taking number of matches for a lower order batsman when he barely gets to bat? He played maybe 10 innings in those 29 matches. He has a 50 in South Africa last year against a pretty good bowling attack. Can you ever expect a odi 50 from shami if he comes to bat before 40th over? How can pandya or jaddu take any risk before 45th over if shami is the next batsman? Very poor comparison

 

If Shami plays it should be to rotate siraj/bumrah or any good matchups in opposite team. Otherwise it should be thakur vs ashwin and I prefer thakur, especially if pandya is injured