Can Lokesh Rahul replace Saha as a keeper?

[sscomp32]

20 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Its a bad idea, cricket is not played on paper.

1. we already struggling with openers, Dhawan technique n consistency is already under question. Imagine if vijay gets injured before a major tour who will open. A keeper cant open in test.

2. Part time keepers are always a bad idea, We could have done that with dravid also n adjusted an all rounder or young yuvraj, kaif, badrinath, tiwary those days but it was a bad idea. 

3. Uthappa is a prime example the guy has been trying to be a keeper yet he is rubbish behind stump in short formats forget long.

4. Keeping not only requires net practice but match practice, where would he do match practice being a India regular. his state side already has issue with uthappa n Cm Gautam

5. Abdv n Sangakara left keeping at test level to become better bastman so should be the case with Kl Rahul. Let him focus on one skill.

6. Lets not sacrifice KL rahul the batsman coz we dont have a keeper. Lets find a better keeper batsman. To be honest Saha is avg with bat and bloody gud with keeping. His keeping would come in real handy in home series on those rank turners. At this point he is like horses for courses.

7. Our batting has loop holes so we need gud batsman as well. Also imagine KL rahul dropping a crucial catch at crucial situation. Its not easy to keep on rank turner and even in england. Remember how dhoni struggled in Eng on his 1st tour despite being a regular keeper.

 

We Need Kl Rahul the batsman, lets find a better keeper batsman

Agree with everything except this. Saha is fantastic in fact one the best keepers i have seen for pacers. But he is not that good for spinners as he is to pacers. Still has to improve more vs spinners. 

[express bowling]

1 hour ago, sscomp32 said:

Agree with everything except this. Saha is fantastic in fact one the best keepers i have seen for pacers. But he is not that good for spinners as he is to pacers. Still has to improve more vs spinners. 

You are right, but he is perhaps showing some improvement against spin in this series.  A series in India will give us a better idea.

[sandeep]

Its fair to expect more from Saha with the bat.  Its not enough to just be a quality test 'keeper, which Saha definitely is.  

 

But its stupid to think we can plug in Rahul in his place in test matches.  Real cricket != Fantasy cricket.

 

If a Naman Ojha or a Dinesh Karthik or someone else prove themselves to be a solid batting upgrade over Saha, and match him behind the stumps then fair enough.  But as of now, Saha is the incumbent and not a horrible one at that.  Sure it would improve the team big-time if we could get better batting out of that spot, but not by downgrading in 'keeping.  Or asking too much from promising rookie batsmen.  

[Adi_91]

1 hour ago, express bowling said:

You are right, but he is perhaps showing some improvement against spin in this series.  A series in India will give us a better idea.

The one thing I wish he learns from his predecessor MSD is the lightning quick stumping should an opportunity come. That will make him extremely useful.

[SLICKR392]

There's absolutely no need to burden a young bat who's doing so well with additional responsibilities. Saha is not all that bad either!

[Bigg Brother]

Saha needs to fire today..

[Austin 3:!6]

7 hours ago, sarchasm said:

I agree with your idea, but only in LoIs. Straight swap of Rahul for Dhoni and we'd be a much stronger side. Test cricket needs a proper keeper, not pretenders and part timers like Dhoni and Rahul.

 

[maniac]

Our bowlers struggle to take 20 wickets...Imagine our keeper dropping dollies and us having to pick 25 wickets in a test

It is better to stick to Saha who is a decent keeper till we find a better Keeper than him,if the person can bat it is a bonus.

[bowl_out]

Too big a risk. One drop off Cook or Smith can cost 200 runs... We've seen that happen in the past.. Have the right horses for courses... A specialist keeper who can bat a bit, and an opening batsman (who can double up as No. 3 if required) focusing only on that skill.

[adi B]

Rahul as a keeper will be a disaster in tests!! Keep playing with saha as the specialist keeper,he can contribute with some handy runs.need to groom a new keeper though because saha is not a long term option (max another 2-3 years)

[Muloghonto]

being a good keeper to spinners and batting well requires, above all, stupendous fitness and core strength. Far more than just being a keeper or a batsman.

This is because, when you keep to spinners, you deep crouch. Crouching so deeply and getting up 400-500 times a day is hell on your back. 

Then to come back and bat for long periods of time, is very hard.

Against pacers, you don't have to crouch on your haunches and its easier on the back. 

 

Notice that most excellent keeper batsmen have come from England, Australia and South Africa, where they don't play more than 1 spinner at most. India's bread and butter is 2 spinners and sometimes even 3. That doesnt mean India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka have never produced an excellent keeper-batsman (look at Sanga, Dhoni for example, though Sanga was a below average keeper IMO), it simply means if you wish to have a keeper who can average 40 across all formats, expecting him to keep to spinners all day and then come out and smash a hundred is a tall order.

Unless players can be targeted/target themselves with stupendous amount of technical and fitness training from like 15-16 years of age, it will be very very hard to find someone to average 40 in test cricket for these nations.

 

[gakgupta]

On 7/31/2016 at 7:55 PM, Adi_91 said:

Already we burdened a certain "Rahul" in ODIs making him do the wicketkeeping job. Now, not with this Rahul again.

 

Saha is lucky for sure as TINA factor is strongly in his favor. 

LOL...

Looks like you never played professional cricket....

Part time wicket-keepers might work in ODI and T20's but not in test matches....

 

Any idea, how many test matches, pak would have won, if not for Kamran Akmal....

 

Bowlers will be completely de-moralized, if they know that wicket keeper is not good enough...

 

I still remember Pappu patel stumping miss of Anil kumble in 2003 series...it was steve's last match and we could have won the match and series.....

Whole 3 month effort was wasted because of that one single stumping miss....(BTW, it was very easy chance)...

 

Remember, test matches are won by taking 20 wickets...and for that we need good bowlers and good wicket-keeper, as well.....

 

[Ankit_sharma03]

3 minutes ago, gakgupta said:

LOL...

Looks like you never played professional cricket....

Part time wicket-keepers might work in ODI and T20's but not in test matches....

 

Any idea, how many test matches, pak would have won, if not for Kamran Akmal....

 

Bowlers will be completely de-moralized, if they know that wicket keeper is not good enough...

 

I still remember Pappu patel stumping miss of Anil kumble in 2003 series...it was steve's last match and we could have won the match and series.....

Whole 3 month effort was wasted because of that one single stumping miss....(BTW, it was very easy chance)...

 

Remember, test matches are won by taking 20 wickets...and for that we need good bowlers and good wicket-keeper, as well.....

 

Ohhh that Pappu patel terrible keeping in aus still haunts, what an opportunity we missed. 

I think the general understanding among ppl in our country is to make batting strong n thats how we ll win. But no one understand test matches are won by 20 wkts. 

Here is one idiot who had another terrible idea-

 This has to the most idiotic idea. 

 

Coming to Kl Rahul, part time keeper can even back fire in Odi also as pressure can make u drop catches. It happened to Rahul in Ipl to. Take Ind-aus recent t20 series aussie had this part time keeper who did blunders. WK is not easy and its needs years n years of hard work. Uthappa still hasnt learned, Pappu patel n dinesh karthik still chokes under pressure. 

 

[Muloghonto]

Personally, the best thing BCCI could do for Indian cricket,is to throw a lot of money at Gilly to become our wicketkeeping coach. As far as a wicketkeeper goes, Gilly isn't all natural keeper either (i.e., he does have a decent amount of natural ability, but he was not a stand-out keeper at any one thing either: Dhoni/Kirmani & their stumping ability was legendary. Mongia  and his ability to snaffle up top edges to spinners like nobody's business. Boucher and his stupendous leaps to the left side to take one handed screamers., etc etc. )

 

but Gilly was legendary in his work ethic and perfecting a technique that worked for his body. 

 

Wicketkeeping is by far, the most underrated skill in cricket. 

problem is, wicketkeepers are mostly, crappy batsmen. This is natural. Wicketkeepers also break fingers, dislocate thumbs, etc. and keeping is tiring job, so its no wonder that in a county/FC/world stage, there isn't any more than 1 or 2 wicketkeepers at best, who can bat in the top six and do a good job.  most are decent to serviceable #7 batsmen- often demoted to #8 if they have a bowling allrounder, such as Bari demoted under Wasim Akram in the lineup. 

And as a wicketkeeper gets older, the back gets destroyed, unless they stay in tip-top shape. 

When a wicketkeeper fails with the bat badly, it really stings, because a wicketkeeper is usually coming in at 5 down, which means the game is in its finale. Their batting failures are stinging and their batting glory are overwhelming when it comes. 

So few people realize, that "putting an ATG batsman behind the stumps for 4 hours a day everyday will 'convert' him to wicketkeeping in a few years and we are all good to go" doesnt work in 90%+ cases. 

heck, even 99% cases. 

So they fail to realize, that wicketkeepers, are ALWAYS wicketkeepers first and batsmen second. Below a certain threshold of keeping, a wicketkeeper will NOT be overall net positive for the team, not even if he bats as Don bradman. You are still better off dropping a normal batsman, slotting in this 'Don Bradman-esque with bat, Pappu with gloves keeper' as a specialist bat and then bringing in a satisfactory keeper. 

 

To illustrate: imagine a team, where the top six are Gavaskar, Greenidge, Don, Viv, Tendulkar & Sobers. 

Now, your wicketkeeper choices are : Kamran Akmal, Geriant Jones, Dinesh karthik, Naren Tamhane or Bob Taylor, most cricket managers/selectors would pick the latter two, easily.

This,is just not very well known or understood, which is unfortunate.

 

Edited August 2, 2016 by Muloghonto

[gakgupta]

5 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

Ohhh that Pappu patel terrible keeping in aus still haunts, what an opportunity we missed. 

I think the general understanding among ppl in our country is to make batting strong n thats how we ll win. But no one understand test matches are won by 20 wkts. 

Here is one idiot who had another terrible idea-

 This has to the most idiotic idea. 

 

Coming to Kl Rahul, part time keeper can even back fire in Odi also as pressure can make u drop catches. It happened to Rahul in Ipl to. Take Ind-aus recent t20 series aussie had this part time keeper who did blunders. WK is not easy and its needs years n years of hard work. Uthappa still hasnt learned, Pappu patel n dinesh karthik still chokes under pressure. 

 

well said